1
00:03:18,396 --> 00:03:20,900
I didn't know it was so bad.
2
00:03:21,024 --> 00:03:26,826
A couple of incendiaries, these old
buildings go up like Cellophane.
3
00:03:26,947 --> 00:03:30,410
A wall separates the old section
of Nuremberg from the new.
4
00:03:30,533 --> 00:03:34,840
It goes back to... How far
does it go back, Schmidt?
5
00:03:34,955 --> 00:03:37,458
- 1219, sir.
- 1219.
6
00:03:40,001 --> 00:03:43,714
This is where the Nazi party
held their rallies, isn't it?
7
00:03:43,838 --> 00:03:48,098
They all came here. Hitler,
Goebbels, the whole crew.
8
00:03:48,218 --> 00:03:50,982
Thousands of them,
from all over Germany.
9
00:03:58,937 --> 00:04:01,654
Does he have to blow
that damn horn so much?
10
00:04:01,773 --> 00:04:06,329
It's not necessary to blow
the horn so much, Schmidt.
11
00:04:17,163 --> 00:04:19,334
- You both know your duties?
- Ja.
12
00:04:19,457 --> 00:04:22,672
Well, here we are.
A little bit of old Germany.
13
00:04:22,794 --> 00:04:26,721
- Senator Burkette.
- Captain Byers, this is Judge Haywood.
14
00:04:26,840 --> 00:04:29,260
- Byers here will be your aide.
- My what?
15
00:04:29,384 --> 00:04:33,062
Clerk, general guide, liaison.
Any capacity you wish to use me.
16
00:04:33,179 --> 00:04:35,600
This will be your staff,
Mr and Mrs Halbestadt.
17
00:04:35,724 --> 00:04:37,943
- Hello.
- Good afternoon.
18
00:04:38,059 --> 00:04:40,111
Good afternoon, Your Honour.
19
00:04:40,228 --> 00:04:42,732
- Welcome.
- You've met your driver, Schmidt.
20
00:04:42,856 --> 00:04:45,620
I'm at your service any time
you need me. Day or night.
21
00:04:45,734 --> 00:04:47,027
Thanks.
22
00:04:47,152 --> 00:04:49,738
Let's show him around the
rest of the place. Dan.
23
00:04:49,863 --> 00:04:52,331
We're in the reception room.
24
00:04:53,742 --> 00:04:56,839
Living room. The study is in there.
25
00:04:56,953 --> 00:05:02,007
There are two bedrooms on
this floor, three upstairs.
26
00:05:02,125 --> 00:05:05,922
The furniture is part
antique, part US army.
27
00:05:10,091 --> 00:05:14,980
The piano is showing signs of wear and
tear, but it's a genuine Bechstein.
28
00:05:15,096 --> 00:05:18,062
- Quite a view, isn't it, sir?
- Yes.
29
00:05:19,267 --> 00:05:20,774
Uh...
30
00:05:20,894 --> 00:05:23,824
Senator, I really, really
don't need all this.
31
00:05:23,939 --> 00:05:27,153
When the US government does
something, it does it right.
32
00:05:27,275 --> 00:05:30,787
- Who used to live here?
- An important Nazi general and his wife.
33
00:05:30,904 --> 00:05:33,668
Is there anything else Judge
Haywood ought to know?
34
00:05:33,782 --> 00:05:36,961
- Sir, any questions?
- Yes, yes.
35
00:05:38,036 --> 00:05:40,255
- You're West Point, aren't you?
- Yes.
36
00:05:40,372 --> 00:05:43,469
- What's your first name?
- Harrison. Harry.
37
00:05:43,583 --> 00:05:48,388
Well, Harry, look. I'm not West Point, and
all this formality kind of gets me down.
38
00:05:48,505 --> 00:05:53,179
It puts me ill at ease. You think it would
be too much of an infraction of the rules
39
00:05:53,301 --> 00:05:56,267
if you were to call me
Judge or Dan or something?
40
00:05:56,388 --> 00:06:00,315
OK, Judge. We do all our
shopping at the army commissary.
41
00:06:00,433 --> 00:06:04,444
There isn't enough food at the local
markets. The driver knows where it is.
42
00:06:04,563 --> 00:06:07,576
Here's a copy of the
indictment of the case.
43
00:06:07,691 --> 00:06:10,704
- Thanks.
- I hope you'll be comfortable here, sir.
44
00:06:10,819 --> 00:06:14,580
Captain, I think the whole state of
Maine would be comfortable here.
45
00:06:14,698 --> 00:06:17,581
My office is next to yours,
if you need anything.
46
00:06:17,701 --> 00:06:19,753
- Thank you.
- Senator.
47
00:06:26,543 --> 00:06:31,300
Do you think I need the three servants?
It kind of makes me feel like a damn fool.
48
00:06:31,423 --> 00:06:35,931
Well, it helps them out as well
as you. You see, here they eat.
49
00:06:36,052 --> 00:06:37,345
Oh.
50
00:06:37,470 --> 00:06:40,519
Well, I need three servants.
51
00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:43,358
It's good to have a man of
your stature here, Dan.
52
00:06:43,476 --> 00:06:48,910
Sure. Sure. I was the only man
in America qualified for this job.
53
00:06:49,024 --> 00:06:52,120
You know I wasn't the first
choice, nor even the tenth.
54
00:06:52,235 --> 00:06:54,287
- You know it, I know it.
- What do you mean?
55
00:06:54,404 --> 00:07:00,170
Let's face it. Hitler is gone, Goebbels is
gone, Göring is gone... committed suicide.
56
00:07:00,285 --> 00:07:04,081
Now we're down to judging the
doctors, businessmen and judges.
57
00:07:04,205 --> 00:07:07,883
- Some think they shouldn't be judged.
- So?
58
00:07:08,001 --> 00:07:10,469
It makes for a lack of
candidates for the job.
59
00:07:10,587 --> 00:07:15,178
You had to beat the backwoods of
Maine to come up with a hick like me.
60
00:07:15,300 --> 00:07:19,606
- I hope you're not sorry you came.
- No, I'm not sorry I came.
61
00:07:19,721 --> 00:07:22,651
I just wanted you to know I
know where the body is buried.
62
00:07:22,766 --> 00:07:25,067
No, I think the
trials should go on.
63
00:07:25,185 --> 00:07:29,575
Especially the trials of the German
judges. I hope I'm up to it.
64
00:07:29,689 --> 00:07:31,529
You're up to it.
65
00:07:31,650 --> 00:07:36,905
Well, relax. Enjoy this
place while you can.
66
00:07:37,030 --> 00:07:40,494
- You're gonna be a pretty busy fellow.
- Thanks, Senator.
67
00:07:40,617 --> 00:07:42,918
See you tomorrow, Judge.
68
00:07:43,912 --> 00:07:46,925
Shall we, uh, take these upstairs?
69
00:07:47,040 --> 00:07:49,508
Oh, yes, thank you.
70
00:07:52,254 --> 00:07:56,893
- Here, I can take that one.
- No, let me take it. Please.
71
00:08:32,419 --> 00:08:35,100
Here they come.
72
00:09:05,452 --> 00:09:07,836
The tribunal is now in session.
73
00:09:07,954 --> 00:09:12,426
God bless the United States
and this honourable tribunal.
74
00:09:45,325 --> 00:09:48,042
The tribunal will now
arraign the defendants.
75
00:09:48,161 --> 00:09:53,760
A microphone will be placed in
front of the defendant Emil Hahn.
76
00:09:58,255 --> 00:10:02,727
Emil Hahn, are you represented
by counsel before this tribunal?
77
00:10:07,472 --> 00:10:09,442
Not guilty.
78
00:10:09,558 --> 00:10:12,690
The question was are you
represented by counsel?
79
00:10:17,899 --> 00:10:18,991
I am represented.
80
00:10:19,109 --> 00:10:23,783
How do you plead to the charges and
specifications in the indictment,
81
00:10:23,905 --> 00:10:26,124
guilty or not guilty?
82
00:10:27,993 --> 00:10:30,923
Not guilty on all counts.
83
00:10:31,037 --> 00:10:33,089
Friedrich Hofstetter.
84
00:10:34,541 --> 00:10:37,424
Are you represented by counsel
before this tribunal?
85
00:10:39,379 --> 00:10:43,602
- I am represented.
- How do you plead, guilty or not guilty?
86
00:10:43,717 --> 00:10:46,434
Nicht schuldig.
87
00:10:46,553 --> 00:10:49,234
You may be seated.
88
00:10:52,893 --> 00:10:54,613
Werner Lampe.
89
00:10:59,983 --> 00:11:03,530
Are you represented by counsel
before this tribunal?
90
00:11:03,653 --> 00:11:05,705
Counsel?
91
00:11:09,492 --> 00:11:12,422
Yes, yes, of course,
I am represented.
92
00:11:13,288 --> 00:11:17,429
How do you plead to the
charges, guilty or not guilty?
93
00:11:17,542 --> 00:11:19,512
Nicht schuldig.
94
00:11:19,628 --> 00:11:22,096
You may be seated.
95
00:11:24,132 --> 00:11:26,932
Ernst Janning.
96
00:11:27,052 --> 00:11:32,984
Ernst Janning, are you represented
by counsel before this tribunal?
97
00:11:48,240 --> 00:11:54,255
Ernst Janning, are you represented
by counsel before this tribunal?
98
00:12:04,172 --> 00:12:07,636
I represent the
defendant, Your Honour.
99
00:12:07,759 --> 00:12:10,772
How do you plead to the
charges and specifications
100
00:12:10,887 --> 00:12:16,142
set forth in the indictment against
you, guilty or not guilty?
101
00:12:19,187 --> 00:12:21,951
Your Honour, may
I address the court?
102
00:12:33,994 --> 00:12:37,208
The defendant does not recognise
the authority of this tribunal
103
00:12:37,330 --> 00:12:39,418
and wishes to lodge
a formal protest.
104
00:12:39,541 --> 00:12:42,922
A plea of not guilty
will be entered.
105
00:12:57,726 --> 00:13:01,949
The prosecution will begin
its opening address.
106
00:13:02,314 --> 00:13:04,366
Slow and easy, Junior.
107
00:13:18,371 --> 00:13:23,675
The case is unusual, in that the
defendants are charged with crimes
108
00:13:23,793 --> 00:13:26,558
committed in the name of the law.
109
00:13:27,297 --> 00:13:32,517
These men, together with their
deceased or fugitive colleagues,
110
00:13:32,636 --> 00:13:38,437
are the embodiment of what passed
for justice during the Third Reich.
111
00:13:38,558 --> 00:13:43,945
The defendants served as judges
during the period of the Third Reich.
112
00:13:44,064 --> 00:13:47,694
Therefore you, Your Honours,
as judges on the bench,
113
00:13:47,817 --> 00:13:52,955
will be sitting in judgment
of judges in the dock.
114
00:13:54,741 --> 00:13:56,995
And this is as it should be.
115
00:13:57,118 --> 00:14:03,050
For only a judge knows how much
more a court is than a courtroom.
116
00:14:03,166 --> 00:14:05,966
It is a process and a spirit.
117
00:14:07,045 --> 00:14:09,097
It is the house of law.
118
00:14:11,299 --> 00:14:15,012
The defendants knew this too.
They knew courtrooms well.
119
00:14:15,136 --> 00:14:18,648
They sat in their black robes and
they distorted, they perverted,
120
00:14:18,765 --> 00:14:21,613
they destroyed justice
and law in Germany.
121
00:14:21,726 --> 00:14:25,439
The prosecution will
please watch the light.
122
00:14:25,564 --> 00:14:29,194
- The interpreter cannot follow you.
- I'm sorry, Your Honour.
123
00:14:29,317 --> 00:14:32,580
They distorted, they perverted,
124
00:14:32,696 --> 00:14:36,409
they destroyed justice
and law in Germany.
125
00:14:37,826 --> 00:14:41,088
This in itself is
undoubtedly a great crime.
126
00:14:41,204 --> 00:14:44,467
But the prosecution is not calling
the defendants to account
127
00:14:44,583 --> 00:14:50,384
for violating constitutional guaranties
or withholding due process of law.
128
00:14:50,505 --> 00:14:55,014
The prosecution is calling
them to account for murder,
129
00:14:56,553 --> 00:14:58,973
brutalities,
130
00:14:59,097 --> 00:15:01,517
torture,
131
00:15:01,766 --> 00:15:04,151
atrocities!
132
00:15:04,269 --> 00:15:07,781
They share, with all the
leaders of the Third Reich,
133
00:15:07,898 --> 00:15:11,492
responsibility for the most
malignant, the most calculated,
134
00:15:11,610 --> 00:15:15,916
the most devastating crimes in
the history of all mankind.
135
00:15:16,031 --> 00:15:18,830
They are perhaps more guilty
than some of the others,
136
00:15:18,950 --> 00:15:24,337
for they had attained maturity long
before Hitler's rise to power.
137
00:15:24,456 --> 00:15:29,426
Their minds weren't warped at
an early age by Nazi teachings.
138
00:15:29,544 --> 00:15:34,978
They embraced the ideologies of the
Third Reich as educated adults,
139
00:15:35,091 --> 00:15:39,848
when they, most of all,
should have valued justice.
140
00:15:45,352 --> 00:15:49,991
Here they'll receive the
justice they denied others.
141
00:15:51,524 --> 00:15:56,495
They'll be judged according to the
evidence presented in this courtroom.
142
00:15:56,613 --> 00:15:59,081
The prosecution asks nothing more.
143
00:16:03,203 --> 00:16:06,999
Herr Rolfe will make the opening
statement for the defence.
144
00:16:22,556 --> 00:16:25,273
May it please the tribunal.
145
00:16:27,394 --> 00:16:31,736
It is not only a great honour...
146
00:16:31,856 --> 00:16:33,944
but also a great challenge...
147
00:16:34,067 --> 00:16:36,119
for an advocate...
148
00:16:37,529 --> 00:16:40,626
to aid this tribunal in its task.
149
00:16:42,576 --> 00:16:45,209
The entire civilised world
150
00:16:45,328 --> 00:16:48,425
will follow closely
what we do here.
151
00:16:49,541 --> 00:16:52,638
For this is not an ordinary trial,
152
00:16:52,752 --> 00:16:56,679
by any means of the
accepted parochial sense.
153
00:16:58,258 --> 00:17:00,263
The avowed purpose of this tribunal
154
00:17:00,385 --> 00:17:05,024
is broader than the visiting
of retribution on a few men.
155
00:17:05,140 --> 00:17:11,487
It is dedicated to the reconsecration
of the temple of justice.
156
00:17:11,605 --> 00:17:17,952
It is dedicated to finding a code of justice
the whole world will be responsible to.
157
00:17:21,448 --> 00:17:24,413
How will this code be established?
158
00:17:26,912 --> 00:17:28,964
It will be established
159
00:17:31,917 --> 00:17:39,141
in a clear, honest evaluation of
the responsibility for the crimes
160
00:17:39,257 --> 00:17:43,101
in the indictment stated
by the prosecution.
161
00:17:43,220 --> 00:17:48,653
In the words of the great American
jurist Oliver Wendell Holmes,
162
00:17:48,767 --> 00:17:51,946
"This responsibility will not
be found only in documents
163
00:17:52,062 --> 00:17:55,075
that no one contests or denies."
164
00:17:55,190 --> 00:18:00,363
"it will be found in considerations
of a political or social nature."
165
00:18:00,487 --> 00:18:07,462
"it will be found, most of
all, in the character of men."
166
00:18:09,829 --> 00:18:13,211
What is the character
of Ernst Janning?
167
00:18:14,876 --> 00:18:17,973
Let us examine his
life for a moment.
168
00:18:18,964 --> 00:18:21,432
He was born in 1885.
169
00:18:21,549 --> 00:18:24,349
Received the degree of
Doctor of Law in 1907.
170
00:18:24,469 --> 00:18:27,233
Became a judge in
East Prussia in 1914.
171
00:18:27,347 --> 00:18:30,894
Following World War I, he became
one of the Weimar Republic leaders
172
00:18:31,017 --> 00:18:33,900
and one of the framers of its
democratic constitution.
173
00:18:34,020 --> 00:18:36,738
In subsequent years, he
achieved international fame
174
00:18:36,856 --> 00:18:41,033
not only for his work as a great jurist,
but also as the author of legal textbooks
175
00:18:41,152 --> 00:18:44,082
which are still used in
universities all over the world.
176
00:18:44,197 --> 00:18:48,420
He became Minister of
Justice in Germany in 1935.
177
00:18:49,411 --> 00:18:52,376
If Ernst Janning is
to be found guilty,
178
00:18:52,497 --> 00:18:55,843
certain implications must arise.
179
00:18:56,001 --> 00:18:59,844
A judge does not make the laws.
180
00:19:01,172 --> 00:19:04,934
He carries out the
laws of his country.
181
00:19:05,051 --> 00:19:09,808
The statement "My
country, right or wrong"
182
00:19:10,891 --> 00:19:14,604
was expressed by a great
American patriot.
183
00:19:16,062 --> 00:19:19,360
It is no less true for
a German patriot.
184
00:19:22,444 --> 00:19:26,536
Should Ernst Janning have carried
out the laws of his country?
185
00:19:26,656 --> 00:19:31,128
Or should he have refused to carry
them out and become a traitor?
186
00:19:31,244 --> 00:19:36,001
This is the crux of the issue
at the bottom of this trial.
187
00:19:38,668 --> 00:19:43,473
The defence is as dedicated
to finding responsibility
188
00:19:43,590 --> 00:19:45,642
as is the prosecution.
189
00:19:47,219 --> 00:19:51,644
For it is not only Ernst
Janning who is on trial here.
190
00:19:55,018 --> 00:19:57,272
It is the German people.
191
00:20:00,941 --> 00:20:04,903
The tribunal will recess
until further notification.
192
00:20:37,477 --> 00:20:39,529
Yeah.
193
00:20:42,315 --> 00:20:47,072
If it's all right with you, Byers
can file these briefs later.
194
00:20:47,195 --> 00:20:51,751
It was quite a damning speech
by Colonel Lawson, wasn't it?
195
00:20:51,866 --> 00:20:54,915
I wonder if those men in the
dock can really be responsible
196
00:20:55,036 --> 00:20:57,373
for the things he listed
in the indictment.
197
00:20:57,497 --> 00:20:59,917
I've been here two years,
and after that long
198
00:21:00,041 --> 00:21:04,348
you find that responsibility
is not a cut-and-dried thing.
199
00:21:04,462 --> 00:21:06,598
What are you fellows
up to this weekend?
200
00:21:06,715 --> 00:21:09,051
My wife and I are going to Liége.
201
00:21:09,175 --> 00:21:11,477
There's nothing in Liege.
I've been there.
202
00:21:11,595 --> 00:21:13,564
My son was in the 101 st.
203
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:17,108
He's buried in the American
cemetery outside Liege.
204
00:21:17,225 --> 00:21:19,906
- I'm sorry.
- That's all right.
205
00:21:20,604 --> 00:21:22,858
- See you Monday, Dan.
- Mm.
206
00:21:24,024 --> 00:21:27,286
- Coming my way?
- No, I'm staying here for a moment.
207
00:21:27,402 --> 00:21:29,739
I'm waiting for some
records from Byers.
208
00:21:29,863 --> 00:21:31,915
Right.
209
00:21:53,220 --> 00:21:57,775
- Here are the reports you asked for, sir.
- Thank you.
210
00:21:58,683 --> 00:22:03,440
Captain, do you think you could get me a
copy of the books Ernst Janning wrote?
211
00:22:03,563 --> 00:22:06,695
- There are quite a few of them.
- I'd like all of them.
212
00:22:06,816 --> 00:22:10,613
And also a copy of the Weimar
constitution. Can you get that for me?
213
00:22:10,737 --> 00:22:13,667
- Yes, of course.
- Thank you.
214
00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:20,174
- How long have you been here, Captain?
- Two years.
215
00:22:20,288 --> 00:22:23,136
- Two years, that's a long time.
- Yes, sir.
216
00:22:23,291 --> 00:22:25,343
- Any friends?
- Sure.
217
00:22:27,462 --> 00:22:30,048
- German friends?
- Yes.
218
00:22:31,174 --> 00:22:33,262
- A girl?
- Yes.
219
00:22:34,302 --> 00:22:37,481
Her parents were Nazis, but she
was eight when they came in.
220
00:22:37,597 --> 00:22:40,361
- I didn't ask you that.
- Maybe you were thinking it.
221
00:22:40,475 --> 00:22:42,860
It's natural to think about it.
222
00:22:42,978 --> 00:22:46,655
I thought if anybody was going to
indoctrinate her, it might as well be me.
223
00:22:46,773 --> 00:22:50,570
- Will there be anything else?
- No. I think I'll take a walk around town.
224
00:22:50,694 --> 00:22:53,244
Try the old section for
a beer and a sausage.
225
00:22:53,363 --> 00:22:55,415
Thank you.
226
00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:27,572
Nicht mehr! Nicht mehr!
227
00:24:15,862 --> 00:24:17,914
Auf Wiedersehen, Opa.
228
00:24:24,621 --> 00:24:27,171
- Do you understand English?
- Yes, a little.
229
00:24:27,290 --> 00:24:31,513
- What did she say?
- She said "Goodbye, Grandpa."
230
00:25:20,302 --> 00:25:23,101
Vor uns liegt Deutschland,
231
00:25:23,221 --> 00:25:25,522
in uns marschiert Deutschland,
232
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:28,819
und hinter uns kommt Deutschland.
233
00:25:44,534 --> 00:25:48,794
- Are they treating you all right?
- Yes. They are treating me all right.
234
00:25:48,914 --> 00:25:54,513
We still have some friends who have
contact with the American authorities.
235
00:25:54,628 --> 00:25:59,219
- I can tell them if they are not.
- They're treating me all right.
236
00:26:02,052 --> 00:26:04,104
Doctor Janning...
237
00:26:05,931 --> 00:26:08,434
we are both in an
embarrassing position.
238
00:26:08,558 --> 00:26:10,813
I know you didn't want
me as your counsel.
239
00:26:10,936 --> 00:26:14,317
I know you didn't want anyone.
240
00:26:14,439 --> 00:26:18,580
But I must tell you something.
Will you listen to me?
241
00:26:18,693 --> 00:26:20,034
Yes.
242
00:26:22,864 --> 00:26:28,119
I intend to represent your
case with complete dignity.
243
00:26:28,245 --> 00:26:32,041
There will be no
appeal to sentiment,
244
00:26:32,165 --> 00:26:35,677
there will be no falling
at the mercy of the court.
245
00:26:35,794 --> 00:26:41,726
The game will be played
according to their own rules.
246
00:26:43,551 --> 00:26:49,982
We'll see whether they have the courage
to sit in judgment on a man like you.
247
00:26:50,183 --> 00:26:52,235
The way I see it,
248
00:26:53,645 --> 00:27:00,194
the most important elements in the
case are the sterilisation decrees
249
00:27:00,318 --> 00:27:03,830
and the Feldenstein-Hoffman affair.
250
00:27:07,909 --> 00:27:10,080
Doctor Janning,
251
00:27:10,203 --> 00:27:12,457
I must tell you something.
252
00:27:16,543 --> 00:27:22,095
I admired you since I was
a boy in the university.
253
00:27:23,383 --> 00:27:26,847
It was because I thought I
might be able to achieve
254
00:27:26,970 --> 00:27:29,900
some of the things you have done
255
00:27:30,015 --> 00:27:34,855
that saw me through the war.
256
00:27:37,022 --> 00:27:41,661
You have been somebody to
look up to for all of us.
257
00:27:43,904 --> 00:27:46,288
Is that all, Herr Rolfe?
258
00:27:50,827 --> 00:27:52,879
- Yes.
- Thank you.
259
00:28:03,381 --> 00:28:07,012
Dr Wieck, do you know the
defendant Ernst Janning?
260
00:28:10,388 --> 00:28:12,440
Yes, I know him.
261
00:28:12,557 --> 00:28:15,108
Will you tell us in what capacity?
262
00:28:15,227 --> 00:28:20,696
We served in the Ministry of Justice
together from 1929 till 1935.
263
00:28:20,815 --> 00:28:26,498
- Did you know him before that?
- Yes. He was a law student of mine.
264
00:28:26,613 --> 00:28:28,369
- Did you know him well?
- Yes.
265
00:28:28,490 --> 00:28:30,329
- Was he a protégé of yours?
- Yes.
266
00:28:30,450 --> 00:28:32,751
Why?
267
00:28:32,869 --> 00:28:36,879
He was always a man of
great intelligence.
268
00:28:36,998 --> 00:28:41,839
He was a man born with the
qualities of a great legal mind.
269
00:28:41,962 --> 00:28:45,010
Dr Wieck, would you, uh...
270
00:28:46,091 --> 00:28:49,353
would you tell us, from
your own experience,
271
00:28:49,469 --> 00:28:55,816
the position of the judge in Germany
prior to the advent of Adolf Hitler?
272
00:28:55,934 --> 00:28:59,481
The position of the judge was
one of complete independence.
273
00:28:59,604 --> 00:29:01,075
Mm-hm.
274
00:29:01,189 --> 00:29:05,151
Now would you describe
the contrast, if any,
275
00:29:05,277 --> 00:29:09,156
after the coming to power of
National Socialism in 1933?
276
00:29:09,864 --> 00:29:15,748
Judges became subject to something
outside of objective justice.
277
00:29:15,870 --> 00:29:21,470
They were subject to what was necessary
for the protection of the country.
278
00:29:21,585 --> 00:29:25,511
- Would you explain this, please?
- The first consideration of the judge
279
00:29:25,630 --> 00:29:29,094
became the punishment of
acts against the state,
280
00:29:29,217 --> 00:29:31,898
rather than objective
consideration of the case.
281
00:29:32,762 --> 00:29:35,562
And what other changes were there?
282
00:29:35,682 --> 00:29:39,443
The right to appeal was eliminated.
283
00:29:39,561 --> 00:29:46,074
The Supreme Court of the Reich was
replaced by peoples' and special courts.
284
00:29:47,068 --> 00:29:52,158
The concept of race was made a
legal concept for the first time.
285
00:29:52,616 --> 00:29:55,296
And what was the result of this?
286
00:29:55,452 --> 00:29:57,504
The result?
287
00:29:58,914 --> 00:30:02,627
The result was to hand over
the administration of justice
288
00:30:02,751 --> 00:30:05,598
into the hands of the dictatorship.
289
00:30:05,712 --> 00:30:07,634
- Dr Wieck...
- Colonel Lawson,
290
00:30:07,756 --> 00:30:10,686
I'd like to ask a few questions.
291
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:15,356
Did the judiciary protest these
laws abridging their independence?
292
00:30:15,472 --> 00:30:21,071
A few of them did. Those who did
resigned or were forced to resign.
293
00:30:21,853 --> 00:30:23,905
Others...
294
00:30:24,689 --> 00:30:28,284
adapted themselves to
the new situation.
295
00:30:29,611 --> 00:30:34,665
Do you think the judiciary was
aware of the consequences to come?
296
00:30:34,783 --> 00:30:36,918
At first, perhaps not.
297
00:30:37,035 --> 00:30:42,718
Later it became clear to
anyone who had eyes and ears.
298
00:30:42,832 --> 00:30:44,220
Thank you.
299
00:30:45,543 --> 00:30:50,183
Now, would you please describe for
us the changes in criminal law.
300
00:30:50,966 --> 00:30:57,147
Its characteristic was an ever-increasing
inflation of the death penalty.
301
00:30:57,264 --> 00:31:00,111
Sentences were passed
against defendants
302
00:31:00,225 --> 00:31:06,323
just because they were Poles or
Jews, or politically undesirable.
303
00:31:06,439 --> 00:31:10,366
Novel National Socialist
measures were introduced,
304
00:31:10,485 --> 00:31:16,334
among them sexual sterilisation for
those who were categorised as asocial.
305
00:31:16,449 --> 00:31:23,378
Was it necessary for judges to wear any
distinctive mark on their robes in 1935?
306
00:31:23,498 --> 00:31:26,381
The so-called "Führer's decree"
307
00:31:26,543 --> 00:31:30,600
required judges to wear the insignia
of the swastika on their robes.
308
00:31:30,714 --> 00:31:34,308
- Did you wear such an insignia?
- No.
309
00:31:34,426 --> 00:31:36,478
I would have been
ashamed to wear it.
310
00:31:36,595 --> 00:31:41,150
- Did you resign in 1935?
- Yes, sir.
311
00:31:41,266 --> 00:31:45,193
Did Ernst Janning wear a
swastika on his robe?
312
00:31:48,732 --> 00:31:50,737
Yes.
313
00:31:50,859 --> 00:31:53,623
That's all. Thank you.
314
00:31:57,282 --> 00:31:58,705
Herr Rolfe.
315
00:32:07,500 --> 00:32:09,636
Herr Justizrat Dr Wieck.
316
00:32:10,420 --> 00:32:17,016
You used the phrase "necessary for
the protection of the country."
317
00:32:17,135 --> 00:32:19,686
Would you explain the
conditions in Germany
318
00:32:19,804 --> 00:32:23,103
at the time National
Socialism came to power?
319
00:32:23,225 --> 00:32:25,277
What conditions?
320
00:32:28,188 --> 00:32:30,442
Would you say there was
widespread hunger?
321
00:32:30,565 --> 00:32:31,609
Yes.
322
00:32:31,733 --> 00:32:34,367
Would you say there was
internal disunity?
323
00:32:34,486 --> 00:32:35,743
Yes.
324
00:32:35,862 --> 00:32:38,792
- Was there a Communist Party?
- Yes.
325
00:32:38,907 --> 00:32:41,126
Was it the third largest
party in Germany?
326
00:32:41,243 --> 00:32:43,164
Mm... yes.
327
00:32:43,286 --> 00:32:50,013
Would you say that National Socialism
helped to cure some of these conditions?
328
00:32:51,336 --> 00:32:53,555
Yes, but at a terrible
price, and...
329
00:32:53,672 --> 00:32:58,560
Please, confine yourself to
answering the questions only.
330
00:32:58,677 --> 00:33:02,141
Therefore, was it not possible
that a judge might wear a swastika
331
00:33:02,264 --> 00:33:05,312
and yet work for what he thought
was best for his country?
332
00:33:05,433 --> 00:33:08,316
No. It was not possible.
333
00:33:11,898 --> 00:33:13,950
Dr Wieck,
334
00:33:15,694 --> 00:33:22,788
you were not in the administration
from the years 1935 to 1943,
335
00:33:22,909 --> 00:33:25,626
by your own admission.
336
00:33:25,745 --> 00:33:33,006
Is it not possible that your view of
the administration might be distorted?
337
00:33:33,128 --> 00:33:35,133
No, it is not.
338
00:33:36,214 --> 00:33:41,980
How can you testify about events in the
administration if you were not there?
339
00:33:42,095 --> 00:33:45,061
I had many friends in the
legal administration.
340
00:33:45,181 --> 00:33:48,065
There were journals and books.
341
00:33:49,060 --> 00:33:51,990
From journals and books?
342
00:33:55,775 --> 00:33:57,827
I see.
343
00:33:59,195 --> 00:34:04,000
Dr Wieck, you referred to "novel
National Socialist measures introduced,
344
00:34:04,117 --> 00:34:07,332
among them sexual sterilisation."
345
00:34:07,454 --> 00:34:11,713
Are you aware that sexual sterilisation
was not invented by National Socialism,
346
00:34:11,833 --> 00:34:14,763
but had been advanced for
years before as a weapon
347
00:34:14,878 --> 00:34:18,224
in dealing with the mentally
incompetent and the criminal?
348
00:34:18,340 --> 00:34:20,012
Yes, I am aware of that.
349
00:34:20,133 --> 00:34:24,013
Are you aware it has advocates among
leading citizens in many countries?
350
00:34:24,137 --> 00:34:27,020
I am not an expert on such laws.
351
00:34:28,141 --> 00:34:30,905
Then permit me to read one to you.
352
00:34:33,063 --> 00:34:36,610
This is a High Court opinion
353
00:34:36,733 --> 00:34:41,372
upholding such laws in
existence in another country.
354
00:34:42,906 --> 00:34:44,958
And I quote:
355
00:34:49,371 --> 00:34:52,384
"We have seen more than once
that the public welfare
356
00:34:52,499 --> 00:34:55,216
may call upon their best
citizens for their lives."
357
00:34:55,335 --> 00:34:58,218
"it would be strange indeed
if it could not call upon
358
00:34:58,338 --> 00:35:02,763
those who already sap the strength of
the state for these lesser sacrifices
359
00:35:02,884 --> 00:35:06,313
in order to prevent our being
swamped by incompetence."
360
00:35:06,429 --> 00:35:10,570
"it is better if, instead of waiting to
execute degenerate offspring for crime
361
00:35:10,684 --> 00:35:12,938
or to let them starve
for their imbecility,
362
00:35:13,061 --> 00:35:19,574
society can prevent their propagation
by medical means in the first place."
363
00:35:21,736 --> 00:35:25,747
"Three generations of
imbeciles are enough."
364
00:35:28,243 --> 00:35:32,715
- Do you recognise it now, Dr Wieck?
- No, sir, I don't.
365
00:35:33,707 --> 00:35:37,384
Actually, there is no
particular reason you should,
366
00:35:37,502 --> 00:35:41,429
since the opinion upholds the sterilisation
law in the state of Virginia,
367
00:35:41,548 --> 00:35:43,767
of the United States,
368
00:35:43,883 --> 00:35:46,601
and was written by that
great American jurist
369
00:35:46,720 --> 00:35:52,402
Supreme Court Justice
Oliver Wendell Holmes.
370
00:36:01,860 --> 00:36:04,909
Now, Dr Wieck,
371
00:36:05,739 --> 00:36:08,207
in view of what you
have just learned,
372
00:36:08,325 --> 00:36:13,331
can you still say that sexual sterilisation
was a "novel National Socialist measure"?
373
00:36:13,455 --> 00:36:15,507
Yes, I can say it,
374
00:36:15,624 --> 00:36:22,054
because it was never before used as a
weapon against political opponents.
375
00:36:22,172 --> 00:36:24,224
Do you personally know of a case
376
00:36:24,341 --> 00:36:27,888
where someone was sterilised
for political reasons?
377
00:36:28,011 --> 00:36:31,190
- I know that such things were done.
- That's not the question.
378
00:36:31,306 --> 00:36:35,268
Please answer the question.
Do you know of a case?
379
00:36:35,393 --> 00:36:39,190
I don't know of any specific
case or specific date.
380
00:36:39,314 --> 00:36:43,276
I am asking if you have any first-hand,
personal knowledge of such a case!
381
00:36:44,402 --> 00:36:47,700
No, I have no such
personal knowledge.
382
00:36:47,822 --> 00:36:49,874
Thank you.
383
00:36:58,875 --> 00:37:00,927
Dr Wieck,
384
00:37:05,131 --> 00:37:10,435
you are aware of the charges in the
indictment against Ernst Janning?
385
00:37:16,059 --> 00:37:18,444
Yes, I am.
386
00:37:18,979 --> 00:37:23,404
Can you honestly say he
is responsible for them?
387
00:37:24,609 --> 00:37:26,661
Yes, I can.
388
00:37:27,904 --> 00:37:32,164
Do you consider yourself
free of responsibility?
389
00:37:34,744 --> 00:37:35,918
Yes, I do.
390
00:37:37,831 --> 00:37:44,213
Dr Wieck, did you ever swear to the
Civil Servant Loyalty Oath of 1934?
391
00:37:44,337 --> 00:37:46,841
Your Honour, I object.
392
00:37:46,965 --> 00:37:52,019
The witness doesn't have to answer
that question. He's not on trial.
393
00:37:52,137 --> 00:37:57,107
All Germany is on trial. This tribunal put
it on trial when it indicted Ernst Janning.
394
00:37:57,225 --> 00:38:02,398
If responsibility is to be found, the
widest latitude is to be permitted.
395
00:38:02,522 --> 00:38:04,361
Objection overruled.
396
00:38:05,692 --> 00:38:09,951
Did you ever swear to the Civil
Servant Loyalty Oath of 1934?
397
00:38:12,240 --> 00:38:15,953
- Everyone did.
- We are not interested in everyone.
398
00:38:16,077 --> 00:38:18,628
We are interested in what you did.
399
00:38:18,747 --> 00:38:24,133
Would you read the oath from the
Reich Law Gazette, March 1933.
400
00:38:24,252 --> 00:38:28,642
"I swear that I shall obey the leader of
the German Reich and people, Adolf Hitler,
401
00:38:28,757 --> 00:38:31,936
that I shall be loyal to him,
that I will observe the laws
402
00:38:32,052 --> 00:38:36,892
and that I will conscientiously
fulfil my duties, so help me God."
403
00:38:37,015 --> 00:38:39,067
Everyone swore to it.
404
00:38:40,143 --> 00:38:42,694
It was mandatory.
405
00:38:44,189 --> 00:38:46,443
Yes.
406
00:38:46,566 --> 00:38:52,664
But you're such a perceptive man, Dr
Wieck. You could see what was coming.
407
00:38:52,781 --> 00:38:57,538
You could see that National Socialism
was leading Germany to disaster.
408
00:38:57,661 --> 00:39:00,591
"It was clear to anyone
who had eyes and ears."
409
00:39:02,457 --> 00:39:06,598
Didn't you realise what
it would have meant
410
00:39:06,711 --> 00:39:12,595
if you, and men like you, would
have refused to swear to the oath?
411
00:39:12,717 --> 00:39:18,934
It would have meant that Hitler could
never have come to absolute power!
412
00:39:20,725 --> 00:39:24,866
Why didn't you?
Dr Wieck, why didn't you?
413
00:39:26,273 --> 00:39:29,452
Can you give us an explanation?
414
00:39:29,568 --> 00:39:31,738
Has it something to
do with your pension?
415
00:39:31,861 --> 00:39:34,282
Did it mean more to you
than your country?
416
00:39:34,406 --> 00:39:38,119
Your Honour, I object to the
entire line of questioning
417
00:39:38,243 --> 00:39:40,580
and ask that it be
stricken from the record.
418
00:39:40,704 --> 00:39:43,717
Prosecuting counsel's job
is to find responsibility.
419
00:39:43,832 --> 00:39:45,967
Your Honour, I made an objection.
420
00:39:46,084 --> 00:39:48,801
Prosecution does not want
to find responsibility?
421
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:53,559
There is responsibility for more here
than swearing to a loyalty oath!
422
00:39:53,675 --> 00:39:54,683
There is indeed!
423
00:39:54,801 --> 00:39:57,102
- Order.
- One thing even the German machine,
424
00:39:57,220 --> 00:40:00,732
with its monumental efficiency,
has been unable to destroy!
425
00:40:00,849 --> 00:40:03,233
- Order!
- All the victims!
426
00:40:03,351 --> 00:40:06,733
More victims than the world has
ever known. They will walk in here...
427
00:40:06,855 --> 00:40:09,441
Order! Order!
428
00:40:09,566 --> 00:40:13,956
This tribunal will admonish both
counsels. It will not tolerate this again.
429
00:40:14,070 --> 00:40:17,534
We're not here to listen to such
outbursts, but to serve justice.
430
00:40:17,657 --> 00:40:21,501
- Your Honour, I made an objection.
- The objection is overruled.
431
00:40:23,038 --> 00:40:25,292
The witness is excused.
432
00:40:57,822 --> 00:41:01,085
- Ever read any books by Janning?
- No, I don't think so.
433
00:41:01,201 --> 00:41:04,084
- The Meaning of the Law.
- How is it? Interesting?
434
00:41:04,204 --> 00:41:07,301
All the books by Janning
are interesting.
435
00:41:07,415 --> 00:41:11,128
They're a picture of an era,
its hopes, aspirations.
436
00:41:11,253 --> 00:41:13,637
They weren't very
different from ours.
437
00:41:13,755 --> 00:41:17,349
Listen to this, on the signing
of the Weimar constitution.
438
00:41:17,467 --> 00:41:21,347
"Now we can look forward to a Germany
without guns and bloodshed."
439
00:41:21,471 --> 00:41:25,398
"A Germany of justice, where
men can live instead of die."
440
00:41:25,517 --> 00:41:28,566
"A Germany of purpose, of
freedom, of humanity."
441
00:41:28,687 --> 00:41:30,941
"A Germany that calls
for the best in man."
442
00:41:31,064 --> 00:41:33,199
How could a man who
wrote words like these
443
00:41:33,316 --> 00:41:37,077
be part of sterilisations and murders?
How could he be?
444
00:41:37,195 --> 00:41:41,075
Dan, there are a lot of things that
happened here that nobody understands.
445
00:41:41,199 --> 00:41:43,287
I know.
446
00:41:43,410 --> 00:41:47,337
But the prosecution is going to have
to prove every inch of its allegation
447
00:41:47,455 --> 00:41:51,466
against a man like Janning if I'm
to pronounce sentence on him.
448
00:41:51,585 --> 00:41:53,506
Gentlemen, I'm on my way.
449
00:41:53,628 --> 00:41:55,680
- Coming, Ken?
- Right.
450
00:41:56,548 --> 00:42:00,391
There's just this business on
the curtailment of rights.
451
00:42:00,510 --> 00:42:01,851
Tomorrow.
452
00:42:01,970 --> 00:42:05,517
Dan, my wife is planning a get-together
tomorrow at the Grand Hotel.
453
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:09,104
- She wants you to come.
- All right. Thank you.
454
00:42:09,227 --> 00:42:13,534
And she'd like to provide you with
some kind of female companionship.
455
00:42:13,648 --> 00:42:15,784
She thought you might
be lonely here.
456
00:42:15,901 --> 00:42:18,285
No, thanks, Curtiss.
Thanks very much.
457
00:42:18,403 --> 00:42:20,740
You know how these wives
love to play Cupid.
458
00:42:20,864 --> 00:42:23,248
- I think I'll keep it stag.
- All right.
459
00:42:23,366 --> 00:42:26,296
- How about you, Ken?
- Thanks. My wife and I are busy.
460
00:42:26,411 --> 00:42:29,376
- Good night.
- Good night, Dan.
461
00:42:49,643 --> 00:42:51,979
Mrs Halbestadt, could I...
462
00:42:54,022 --> 00:42:55,694
Hello.
463
00:42:56,524 --> 00:42:58,779
Hello.
464
00:42:58,902 --> 00:43:01,999
Your Honour, this
is Madame Bertholt.
465
00:43:02,113 --> 00:43:04,201
This is His Honour, Judge Haywood.
466
00:43:05,575 --> 00:43:08,423
Madame Bertholt, this is her house.
467
00:43:08,536 --> 00:43:11,502
She came to get some of her
belongings from the basement.
468
00:43:11,623 --> 00:43:16,013
- I didn't know she was coming tonight.
- It's my responsibility, Mrs Halbestadt.
469
00:43:16,127 --> 00:43:21,217
I've stored some of my things here until I
could get a room large enough for them.
470
00:43:21,341 --> 00:43:24,022
- I hope you don't mind.
- No. Not at all.
471
00:43:24,427 --> 00:43:27,441
You can examine what I
have here if you like.
472
00:43:27,556 --> 00:43:30,486
- Of course not.
- Then I'll just take these out.
473
00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:32,985
- Thank you, Mrs Halbestadt.
- Let me help you.
474
00:43:33,103 --> 00:43:36,449
- I can manage.
- I'll just take it outside. Please.
475
00:43:36,565 --> 00:43:38,617
Good night.
476
00:43:51,705 --> 00:43:56,878
It's heavy. It's full of books and pictures
that mean nothing to anyone but me.
477
00:43:57,002 --> 00:43:59,338
- Mr Schmidt!
- Your Honour.
478
00:44:01,131 --> 00:44:04,725
- Would you drive Mrs Bertholt home?
- Yes, Your Honour.
479
00:44:04,843 --> 00:44:07,524
- I hope you're comfortable here.
- Yes, I am. Very.
480
00:44:07,637 --> 00:44:10,141
My favourite spot was
always the garden.
481
00:44:10,265 --> 00:44:13,362
Remind Mr Halbestadt to take
good care of the rock garden.
482
00:44:13,476 --> 00:44:16,573
You'll get a great deal of
pleasure out of it in summer.
483
00:44:16,688 --> 00:44:19,156
I'll sit in front, thank you.
484
00:44:21,234 --> 00:44:22,824
- Good night.
- Good night.
485
00:44:22,944 --> 00:44:26,242
- Karolinenstrasse 115.
- Yes, madam.
486
00:44:46,259 --> 00:44:48,311
Sit down, sit down.
487
00:44:50,388 --> 00:44:53,983
Mrs Halbestadt, you worked for
Mrs Bertholt, didn't you?
488
00:44:55,185 --> 00:44:58,483
- Yes, Your Honour.
- How long did she live here?
489
00:44:59,189 --> 00:45:00,945
Madame Bertholt?
490
00:45:01,066 --> 00:45:05,823
Oh, Madame Bertholt and her family
have lived here for many generations.
491
00:45:07,030 --> 00:45:09,117
Thank you.
492
00:45:10,075 --> 00:45:13,337
Your Honour, you came
in here for something?
493
00:45:13,453 --> 00:45:14,794
Oh! Oh, yeah.
494
00:45:14,913 --> 00:45:17,084
I'm just going to make
myself a sandwich.
495
00:45:17,207 --> 00:45:20,054
We will make it. We will
make you anything you want.
496
00:45:20,168 --> 00:45:22,968
No, it's nothing. I always
did it for myself back home.
497
00:45:23,088 --> 00:45:27,976
What would you like? I have some
ham and cheese and liverwurst.
498
00:45:28,093 --> 00:45:30,145
Cheese will be fine.
499
00:45:31,805 --> 00:45:33,857
That's very kind of you.
500
00:45:41,231 --> 00:45:46,320
Mr Halbestadt, what was it like,
living under National Socialism?
501
00:45:48,321 --> 00:45:53,541
- What was it like?
- Yes. I mean, uh... day-to-day?
502
00:45:53,660 --> 00:45:56,424
I know many people
at home like you.
503
00:45:56,538 --> 00:45:59,635
You're good people. I believe that.
504
00:46:00,750 --> 00:46:03,633
What was it like for you,
living under Hitler?
505
00:46:03,753 --> 00:46:07,680
We were not political. Mr
Halbestadt and I are not political.
506
00:46:07,799 --> 00:46:10,100
- Ein Glas fur die Milch, bitte.
- Ja.
507
00:46:10,302 --> 00:46:16,602
No, but you must have been aware of
some of the events that were going on.
508
00:46:18,518 --> 00:46:20,938
Many things were going
on, Mr Halbestadt.
509
00:46:21,062 --> 00:46:23,482
There were parades.
510
00:46:24,316 --> 00:46:28,159
Hitler and Goebbels
came here every year.
511
00:46:28,778 --> 00:46:30,830
What was it like?
512
00:46:31,364 --> 00:46:34,461
We never attended meetings. Never.
513
00:46:35,368 --> 00:46:38,583
I'm not trying to put you
on trial. I'm just, uh...
514
00:46:38,705 --> 00:46:41,386
I'm just curious. I'd like to know.
515
00:46:41,499 --> 00:46:44,714
- Here's your sandwich, Your Honour.
- Thank you.
516
00:46:44,836 --> 00:46:46,888
You're welcome.
517
00:46:47,005 --> 00:46:49,057
Thank you.
518
00:46:51,635 --> 00:46:56,854
For instance, there was a place called
Dachau not too many miles from here.
519
00:46:56,973 --> 00:47:00,604
Did you ever know what
was going on there?
520
00:47:00,727 --> 00:47:04,321
We knew nothing about it.
Nothing about it.
521
00:47:05,607 --> 00:47:11,124
How can you ask if we
know anything about that?
522
00:47:12,447 --> 00:47:14,748
I'm sorry.
523
00:47:16,159 --> 00:47:19,541
Your Honour, we are
only little people.
524
00:47:21,039 --> 00:47:23,625
We lost a son in the army
525
00:47:24,876 --> 00:47:27,806
and our daughter in the bombing.
526
00:47:29,005 --> 00:47:31,888
During the war we almost starved.
527
00:47:33,093 --> 00:47:35,228
It was terrible for us.
528
00:47:36,555 --> 00:47:38,642
I'm sure it was.
529
00:47:40,267 --> 00:47:44,608
Hitler... Hitler did
some good things.
530
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:49,074
I won't say he didn't
do some good things.
531
00:47:49,192 --> 00:47:53,867
He built the autobahn.
He gave more people work.
532
00:47:54,656 --> 00:47:58,203
We won't say he didn't
do some good things.
533
00:47:59,244 --> 00:48:01,794
But the other things...
534
00:48:02,706 --> 00:48:07,712
The things they say he did to the Jews and
the rest, we knew nothing about that.
535
00:48:07,836 --> 00:48:09,888
Very few Germans did.
536
00:48:12,090 --> 00:48:14,938
And if we did know...
537
00:48:16,052 --> 00:48:18,271
what could we do?
538
00:48:18,388 --> 00:48:20,892
But Mrs Halbestadt
said you didn't know.
539
00:48:26,897 --> 00:48:30,243
Mrs Bertholt, how did
she react to all this?
540
00:48:30,942 --> 00:48:34,454
Ah, Madame Bertholt is a very
fine woman, Your Honour.
541
00:48:34,571 --> 00:48:37,869
I'm sure she is.
What about her husband?
542
00:48:39,868 --> 00:48:42,087
He was in the army.
543
00:48:42,203 --> 00:48:44,256
What happened to him?
544
00:48:45,498 --> 00:48:49,758
He was one of the defendants
in the Malmedy case.
545
00:48:53,006 --> 00:48:57,016
General Bertholt. Karl Bertholt.
546
00:48:58,553 --> 00:49:01,187
He was executed, Your Honour.
547
00:49:02,974 --> 00:49:05,026
Yes, I know that.
548
00:49:08,855 --> 00:49:12,034
The document then states that
the photographer Rudolf Lenz
549
00:49:12,150 --> 00:49:14,701
is requested to present
himself within two weeks
550
00:49:14,819 --> 00:49:20,419
at one of the hospitals mentioned
below for "medical treatment".
551
00:49:21,326 --> 00:49:24,754
Next, prosecution presents
affidavit document no.488,
552
00:49:24,871 --> 00:49:27,837
which concerns the
seamstress Anni Münch.
553
00:49:27,958 --> 00:49:30,093
Document reads as follows:
554
00:49:30,210 --> 00:49:33,556
"District court Frankfurt am
Main has decided the following:
555
00:49:33,672 --> 00:49:37,764
the seamstress Anni Münch, daughter of
Wilhelm Münch, is to be sterilised."
556
00:49:37,884 --> 00:49:40,814
"She is requested to present
herself within two weeks
557
00:49:40,929 --> 00:49:43,432
at one of the hospitals
mentioned below."
558
00:49:43,557 --> 00:49:49,156
"if she does not take herself
voluntarily, she will be taken by force."
559
00:49:49,271 --> 00:49:54,823
Next, document no.449, interrogatories
in the German and English text,
560
00:49:54,943 --> 00:49:57,660
concerning the farmer's
helper Meyer Eichinger.
561
00:49:57,779 --> 00:49:59,831
- Your Honour.
- What?
562
00:50:02,909 --> 00:50:06,753
Defence objects to introduction
of these repetitive documents.
563
00:50:06,871 --> 00:50:09,755
According to the ruling
of the first tribunal,
564
00:50:09,874 --> 00:50:12,010
such documents are
not even admissible
565
00:50:12,127 --> 00:50:17,300
unless supported by independent
evidence of their authenticity.
566
00:50:17,424 --> 00:50:19,096
Objection sustained.
567
00:50:20,677 --> 00:50:23,809
Your Honour, may I ask
the defence a question?
568
00:50:23,930 --> 00:50:25,318
Yes.
569
00:50:25,432 --> 00:50:31,648
Would evidence on sterilisation be
admissible if there were a witness?
570
00:50:40,196 --> 00:50:42,249
- Yes.
- Thank you.
571
00:50:43,408 --> 00:50:47,121
Prosecution calls the
witness Rudolf Petersen.
572
00:51:10,936 --> 00:51:13,486
Will you raise your right hand?
573
00:51:13,605 --> 00:51:15,491
I swear by God the
Almighty and Omniscient
574
00:51:15,607 --> 00:51:19,285
that I will speak the pure truth
and withhold and add nothing.
575
00:51:19,402 --> 00:51:21,454
Yes, I do.
576
00:51:37,921 --> 00:51:41,801
Will you please tell the court your
full name and place of residence.
577
00:51:43,051 --> 00:51:48,438
Rudolf Petersen. Frankfurt am Main.
Gretweg, Nummer sieben.
578
00:51:48,598 --> 00:51:51,149
When were you born, Mr Petersen?
579
00:51:51,268 --> 00:51:53,901
May 20, 1914.
580
00:51:54,020 --> 00:51:57,034
And what is your occupation?
581
00:51:57,148 --> 00:52:00,696
Baker's helper.
I'm a baker's helper.
582
00:52:01,027 --> 00:52:03,578
Are your parents living?
583
00:52:04,447 --> 00:52:06,499
No.
584
00:52:06,658 --> 00:52:09,837
What were the causes
of their deaths?
585
00:52:13,373 --> 00:52:17,169
Mr Petersen, did they
die of natural causes?
586
00:52:17,294 --> 00:52:19,548
Ja, ja. Ja. Natural.
587
00:52:21,214 --> 00:52:26,648
Now, Mr Petersen, what political
party did your father belong to?
588
00:52:26,761 --> 00:52:30,273
Communist. The Communist Party.
589
00:52:30,390 --> 00:52:32,229
Uh-huh.
590
00:52:32,350 --> 00:52:34,770
Now, think back.
591
00:52:36,104 --> 00:52:42,534
Do you remember anything unusual that
happened to you and your family in 1933,
592
00:52:42,652 --> 00:52:45,618
before the Nazis came to power?
593
00:52:45,739 --> 00:52:49,416
I mean anything of
a violent nature.
594
00:52:49,534 --> 00:52:51,835
Ja, ja.
595
00:52:51,953 --> 00:52:54,919
- How old were you at the time?
- 19.
596
00:52:56,166 --> 00:53:00,046
Would you please tell the
court what happened?
597
00:53:00,170 --> 00:53:03,053
Uh... some...
598
00:53:03,173 --> 00:53:06,886
Some SA men broke into
the house, our house,
599
00:53:08,094 --> 00:53:11,891
and they broke the
windows and the door.
600
00:53:13,141 --> 00:53:15,193
They called us traitors
601
00:53:16,102 --> 00:53:21,192
and they tried to...
to beat up my father.
602
00:53:22,108 --> 00:53:24,160
And what happened then?
603
00:53:24,277 --> 00:53:27,456
My brothers and I,
we went to help him.
604
00:53:28,615 --> 00:53:31,249
And there was a fight.
605
00:53:31,368 --> 00:53:35,211
Finally we got them
outside in the street
606
00:53:35,330 --> 00:53:37,667
and we beat them up,
607
00:53:38,124 --> 00:53:41,090
and turned them over to the police.
608
00:53:41,544 --> 00:53:44,724
- Did the police do anything about it?
- No.
609
00:53:44,839 --> 00:53:46,227
Why not?
610
00:53:46,341 --> 00:53:52,522
It was then at the time of
the national elections.
611
00:53:52,639 --> 00:53:56,435
- The National Socialists came to power?
- Ja.
612
00:53:56,560 --> 00:53:58,612
Now, Mr Petersen,
613
00:53:59,396 --> 00:54:05,328
what happened after 1933, after
the Nazis came to power?
614
00:54:06,611 --> 00:54:09,494
I got a job on a farm,
615
00:54:09,614 --> 00:54:14,004
but for the work, to drive
a truck it was necessary.
616
00:54:14,869 --> 00:54:19,378
I went to the city building
to apply for a license.
617
00:54:19,666 --> 00:54:22,086
And what happened there?
618
00:54:22,210 --> 00:54:25,224
They took me to an official.
619
00:54:26,881 --> 00:54:31,390
Did you ever have any dealings
with this official before?
620
00:54:31,511 --> 00:54:37,277
He was one of the men who broke
into our house that night.
621
00:54:38,226 --> 00:54:41,904
What did he say to
your application?
622
00:54:42,022 --> 00:54:46,577
He said an examination
there would have to be.
623
00:54:46,693 --> 00:54:50,074
Where was the examination
to take place?
624
00:54:50,196 --> 00:54:53,708
In the district court of Stuttgart.
625
00:54:53,825 --> 00:54:57,538
Who was the presiding
justice in the court?
626
00:55:00,290 --> 00:55:02,971
Justice Hofstetter.
627
00:55:04,294 --> 00:55:07,806
Now, what happened
in the courtroom?
628
00:55:07,923 --> 00:55:13,641
They asked me my full
name and so forth.
629
00:55:14,554 --> 00:55:16,809
What else did they ask you?
630
00:55:17,599 --> 00:55:23,116
They asked me when Adolf Hitler
and Dr Goebbels were born.
631
00:55:23,230 --> 00:55:25,863
What did you reply?
632
00:55:25,982 --> 00:55:31,285
I told them I didn't know,
and also that I didn't care.
633
00:55:37,244 --> 00:55:40,506
Did they ask you any
more questions?
634
00:55:41,081 --> 00:55:45,589
No. They told me that I would be
hearing from them in ten days.
635
00:55:45,710 --> 00:55:48,047
I see.
636
00:55:48,171 --> 00:55:50,425
Mr Petersen,
637
00:55:51,258 --> 00:55:54,141
I'd like you to look at something.
638
00:56:06,439 --> 00:56:09,572
- Do you recognise it?
- Ja.
639
00:56:09,693 --> 00:56:13,287
Would you please read
it for the tribunal?
640
00:56:14,906 --> 00:56:18,963
"District court of Stuttgart."
641
00:56:19,077 --> 00:56:23,502
"The baker Rudolf Petersen,
born May 20th 1914,
642
00:56:23,623 --> 00:56:27,764
son of railway employee
Hans Petersen,
643
00:56:28,670 --> 00:56:33,807
is to be sterilised."
644
00:56:34,801 --> 00:56:37,387
Would you read the last paragraph?
645
00:56:42,017 --> 00:56:48,743
"It is therefore requested he
present himself within two weeks
646
00:56:48,857 --> 00:56:52,451
to one of the hospitals
mentioned below."
647
00:56:53,361 --> 00:57:00,670
"if he does not betake
himself voluntarily,
648
00:57:02,203 --> 00:57:04,458
he will be taken by force."
649
00:57:08,668 --> 00:57:11,386
Now please read the
signature at the bottom.
650
00:57:14,633 --> 00:57:17,646
"Presiding Justice Hofstetter."
651
00:57:21,640 --> 00:57:24,902
Would you read what is
written below the signature?
652
00:57:25,769 --> 00:57:28,023
- Below?
- Below.
653
00:57:28,980 --> 00:57:34,330
"By authority of Ernst Janning,
654
00:57:36,071 --> 00:57:38,918
Minister of Justice."
655
00:57:41,117 --> 00:57:43,169
Your Honour,
656
00:57:45,497 --> 00:57:49,210
may the defence see the
file of Mr Petersen?
657
00:57:49,960 --> 00:57:53,721
What did you do after you
received the letter, Mr Petersen?
658
00:57:53,838 --> 00:57:58,643
I ran away. I stayed at the
farm of a friend I have.
659
00:57:59,511 --> 00:58:02,228
And did you return?
660
00:58:02,347 --> 00:58:04,434
- Did I what?
- Did you return?
661
00:58:05,016 --> 00:58:06,440
Yes.
662
00:58:06,560 --> 00:58:08,612
And what happened then?
663
00:58:09,604 --> 00:58:13,661
The police came. The police came.
664
00:58:13,775 --> 00:58:19,707
- Where did they take you?
- To the hospital.
665
00:58:20,657 --> 00:58:25,663
Mr Petersen. Excuse me, I wonder if you
could speak a little louder, please.
666
00:58:27,038 --> 00:58:29,090
To the hospital.
667
00:58:29,207 --> 00:58:34,213
- What happened at the hospital?
- They kept me there.
668
00:58:34,337 --> 00:58:37,719
The nurse who was...
669
00:58:39,509 --> 00:58:41,680
Well, she came in anyway.
670
00:58:41,803 --> 00:58:44,935
She was to prepare me
for the operation.
671
00:58:45,056 --> 00:58:49,695
And she said she thought the
whole thing was terrible.
672
00:58:50,645 --> 00:58:57,076
And then the doctor came in,
who was supposed to do the...
673
00:58:59,237 --> 00:59:02,749
and he said he thought
it was awful.
674
00:59:04,534 --> 00:59:07,963
Were you in fact sterilised?
675
00:59:16,755 --> 00:59:19,223
Thank you very much, Mr Petersen.
676
00:59:20,634 --> 00:59:21,927
That's all.
677
00:59:24,221 --> 00:59:26,273
Herr Rolfe.
678
00:59:36,107 --> 00:59:38,159
Mr Petersen,
679
00:59:39,819 --> 00:59:43,995
you may take your earphones
off now, if you want to.
680
00:59:50,247 --> 00:59:55,466
Mr Petersen, you say you work as a
baker's helper? Is that correct?
681
00:59:55,585 --> 00:59:57,637
Yes, that is right.
682
00:59:59,256 --> 01:00:01,676
What other occupations
have you held?
683
01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:04,350
I have worked for my father.
684
01:00:05,303 --> 01:00:09,894
- What did your father do?
- He was a railroad worker.
685
01:00:10,016 --> 01:00:13,030
Yes, but what did he do?
686
01:00:13,144 --> 01:00:22,114
He would raise and lower the barrier
at the crossing for traffic.
687
01:00:25,699 --> 01:00:28,712
And you spoke about your brothers.
688
01:00:28,827 --> 01:00:32,754
- How many brothers do you have?
- Five.
689
01:00:32,872 --> 01:00:35,590
- And sisters?
- Four.
690
01:00:35,709 --> 01:00:38,806
- Then you are a family of ten?
- Yes.
691
01:00:41,131 --> 01:00:44,061
What occupations do
your brothers have?
692
01:00:44,175 --> 01:00:46,560
Labourers.
693
01:00:46,678 --> 01:00:48,730
All labourers?
694
01:00:48,972 --> 01:00:51,024
I see.
695
01:00:51,641 --> 01:00:56,113
Mr Petersen, you said the court at
Stuttgart asked you two questions,
696
01:00:56,229 --> 01:00:58,365
the birth dates of
Hitler and Dr Goebbels.
697
01:00:58,481 --> 01:01:01,827
- Is that correct?
- Yes. Correct.
698
01:01:01,943 --> 01:01:04,079
What else did they ask you?
699
01:01:04,195 --> 01:01:06,414
Uh...
700
01:01:06,531 --> 01:01:09,212
Nothing else.
701
01:01:09,326 --> 01:01:11,378
Are you sure?
702
01:01:11,494 --> 01:01:14,793
Are you sure there were no
questions about your schooling?
703
01:01:14,915 --> 01:01:16,967
Objection!
704
01:01:17,083 --> 01:01:21,010
The witness has already
answered that question.
705
01:01:23,840 --> 01:01:25,892
Objection sustained.
706
01:01:31,181 --> 01:01:34,894
May I ask you, Mr Petersen...
707
01:01:38,647 --> 01:01:40,699
may I ask you...
708
01:01:43,568 --> 01:01:46,072
how long did you attend school?
709
01:01:46,196 --> 01:01:50,502
- Six years.
- Six years. Why not longer?
710
01:01:52,035 --> 01:01:53,874
I had to go to work.
711
01:01:53,995 --> 01:01:59,168
Would you consider yourself a
very bright fellow at school?
712
01:01:59,292 --> 01:02:02,638
School? It was...
713
01:02:02,754 --> 01:02:06,301
It was a long while ago. I don't...
714
01:02:06,424 --> 01:02:09,557
Perhaps you were not able
to keep up with the others
715
01:02:09,678 --> 01:02:11,730
and that's why you
did not continue?
716
01:02:11,846 --> 01:02:13,982
Objection, Your Honour.
717
01:02:14,099 --> 01:02:17,563
The witness' school record has no
bearing on what happened to him.
718
01:02:17,686 --> 01:02:23,320
It was the task of the health court to
sterilise the mentally incompetent.
719
01:02:26,361 --> 01:02:28,413
Objection overruled.
720
01:02:34,452 --> 01:02:40,669
Were you able or were you not
able to keep up with the others?
721
01:02:46,631 --> 01:02:51,057
I would like to refer to the efficiency
report from the school about Mr Petersen.
722
01:02:51,177 --> 01:02:57,275
He failed to be promoted and was placed
in a class of backward children.
723
01:03:00,395 --> 01:03:04,357
You say your parents
died of natural causes.
724
01:03:04,482 --> 01:03:05,775
Yes.
725
01:03:05,901 --> 01:03:09,412
Would you describe in detail the
illness your mother died of?
726
01:03:09,529 --> 01:03:11,581
She died of her heart.
727
01:03:12,699 --> 01:03:17,005
In the last stages of her illness,
did your mother show any...
728
01:03:17,120 --> 01:03:20,050
mental peculiarities?
729
01:03:20,165 --> 01:03:23,427
Mental... No. No.
730
01:03:25,045 --> 01:03:27,299
In the decision that
came from Stuttgart,
731
01:03:27,422 --> 01:03:31,100
it is stated that your mother suffered
from hereditary feeble-mindedness.
732
01:03:31,217 --> 01:03:33,768
That is not... That is not true.
733
01:03:33,887 --> 01:03:35,809
Not true, not true.
734
01:03:37,432 --> 01:03:40,066
Can you give us some
clarification as to how
735
01:03:40,185 --> 01:03:44,147
the Hereditary Health Court in
Stuttgart arrived at that decision?
736
01:03:44,272 --> 01:03:49,160
It was just something they said
to put me on the operating table.
737
01:03:49,277 --> 01:03:51,958
- It was just something they said?
- Yes!
738
01:03:52,864 --> 01:03:59,460
Mr Petersen, there was a simple test
that the Health Court used to ask
739
01:03:59,579 --> 01:04:02,545
in all cases of
mental incompetence.
740
01:04:02,666 --> 01:04:05,798
Since you say they did
not ask you then,
741
01:04:05,919 --> 01:04:08,553
perhaps you can
answer it for us now?
742
01:04:08,672 --> 01:04:12,349
Form a sentence out of the words
"hare", "hunter", "field".
743
01:04:12,467 --> 01:04:14,638
Your Honour! Objection!
744
01:04:19,683 --> 01:04:21,735
Mr Petersen,
745
01:04:23,311 --> 01:04:27,950
was the court in Stuttgart
constituted like this one?
746
01:04:29,067 --> 01:04:31,653
I don't understand what...
747
01:04:31,778 --> 01:04:34,329
Was there an audience?
748
01:04:34,781 --> 01:04:36,869
An audience? Yes, yes.
749
01:04:37,784 --> 01:04:39,836
Thank you.
750
01:04:42,330 --> 01:04:44,382
Objection overruled.
751
01:04:46,126 --> 01:04:51,892
Hare, hunter, field, Mr Petersen.
752
01:04:54,676 --> 01:04:56,728
Take your time.
753
01:04:58,638 --> 01:05:00,975
Hare, hunter, field. Uh...
754
01:05:03,727 --> 01:05:06,230
Hare,
755
01:05:06,354 --> 01:05:08,406
hunter...
756
01:05:10,650 --> 01:05:13,498
They had already made up...
757
01:05:14,529 --> 01:05:17,661
When I walked into the court,
they had made up their minds.
758
01:05:17,782 --> 01:05:20,879
They had made up their minds!
759
01:05:20,994 --> 01:05:24,422
They put me in the
hospital, like a criminal.
760
01:05:24,539 --> 01:05:29,178
I could not say anything,
I could not do anything. I...
761
01:05:30,754 --> 01:05:32,806
I had to lie there.
762
01:05:35,342 --> 01:05:38,106
My... my mother...
763
01:05:39,221 --> 01:05:41,273
what you say about her.
764
01:05:41,389 --> 01:05:45,186
She was a woman, a servant
woman, who worked hard.
765
01:05:45,310 --> 01:05:47,362
She was a hardworking woman.
766
01:05:47,479 --> 01:05:51,275
And it is not fair...
not fair... what you say.
767
01:05:57,197 --> 01:05:59,249
I have it here.
768
01:06:00,325 --> 01:06:04,548
I want to show you.
I have here her picture.
769
01:06:05,372 --> 01:06:08,052
I would like you looked at it.
770
01:06:19,386 --> 01:06:22,103
I would like you to judge.
771
01:06:23,640 --> 01:06:27,697
I want that you tell me,
772
01:06:27,811 --> 01:06:31,405
was she feeble-minded?
773
01:06:32,399 --> 01:06:34,451
My mother!
774
01:06:35,735 --> 01:06:37,787
Was she feeble-minded?
775
01:06:40,365 --> 01:06:42,121
Was she?
776
01:06:52,210 --> 01:06:56,172
I feel it is my duty to
point out to the tribunal
777
01:06:56,298 --> 01:06:59,430
that the witness is not in
control of his mental processes.
778
01:07:00,802 --> 01:07:02,724
I know I'm not.
779
01:07:02,846 --> 01:07:04,898
Since that day,
780
01:07:06,057 --> 01:07:09,854
I've been half I've ever been.
781
01:07:17,527 --> 01:07:21,454
The tribunal does not
know how you were before.
782
01:07:21,573 --> 01:07:26,247
It can never know.
It has only your word.
783
01:07:48,308 --> 01:07:50,360
Court is adjourned.
784
01:08:02,322 --> 01:08:05,003
That's one problem we have
with the prosecution...
785
01:08:05,116 --> 01:08:08,249
it's filled with young
radicals like Lawson.
786
01:08:08,370 --> 01:08:10,754
Is that what Lawson is?
A young radical?
787
01:08:10,872 --> 01:08:13,921
Well, he was a personal
protégé of FDR.
788
01:08:14,042 --> 01:08:17,174
FDR had a few friends who
weren't radicals, didn't he?
789
01:08:17,295 --> 01:08:19,763
Name one.
790
01:08:19,881 --> 01:08:22,645
- Wendell Wilkie.
- Wilkie.
791
01:08:22,759 --> 01:08:25,808
Is he your idea of a conservative?
792
01:08:25,929 --> 01:08:30,022
As a matter of fact, Dan, I've
been wondering how you stand?
793
01:08:30,141 --> 01:08:34,567
I'll clarify that for you, Curtiss.
I'm a rock-ribbed Republican
794
01:08:34,688 --> 01:08:38,034
who thought that Franklin
Roosevelt was a great man.
795
01:08:38,149 --> 01:08:40,653
Oh. One of those.
796
01:08:43,530 --> 01:08:45,452
Max!
797
01:08:45,574 --> 01:08:48,338
- Max Perkins. Do you know him?
- I don't think so.
798
01:08:48,451 --> 01:08:50,788
He's with the United Press.
799
01:08:54,374 --> 01:08:58,515
- Max, what are you doing here?
- I thought you might kick up a row.
800
01:08:58,628 --> 01:09:00,883
I haven't had that much to drink.
801
01:09:01,006 --> 01:09:03,307
- Oh, I'm sorry. This is Judge Ives.
- Hello.
802
01:09:03,425 --> 01:09:05,181
- Mrs Ives.
- How do you do?
803
01:09:05,302 --> 01:09:07,638
- How do you do?
- Judge Haywood, Mrs Bertholt.
804
01:09:07,762 --> 01:09:10,099
- We have met.
- Yes, we have.
805
01:09:10,223 --> 01:09:14,185
- Won't you join us for a drink?
- We would like to very much.
806
01:09:14,311 --> 01:09:17,028
- Max, will you sit here?
- Thank you.
807
01:09:17,147 --> 01:09:21,489
Incidentally, Max, I admired your
article on Mrs Bertholt very much.
808
01:09:21,610 --> 01:09:25,536
It was straight reporting. Her defence
of her husband was quite eloquent.
809
01:09:25,655 --> 01:09:28,040
Are you going to do a
story on these trials?
810
01:09:28,325 --> 01:09:30,661
I'll tell you something
frankly, Judge.
811
01:09:30,785 --> 01:09:34,463
At the moment I couldn't give a
story away on the Nuremberg trials.
812
01:09:34,581 --> 01:09:38,638
- What do you mean, Mr Perkins?
- The American public isn't interested.
813
01:09:38,752 --> 01:09:41,931
The war's only been over
two years, Mr Perkins.
814
01:09:42,047 --> 01:09:43,719
That's right.
815
01:09:43,840 --> 01:09:46,889
- May I take your order?
- Yes. See what the ladies will have.
816
01:09:47,010 --> 01:09:50,356
- How about some more beer, Dan?
- No, I think I've had my fill of beer.
817
01:09:50,472 --> 01:09:52,559
I'd like to try something
else, if I may.
818
01:09:52,682 --> 01:09:57,024
Why don't you try some Sonnenberg
or Schwalbenwinkel? It's the local wine.
819
01:09:57,145 --> 01:09:59,993
- Sonnenberg or...?
- Schwalbenwinkel.
820
01:10:00,106 --> 01:10:04,199
Yes, I think I'd like that.
Some Schwalbenwinkel.
821
01:10:04,319 --> 01:10:06,787
- Will you have some?
- Yes, thank you.
822
01:10:06,905 --> 01:10:09,539
- Shall we stay with the beer, Max?
- Fine.
823
01:10:09,658 --> 01:10:11,460
Thank you.
824
01:10:11,576 --> 01:10:14,874
- You got home all right the other night?
- Yes, thank you.
825
01:10:14,996 --> 01:10:18,793
I don't know what I would
have done without the car.
826
01:10:18,917 --> 01:10:21,634
You speak English very
well, Mrs Bertholt.
827
01:10:21,753 --> 01:10:23,011
Thank you.
828
01:10:23,129 --> 01:10:26,842
My husband and I spent
two years in America.
829
01:10:29,094 --> 01:10:33,234
I hope you've had a chance to
see something of Nuremberg.
830
01:10:33,348 --> 01:10:38,983
I'm afraid mainly the road between
my house and the Palace of Justice.
831
01:10:39,104 --> 01:10:43,529
And then some places that have to do
with the case, historical aspects.
832
01:10:43,650 --> 01:10:48,241
The Nazi aspects. You should see some
of the other parts of Nuremberg.
833
01:10:48,363 --> 01:10:51,661
There are many beautiful things
to see in the old part of town,
834
01:10:51,783 --> 01:10:53,835
museums we're trying to rebuild.
835
01:10:53,952 --> 01:10:58,211
And there's a concert, a piano concert,
next week at the old opera house.
836
01:10:58,331 --> 01:11:02,591
Arthur Reiss. He was a refugee
from Hitler in the early days.
837
01:11:02,711 --> 01:11:06,638
We've persuaded him to come back.
It ought to be quite an evening.
838
01:11:06,756 --> 01:11:11,016
- Would you like to come?
- Yes, I would.
839
01:11:11,136 --> 01:11:15,228
I'll have them leave a ticket for you at
the box office. I'm on the committee.
840
01:11:15,348 --> 01:11:18,066
- Thank you very much, Mrs Bertholt.
- It's nothing.
841
01:11:18,184 --> 01:11:22,064
I have a mission with the Americans,
as Mr Perkins can tell you.
842
01:11:22,188 --> 01:11:24,525
Oh? What is that?
843
01:11:24,649 --> 01:11:28,706
To convince you that
we're not all monsters.
844
01:11:31,781 --> 01:11:35,578
- Good evening, Colonel.
- Colonel, Major Radnitz.
845
01:11:35,702 --> 01:11:38,170
Good evening, Mrs Bertholt.
846
01:11:41,082 --> 01:11:43,419
- I hope you'll excuse me.
- You've just come.
847
01:11:43,543 --> 01:11:45,595
No, I must go. Please excuse me.
848
01:11:45,712 --> 01:11:47,764
It was awfully nice meeting you.
849
01:11:47,881 --> 01:11:50,930
There will be a concert ticket
for you at the box office.
850
01:11:51,051 --> 01:11:52,094
Thank you.
851
01:11:52,219 --> 01:11:53,939
- Good night.
- Good night.
852
01:11:54,054 --> 01:11:56,273
- Good night.
- Good night, Mrs Bertholt.
853
01:11:59,726 --> 01:12:01,696
Huh.
854
01:12:01,811 --> 01:12:06,402
Mrs Bertholt doesn't hold
a burning passion for me.
855
01:12:07,442 --> 01:12:10,123
I prosecuted her husband.
856
01:12:11,112 --> 01:12:14,458
Many people think a death sentence
would not have been passed
857
01:12:14,574 --> 01:12:16,544
against General Bertholt today.
858
01:12:16,660 --> 01:12:19,210
I'm sure they do.
859
01:12:19,329 --> 01:12:21,548
I'm sure there are people who think
860
01:12:21,665 --> 01:12:24,879
all the prisoners in Nuremberg
should be free today.
861
01:12:25,001 --> 01:12:27,053
All of them! Let's...
862
01:12:28,046 --> 01:12:29,802
Excuse me.
863
01:12:29,923 --> 01:12:31,975
I've had, uh...
864
01:12:32,092 --> 01:12:37,525
I've had one or two too many, as might
be painfully obvious to you gentlemen.
865
01:12:37,639 --> 01:12:42,029
The spectacle this afternoon with Mr
Petersen put me off my feed. I'm sorry.
866
01:12:42,143 --> 01:12:46,319
Three beers and
Schwalbenwinkel, please.
867
01:12:50,193 --> 01:12:52,779
Prosit. Prosit.
868
01:12:52,904 --> 01:12:56,582
- Schwalbenwinkel.
- Schwalbenwinkel.
869
01:12:56,700 --> 01:13:01,125
Yes, it's good beer. They
make it good in this country.
870
01:13:01,246 --> 01:13:03,049
You know...
871
01:13:03,164 --> 01:13:07,471
You know, there's one
thing about Americans.
872
01:13:07,586 --> 01:13:10,054
We're not cut out to be occupiers.
873
01:13:10,171 --> 01:13:13,137
We're new at it and we're
not very good at it.
874
01:13:13,258 --> 01:13:16,355
We come over here,
and what do we see?
875
01:13:17,304 --> 01:13:19,688
We see this beautiful country.
876
01:13:19,806 --> 01:13:22,855
It is beautiful.
It's very beautiful.
877
01:13:22,976 --> 01:13:26,025
We see the culture that goes
back for hundreds of years.
878
01:13:26,146 --> 01:13:28,945
We see its gemütlich charm,
879
01:13:29,065 --> 01:13:33,288
and the charm of people
like, uh... Mrs Bertholt.
880
01:13:34,070 --> 01:13:36,788
We got a built-in
inferiority complex.
881
01:13:36,907 --> 01:13:39,706
We forgive and forget easy.
882
01:13:39,826 --> 01:13:45,924
We give the other guy the benefit of
the doubt... that's the American way.
883
01:13:46,041 --> 01:13:51,095
We beat the greatest war machine
since Alexander the Great
884
01:13:51,212 --> 01:13:54,143
and now the boy scouts take over.
885
01:13:55,008 --> 01:13:58,888
The trouble with you, Colonel, is you'd
like to indict the whole country.
886
01:13:59,012 --> 01:14:01,516
That might be emotionally
satisfying to you,
887
01:14:01,640 --> 01:14:05,021
but it wouldn't be exactly
practical, and hardly fair.
888
01:14:06,394 --> 01:14:08,446
Hardly fair?
889
01:14:10,941 --> 01:14:13,277
"Hare",
890
01:14:13,401 --> 01:14:15,786
"hunter",
891
01:14:15,904 --> 01:14:17,956
"field".
892
01:14:18,907 --> 01:14:21,375
That's right, let's be fair.
893
01:14:22,077 --> 01:14:25,624
The hare was shot by the
hunter in the field.
894
01:14:25,747 --> 01:14:28,084
It's really quite simple.
895
01:14:29,584 --> 01:14:31,174
Uh...
896
01:14:31,294 --> 01:14:34,888
Colonel, I think we
ought to be going.
897
01:14:35,006 --> 01:14:37,142
Yes. We shouldn't
be discussing this.
898
01:14:37,259 --> 01:14:41,102
Oh, no, Judge we're fair
Americans, and true blue.
899
01:14:41,221 --> 01:14:43,606
We mustn't do anything
that's out of order.
900
01:14:43,723 --> 01:14:47,235
We can't do anything
that's out of order.
901
01:14:50,146 --> 01:14:54,655
There are no Nazis in Germany.
Didn't you know that, Judge?
902
01:14:54,776 --> 01:14:57,410
The Eskimos invaded
Germany and took over.
903
01:14:57,529 --> 01:15:00,459
That's how all those
terrible things happened.
904
01:15:00,574 --> 01:15:05,711
It wasn't the fault of the Germans,
it was the fault of those damn Eskimos!
905
01:15:07,539 --> 01:15:10,837
Excuse me. Excuse me.
906
01:15:10,959 --> 01:15:14,222
- Good night, Colonel.
- Good night.
907
01:15:27,475 --> 01:15:30,904
Can I have your attention?
Sorry to interrupt your dancing.
908
01:15:31,021 --> 01:15:34,734
The following officers are requested
to report to their units.
909
01:15:34,858 --> 01:15:38,654
Major McCarthy, Major
Citron, Major Cantor,
910
01:15:38,862 --> 01:15:41,365
Captain Byers, Captain Connell,
911
01:15:41,489 --> 01:15:47,291
Captain Douglas, Captain Wolfe,
Major Booth and Major Rice.
912
01:15:47,412 --> 01:15:50,627
Thank you. You can
continue dancing.
913
01:15:53,209 --> 01:15:57,350
- Harry! What is it?
- The Russians are in Czechoslovakia.
914
01:15:57,464 --> 01:16:01,141
Masaryk may have committed suicide.
We're sending some units over.
915
01:16:01,259 --> 01:16:03,395
What do you think will happen?
916
01:16:03,511 --> 01:16:05,564
I don't know, sir.
917
01:16:08,475 --> 01:16:10,562
Oh, Judge Haywood.
918
01:16:12,145 --> 01:16:14,197
Elsa Scheffler.
919
01:16:14,397 --> 01:16:16,449
Guten Abend.
920
01:16:17,609 --> 01:16:19,661
Guten Abend.
921
01:16:22,447 --> 01:16:27,453
"President Truman responded by calling
for an extension of military training."
922
01:16:27,577 --> 01:16:32,168
"He stated that he is deeply concerned
with the survival of the Western nations
923
01:16:32,290 --> 01:16:35,220
in face of the threat
from the east."
924
01:16:35,335 --> 01:16:37,174
"Threat from the east."
925
01:16:37,295 --> 01:16:41,352
Herr Janning, did you hear
what is in the paper?
926
01:16:41,466 --> 01:16:45,808
Exactly what Hitler said: "The clash
for survival between east and west."
927
01:16:45,929 --> 01:16:48,148
Ah, he knew. He knew!
928
01:16:48,265 --> 01:16:52,026
They'll see that we knew exactly
what we were doing all the time.
929
01:16:52,143 --> 01:16:56,403
They cannot call us criminals and at
the same time ask us to help them.
930
01:16:56,523 --> 01:17:01,696
We must stand together now. The most
crucial part of this case is coming up.
931
01:17:01,820 --> 01:17:04,667
We have fallen on happy
times, Herr Hahn.
932
01:17:04,781 --> 01:17:07,035
In the old times it would
have made your day
933
01:17:07,158 --> 01:17:09,460
if I deigned to say
"Good morning" to you.
934
01:17:09,578 --> 01:17:12,081
Now that we are here in
this place together,
935
01:17:12,205 --> 01:17:15,420
you feel obliged to tell me
what to do with my life.
936
01:17:15,542 --> 01:17:17,594
Herr Janning, you
must stand with us.
937
01:17:17,711 --> 01:17:23,393
It is not good for Germans to turn on one
another. We have a common ground now.
938
01:17:23,508 --> 01:17:25,478
Listen to me, Herr Hahn.
939
01:17:25,594 --> 01:17:28,524
Terrible things have
happened to me in my life.
940
01:17:28,638 --> 01:17:30,857
But the worst thing
that has ever happened
941
01:17:30,974 --> 01:17:33,939
is to find myself in the
company of men like you.
942
01:17:34,060 --> 01:17:36,825
I have nothing in common with
you and the party hacks.
943
01:17:36,938 --> 01:17:40,367
You have something in common...
you were part of the same regime.
944
01:17:40,483 --> 01:17:42,987
You stood by that regime,
like the rest of us.
945
01:17:43,111 --> 01:17:46,290
And there is something
else you have in common:
946
01:17:46,406 --> 01:17:48,458
you are a German.
947
01:19:21,710 --> 01:19:26,135
- Good evening. Did you like it?
- Yes, I did. Very much indeed.
948
01:19:26,256 --> 01:19:29,056
- Can I drop you?
- I only live a few blocks from here.
949
01:19:29,175 --> 01:19:32,687
I was going to walk. Would
you like to go for a walk?
950
01:19:32,804 --> 01:19:34,015
Yes. Yes, I would.
951
01:19:34,139 --> 01:19:37,188
I won't need the car now.
I'll walk with Mrs Bertholt.
952
01:19:37,309 --> 01:19:39,361
- Shall I wait for you?
- No, no.
953
01:19:39,477 --> 01:19:42,158
I'll wait for you, Your Honour.
954
01:19:48,153 --> 01:19:51,083
Vor einem großen Tor
955
01:19:51,197 --> 01:19:54,460
Steht' ne Laterne
956
01:19:54,576 --> 01:19:57,673
Und steht sie noch davor
957
01:19:57,787 --> 01:20:03,636
Da wollen wir uns wiederseh'n
958
01:20:03,752 --> 01:20:10,015
Bei der Laterne woll'n wir steh'n
959
01:20:10,133 --> 01:20:15,732
Wie einst Lili Marleen
960
01:20:15,847 --> 01:20:17,650
Wie einst...
961
01:20:17,766 --> 01:20:21,562
The German people love to sing,
no matter what the situation.
962
01:20:21,686 --> 01:20:23,738
I've noticed that.
963
01:20:24,731 --> 01:20:29,619
Do American people sing in
bars, too? I've forgotten.
964
01:20:29,736 --> 01:20:33,248
No. We're apt to be
pretty sullen in bars.
965
01:20:35,492 --> 01:20:41,044
Und alle Leute soll'n es seh'n
966
01:20:41,748 --> 01:20:43,800
Wenn wir...
967
01:20:44,626 --> 01:20:47,556
I wish you understood German.
968
01:20:47,671 --> 01:20:51,099
The words are very beautiful.
Very sad.
969
01:20:52,217 --> 01:20:54,981
Much sadder than the English words.
970
01:20:55,512 --> 01:21:01,396
"The German soldier knows he's going
to lose his girl and his life."
971
01:21:04,813 --> 01:21:06,865
"The lantern burns every night."
972
01:21:06,982 --> 01:21:10,576
"it knows your steps
and the way you walk."
973
01:21:12,529 --> 01:21:17,250
"it burns every night, but
I've been long forgotten."
974
01:21:17,367 --> 01:21:20,131
"Should harm come to me,
975
01:21:20,245 --> 01:21:22,499
who will stand with you
976
01:21:23,248 --> 01:21:28,053
under the lantern with you,
977
01:21:28,169 --> 01:21:30,222
Lili Marleen."
978
01:21:31,464 --> 01:21:36,518
Mit dir Lili Marleen
979
01:21:37,762 --> 01:21:40,443
What is your life like in America?
980
01:21:40,557 --> 01:21:43,855
- Do you have a family?
- Yes, I have a daughter,
981
01:21:43,977 --> 01:21:47,074
- and she has four children.
- Four?
982
01:21:47,188 --> 01:21:51,697
- You must be very proud of them.
- Yes, I am. I admit it.
983
01:21:51,818 --> 01:21:55,780
- And where's your wife?
- She died a few years ago.
984
01:21:55,906 --> 01:21:57,958
Zigaretten?
985
01:21:59,117 --> 01:22:03,459
- How about you? Do you have children?
- No, I don't.
986
01:22:04,205 --> 01:22:07,587
What is your position in America?
It must be important.
987
01:22:07,709 --> 01:22:11,137
No, it isn't really.
I'm a district court judge.
988
01:22:11,254 --> 01:22:13,840
I haven't even been
that for the last year.
989
01:22:13,965 --> 01:22:18,188
- Are you retired?
- Forcibly, by the electorate.
990
01:22:18,303 --> 01:22:21,352
You elect judges in
the United States?
991
01:22:21,473 --> 01:22:25,613
- Yes, in some states.
- I didn't know that.
992
01:22:25,727 --> 01:22:29,191
It's either a virtue or a
defect of our judiciary system.
993
01:22:29,314 --> 01:22:33,573
I thought it was one of the virtues
until last year, when I was defeated.
994
01:22:33,693 --> 01:22:36,956
I'm sure it was the fault of
the electorate, not yours.
995
01:22:37,072 --> 01:22:41,912
There seems to be some difference
of opinion about that.
996
01:22:43,745 --> 01:22:46,758
- This is where I live.
- Here?
997
01:22:46,873 --> 01:22:49,092
Yes. It's not so bad inside.
998
01:22:49,209 --> 01:22:51,759
Would you like to come up?
I could make some coffee.
999
01:22:51,878 --> 01:22:53,930
Yes, thank you.
1000
01:23:11,314 --> 01:23:14,197
Things haven't been very
easy for you, have they?
1001
01:23:14,317 --> 01:23:16,488
I'm not used to them being easy.
1002
01:23:16,611 --> 01:23:19,459
I'm not fragile, Judge Haywood.
1003
01:23:19,573 --> 01:23:21,993
I'm a daughter of the military.
1004
01:23:22,117 --> 01:23:26,293
- You know what that means, don't you?
- No, I'm afraid I don't.
1005
01:23:26,413 --> 01:23:29,296
It means I was taught discipline.
1006
01:23:30,125 --> 01:23:32,296
A very special kind of discipline.
1007
01:23:32,419 --> 01:23:37,010
For instance, as a child we would go for
long rides into the country in the summer.
1008
01:23:37,132 --> 01:23:41,438
But I was never allowed to run to
the lemonade stand with the others.
1009
01:23:41,553 --> 01:23:44,981
I was told "Control your thirst."
1010
01:23:46,016 --> 01:23:48,068
"Control hunger."
1011
01:23:48,935 --> 01:23:50,987
"Control emotion."
1012
01:23:51,104 --> 01:23:53,156
It has served me well.
1013
01:23:54,274 --> 01:23:58,035
And your husband?
Was he of that heritage, too?
1014
01:23:58,153 --> 01:24:02,163
My husband was a soldier. He was
brought up to do one thing...
1015
01:24:02,282 --> 01:24:05,461
to fight in the battle
and fight well.
1016
01:24:07,954 --> 01:24:10,754
- Is the coffee all right?
- Fine, thank you.
1017
01:24:10,874 --> 01:24:13,377
It's ersatz, but I always
try to make it strong.
1018
01:24:13,501 --> 01:24:15,803
It's fine.
1019
01:24:20,717 --> 01:24:22,769
I'm curious.
1020
01:24:24,095 --> 01:24:27,061
What do you think of Ernst Janning?
1021
01:24:28,225 --> 01:24:33,907
Mrs Bertholt, I'm not at liberty to discuss
the case outside of the courtroom.
1022
01:24:34,397 --> 01:24:36,449
Oh, yes. Of course.
1023
01:24:41,029 --> 01:24:45,869
I knew Ernst Janning a little. We
used to attend the same concerts.
1024
01:24:45,992 --> 01:24:49,586
There was a reception given
for Wagner's daughter-in-law.
1025
01:24:49,704 --> 01:24:51,674
Hitler was there.
1026
01:24:51,790 --> 01:24:54,969
Ernst Janning was
there with his wife.
1027
01:24:55,085 --> 01:24:57,220
She was very beautiful.
1028
01:24:57,337 --> 01:24:59,674
Very small, very delicate.
1029
01:24:59,798 --> 01:25:01,933
She's dead now.
1030
01:25:02,592 --> 01:25:04,893
Hitler was quite taken with her.
1031
01:25:05,011 --> 01:25:07,692
He made advances towards
her during the reception.
1032
01:25:07,806 --> 01:25:11,519
He used to do things like
that in a burst of emotion.
1033
01:25:11,643 --> 01:25:15,024
I will never forget the way
Ernst Janning cut him down.
1034
01:25:15,897 --> 01:25:18,448
I don't think anybody did
it to him quite that way.
1035
01:25:18,567 --> 01:25:25,542
He said "Chancellor, I do not object
so much that you are so ill-mannered."
1036
01:25:25,657 --> 01:25:28,872
"I do not object to that so much."
1037
01:25:28,994 --> 01:25:31,711
"I object that you are
such a bourgeois."
1038
01:25:33,039 --> 01:25:37,465
Hitler whitened, stared at
Janning and walked out.
1039
01:25:41,256 --> 01:25:43,759
Is the coffee really all right?
1040
01:25:43,883 --> 01:25:45,936
Fine, thank you.
1041
01:25:48,179 --> 01:25:53,103
Men like Janning, my husband
and I, we hated Hitler.
1042
01:25:53,226 --> 01:25:57,319
I want you to know that.
And he hated us.
1043
01:25:57,439 --> 01:26:00,867
He hated my husband because
he was a real war hero,
1044
01:26:00,984 --> 01:26:03,784
and the little corporal
couldn't tolerate that.
1045
01:26:03,904 --> 01:26:10,120
And he hated him because he married
into nobility, which was my family.
1046
01:26:10,243 --> 01:26:14,466
Hitler was in awe of the
nobility, but he hated it.
1047
01:26:15,457 --> 01:26:19,253
That's why it's so
ironic, what happened.
1048
01:26:23,673 --> 01:26:25,809
You know what happened
to my husband?
1049
01:26:25,926 --> 01:26:27,397
Yes.
1050
01:26:27,510 --> 01:26:31,568
What did he know of the
crimes they cited him for?
1051
01:26:31,681 --> 01:26:35,359
He was placed on trial with
the other military leaders.
1052
01:26:35,477 --> 01:26:41,195
He was part of the revenge the victors
always take on the vanquished.
1053
01:26:41,316 --> 01:26:43,451
It was political murder.
1054
01:26:44,444 --> 01:26:47,659
You can see that, can't you?
1055
01:26:47,781 --> 01:26:51,127
Mrs Bertholt, I don't
know what I see.
1056
01:26:52,577 --> 01:26:57,465
I probably shouldn't be here talking
with you about this at all.
1057
01:26:57,582 --> 01:27:01,509
I want to understand.
I do want to understand.
1058
01:27:02,504 --> 01:27:04,556
I have to.
1059
01:27:17,561 --> 01:27:20,491
Would you like some more coffee?
1060
01:27:20,605 --> 01:27:22,657
Yes, thank you.
1061
01:27:31,533 --> 01:27:33,917
- Hi.
- Hi.
1062
01:27:37,747 --> 01:27:40,084
We found Irene Hoffman.
1063
01:27:41,251 --> 01:27:43,636
- Where?
- Berlin.
1064
01:27:43,753 --> 01:27:45,177
Berlin, eh?
1065
01:27:45,297 --> 01:27:50,267
She got married. Her name is Wallner
now. That's why we couldn't locate her.
1066
01:27:50,385 --> 01:27:53,398
- When is she coming?
- She's not coming.
1067
01:27:53,513 --> 01:27:57,274
- What do you mean, she's not coming?
- She doesn't want to come.
1068
01:27:57,392 --> 01:28:01,864
You know what it's like. None of
them want to testify any more.
1069
01:28:01,980 --> 01:28:07,746
If I catch the midnight, I can get to
Berlin and be back by tomorrow afternoon.
1070
01:28:07,861 --> 01:28:11,242
- Tad, you haven't slept...
- it will be worth it if I can get Hoffman.
1071
01:28:11,364 --> 01:28:14,710
Take over for me in court
in the morning, will you?
1072
01:29:07,087 --> 01:29:11,429
Colonel, please. I have told you
this before when you first came in.
1073
01:29:11,549 --> 01:29:15,393
I say it again now: we are
through with all this.
1074
01:29:15,512 --> 01:29:18,395
She does not have to go.
You have no right to order her to.
1075
01:29:18,682 --> 01:29:23,605
Mr Wallner, I'm not ordering her to go.
I have no authority to do that.
1076
01:29:23,728 --> 01:29:26,861
Do you think we get a medal
for appearing at these trials?
1077
01:29:26,982 --> 01:29:31,407
The people do not like them, they do not
want Germans to testify against Germans.
1078
01:29:31,528 --> 01:29:39,631
I haven't been prosecuting these cases for
the past two years without knowing that.
1079
01:29:45,250 --> 01:29:47,302
It is easy for you to say go.
1080
01:29:47,419 --> 01:29:51,215
After the trials you go back to America,
but we must live with these people.
1081
01:29:51,339 --> 01:29:54,934
Mr Wallner, don't you think
I realise what I'm asking?
1082
01:29:55,051 --> 01:29:57,103
How can you come in
like the Gestapo...
1083
01:29:57,220 --> 01:30:01,147
Because they must not be allowed
to get away with what they did!
1084
01:30:03,101 --> 01:30:07,277
Do you really think they won't
get away with it in the end?
1085
01:30:09,608 --> 01:30:12,076
I say the hell with them
and the hell with you.
1086
01:30:12,193 --> 01:30:14,080
Hugo.
1087
01:30:24,164 --> 01:30:26,845
Emil Hahn will be there?
1088
01:30:28,084 --> 01:30:30,588
Yes. In the dock.
1089
01:30:33,381 --> 01:30:35,433
Ernst Janning?
1090
01:30:37,010 --> 01:30:39,062
Yes.
1091
01:30:48,271 --> 01:30:50,822
You saw the store downstairs.
1092
01:30:53,568 --> 01:30:57,828
It's not much, but it's
a new start for us.
1093
01:31:00,617 --> 01:31:03,582
They will come if I
go to Nuremberg.
1094
01:31:06,248 --> 01:31:10,424
They will come and break
the windows of the store.
1095
01:31:10,543 --> 01:31:13,427
I'll place a guard in front
of the store 24 hours a day.
1096
01:31:13,546 --> 01:31:18,351
- You do not have to go, Irene...
- Irene, you do have to go.
1097
01:31:18,468 --> 01:31:22,561
You have to go for all the people who
can't get on the stand themselves.
1098
01:31:22,681 --> 01:31:26,904
- You do not owe it to anybody, Irene.
- Yes, you do!
1099
01:31:28,436 --> 01:31:32,696
You owe it to one person at least.
1100
01:31:53,086 --> 01:31:55,222
In the night...
1101
01:31:55,338 --> 01:31:57,390
every night...
1102
01:31:58,800 --> 01:32:02,680
we've known somehow it
would come to this.
1103
01:32:18,820 --> 01:32:22,332
Dr Geuter, do you
recognise that headline?
1104
01:32:22,449 --> 01:32:23,706
Yes, sir.
1105
01:32:23,825 --> 01:32:26,376
Would you read it to the tribunal?
1106
01:32:26,494 --> 01:32:28,665
"Death to the race defiler."
1107
01:32:28,788 --> 01:32:33,794
- In what newspaper did it appear?
- Julius Streicher's Der Stürmer.
1108
01:32:34,127 --> 01:32:37,176
What was it in connection with?
1109
01:32:37,297 --> 01:32:39,302
The Feldenstein case.
1110
01:32:39,424 --> 01:32:41,761
What was the Feldenstein case?
1111
01:32:41,885 --> 01:32:46,357
Your Honour! The defence objects to
introduction of the Feldenstein case.
1112
01:32:46,473 --> 01:32:50,234
It is a notorious case, perhaps
the most notorious of the period.
1113
01:32:50,352 --> 01:32:57,114
It has overtones and appeals to emotion
that would perhaps be best not raised.
1114
01:32:58,276 --> 01:33:02,452
There are no issues or overtones that
may not be raised in this courtroom.
1115
01:33:02,572 --> 01:33:09,501
The tribunal is interested in everything
that is relevant. Objection is overruled.
1116
01:33:11,957 --> 01:33:14,425
It's all right. I'll take it.
1117
01:33:17,587 --> 01:33:20,802
- May it please the tribunal?
- You may continue.
1118
01:33:20,924 --> 01:33:22,976
Thank you.
1119
01:33:31,184 --> 01:33:35,444
Now, what was the Feldenstein case?
1120
01:33:36,231 --> 01:33:40,074
The case of a man accused
of racial pollution.
1121
01:33:40,193 --> 01:33:44,250
Will you explain what is
meant by "racial pollution"?
1122
01:33:45,282 --> 01:33:50,454
This is the charge that is
referred to in the Nuremberg laws.
1123
01:33:50,579 --> 01:33:57,044
Any non-Aryan having sexual relations
with an Aryan may be punished by death.
1124
01:33:57,168 --> 01:34:01,807
When did you first become acquainted
with the Feldenstein case?
1125
01:34:02,716 --> 01:34:06,856
In September 1935 I was
contacted by the police.
1126
01:34:06,970 --> 01:34:10,233
They said that Mr
Feldenstein was being held
1127
01:34:10,348 --> 01:34:14,690
and that he requested that
I serve as his counsellor.
1128
01:34:14,811 --> 01:34:17,196
What position did he
hold in the community?
1129
01:34:17,314 --> 01:34:19,994
He was a very well-known merchant.
1130
01:34:20,108 --> 01:34:24,498
He was one of the heads of the
Jewish Congregation in Nuremberg.
1131
01:34:24,613 --> 01:34:28,409
What was the nature of
the charge against him?
1132
01:34:29,200 --> 01:34:32,748
He was accused of having
intimate relations
1133
01:34:32,871 --> 01:34:36,714
with a 16-year-old
girl, Irene Hoffman.
1134
01:34:37,459 --> 01:34:39,962
I see.
1135
01:34:40,086 --> 01:34:44,097
And what did he say to
you about the case?
1136
01:34:44,215 --> 01:34:46,102
He said it was false.
1137
01:34:46,217 --> 01:34:49,148
He said he knew the girl and
her family a long time.
1138
01:34:49,262 --> 01:34:51,599
He'd gone to visit
her since they died.
1139
01:34:51,723 --> 01:34:55,603
But there had never been anything
of the kind charged between them.
1140
01:34:57,604 --> 01:35:02,574
Doctor, would you please tell the
tribunal what happened then?
1141
01:35:03,568 --> 01:35:07,495
He was indicted before the
special court at Nuremberg.
1142
01:35:07,614 --> 01:35:09,951
Where was this special court?
1143
01:35:10,075 --> 01:35:14,879
It was right here. This building.
This very courtroom.
1144
01:35:14,996 --> 01:35:20,845
Dr Geuter, what were the
circumstances surrounding the trial?
1145
01:35:22,796 --> 01:35:27,933
It was used as a showplace
for National Socialism.
1146
01:35:29,219 --> 01:35:35,566
It was the time of the September
celebrations, the Nuremberg rallies.
1147
01:35:35,684 --> 01:35:38,448
The courtroom was crowded.
1148
01:35:38,562 --> 01:35:41,741
Back there, people
were standing up.
1149
01:35:42,732 --> 01:35:46,992
Julius Streicher was sitting
in one of the front seats.
1150
01:35:47,112 --> 01:35:51,335
And high officials of the
Nazi party were all over.
1151
01:35:51,449 --> 01:35:55,293
Doctor, would you please tell us
1152
01:35:55,412 --> 01:35:59,635
what were your expectations for
the trial in this climate?
1153
01:35:59,749 --> 01:36:02,169
I expected the worst
1154
01:36:02,294 --> 01:36:07,680
when I saw that Emil Hahn
was the public prosecutor.
1155
01:36:08,383 --> 01:36:10,435
He was a fanatic.
1156
01:36:10,552 --> 01:36:15,725
His trials were always
marked by extreme brutality.
1157
01:36:18,310 --> 01:36:23,233
But I had one hope for the outcome,
1158
01:36:25,734 --> 01:36:31,084
because sitting on the judge's
bench was Ernst Janning.
1159
01:36:32,449 --> 01:36:36,411
His reputation was known
throughout Germany.
1160
01:36:36,536 --> 01:36:41,626
He was known to have dedicated
his life to justice,
1161
01:36:41,750 --> 01:36:44,170
to the concept of justice.
1162
01:36:47,380 --> 01:36:49,432
Thank you. That's all.
1163
01:36:52,427 --> 01:36:54,479
Any questions?
1164
01:36:55,889 --> 01:36:58,108
Thank you. No questions.
1165
01:36:58,225 --> 01:37:00,277
The witness is excused.
1166
01:37:01,645 --> 01:37:07,327
The prosecution calls to the
stand Irene Hoffman Wallner.
1167
01:37:31,466 --> 01:37:34,017
Will you raise your right hand?
1168
01:37:34,135 --> 01:37:36,022
I swear by God the
Almighty and Omniscient
1169
01:37:36,137 --> 01:37:39,270
that I will speak the pure truth
and withhold and add nothing.
1170
01:37:39,391 --> 01:37:41,443
I do.
1171
01:37:45,397 --> 01:37:48,611
Will you please state your
name to the tribunal?
1172
01:37:51,570 --> 01:37:54,203
Irene Hoffman Wallner.
1173
01:37:54,322 --> 01:37:59,875
Mrs Wallner, did you
know Lehman Feldenstein?
1174
01:38:00,495 --> 01:38:01,836
Yes.
1175
01:38:01,955 --> 01:38:04,589
When did you first meet him?
1176
01:38:04,708 --> 01:38:11,220
It was 1925 or 1926.
I am not sure exactly.
1177
01:38:11,756 --> 01:38:16,146
- How old was he at this time?
- He was in his fifties.
1178
01:38:16,261 --> 01:38:19,855
And how old was he at
the time of his arrest?
1179
01:38:21,141 --> 01:38:25,151
- He was 65.
- I see.
1180
01:38:26,396 --> 01:38:29,160
What was the nature
of your relationship?
1181
01:38:31,109 --> 01:38:33,161
We were friends.
1182
01:38:33,945 --> 01:38:37,160
Did you continue to see him
after your parents died?
1183
01:38:37,282 --> 01:38:40,829
- Yes.
- Why?
1184
01:38:40,952 --> 01:38:47,335
We were friends. He owned the
building that I lived in.
1185
01:38:48,209 --> 01:38:51,472
His business took him
there quite often.
1186
01:38:52,464 --> 01:38:55,845
Now, what did you say to the police
1187
01:38:55,967 --> 01:39:00,772
when they questioned you about
having intimate relations with him?
1188
01:39:02,057 --> 01:39:05,355
I told them it was a lie.
1189
01:39:05,477 --> 01:39:08,276
Could you tell me who the
public prosecutor was?
1190
01:39:12,317 --> 01:39:14,903
Emil Hahn.
1191
01:39:15,028 --> 01:39:19,453
- Did Emil Hahn question you?
- Yes.
1192
01:39:19,574 --> 01:39:21,626
What did he say to you?
1193
01:39:23,745 --> 01:39:28,466
He... took me into a separate room
1194
01:39:28,583 --> 01:39:31,715
where we were alone.
1195
01:39:31,836 --> 01:39:37,353
He told me that it was no
use to repeat my story
1196
01:39:38,385 --> 01:39:41,315
because no one would believe me.
1197
01:39:42,639 --> 01:39:45,902
That there had been
race defilement,
1198
01:39:46,017 --> 01:39:50,858
and the only pardon for this
was to kill the violator.
1199
01:39:52,524 --> 01:39:59,950
He told me that if I
protected Mr Feldenstein,
1200
01:40:00,907 --> 01:40:04,964
that I would be held under
arrest for perjury.
1201
01:40:05,912 --> 01:40:08,332
What did you reply to him?
1202
01:40:08,456 --> 01:40:13,178
I told him what I had
said, again and again.
1203
01:40:13,295 --> 01:40:17,518
I told him that I could
not say anything else,
1204
01:40:17,632 --> 01:40:22,307
I could not lie about someone
who had been so kind to me.
1205
01:40:22,429 --> 01:40:25,228
Were you held under arrest?
1206
01:40:26,224 --> 01:40:27,945
Yes.
1207
01:40:28,894 --> 01:40:30,946
Mrs Wallner, tell us,
1208
01:40:32,147 --> 01:40:38,957
what was the manner in which Emil
Hahn conducted the prosecution?
1209
01:40:40,238 --> 01:40:45,791
He made a mockery
1210
01:40:45,911 --> 01:40:51,593
of everything Mr Feldenstein
tried to say in his own defence.
1211
01:40:51,708 --> 01:40:57,177
He held him up to ridicule
whenever possible.
1212
01:40:57,797 --> 01:41:00,681
What was the reaction
of the audience?
1213
01:41:01,426 --> 01:41:05,768
They laughed again and again.
1214
01:41:07,265 --> 01:41:10,943
How long did the trial last?
1215
01:41:12,604 --> 01:41:15,072
Mrs Wallner?
1216
01:41:15,440 --> 01:41:17,777
How long did the trial last?
1217
01:41:19,861 --> 01:41:20,988
Two days.
1218
01:41:21,112 --> 01:41:24,956
Was the verdict passed at
the end of the second day?
1219
01:41:25,075 --> 01:41:26,083
Yes.
1220
01:41:26,201 --> 01:41:29,962
- What was the verdict?
- Guilty.
1221
01:41:30,080 --> 01:41:32,714
And what was the sentence?
1222
01:41:34,292 --> 01:41:39,382
Mr Feldenstein was
sentenced to be executed.
1223
01:41:41,007 --> 01:41:45,598
I was sentenced to be in prison
for two years for perjury.
1224
01:41:48,181 --> 01:41:51,859
Who was the presiding judge?
1225
01:41:53,270 --> 01:41:55,322
Ernst Janning.
1226
01:41:56,481 --> 01:41:59,245
Were the sentences carried out?
1227
01:42:04,906 --> 01:42:08,418
Thank you very much, Mrs Wallner.
That's all.
1228
01:42:13,957 --> 01:42:16,009
Any questions?
1229
01:42:28,013 --> 01:42:34,313
Your Honour, I would like to request
that the witness be kept available.
1230
01:42:34,436 --> 01:42:37,864
We will present further evidence
on the Feldenstein matter
1231
01:42:37,981 --> 01:42:41,362
when it comes time for the
defence to present its case.
1232
01:42:44,404 --> 01:42:48,580
The witness will please
hold herself so available.
1233
01:42:48,700 --> 01:42:51,120
You may go. You're excused now.
1234
01:43:13,642 --> 01:43:15,694
Colonel Lawson.
1235
01:43:20,398 --> 01:43:25,867
Your Honours, I offer in evidence
a decree, signed by Adolf Hitler,
1236
01:43:25,987 --> 01:43:29,998
directing that all persons accused
or suspected of disloyalty
1237
01:43:30,116 --> 01:43:32,204
or resistance of any sort
1238
01:43:32,327 --> 01:43:34,712
might be arrested secretly,
1239
01:43:34,829 --> 01:43:39,052
with no notice to friends or relatives,
without any trial whatsoever,
1240
01:43:39,167 --> 01:43:42,015
and put into concentration camps.
1241
01:43:42,128 --> 01:43:46,850
I also offer a group of orders
issued under that decree,
1242
01:43:46,967 --> 01:43:50,430
each one signed by one
of the defendants,
1243
01:43:50,554 --> 01:43:52,689
by which hundreds of
persons were arrested
1244
01:43:52,806 --> 01:43:55,653
and placed in concentration camps.
1245
01:43:55,767 --> 01:43:59,314
Signed by Friedrich Hofstetter,
1246
01:43:59,437 --> 01:44:01,489
Werner Lampe,
1247
01:44:02,649 --> 01:44:04,701
Emil Hahn,
1248
01:44:05,569 --> 01:44:07,621
Ernst Janning.
1249
01:44:09,739 --> 01:44:14,995
Your Honours, the defendants
on trial here today
1250
01:44:15,120 --> 01:44:19,925
did not personally administer
the concentration camps.
1251
01:44:20,041 --> 01:44:23,007
They never had to beat victims,
1252
01:44:23,128 --> 01:44:26,889
or pull the lever that released
gas into the chambers.
1253
01:44:27,966 --> 01:44:32,640
But as the documents we have
introduced into this case have shown,
1254
01:44:32,762 --> 01:44:37,022
these defendants fashioned
and executed laws,
1255
01:44:37,142 --> 01:44:39,526
and rendered judgments
1256
01:44:41,271 --> 01:44:46,444
which sent millions of victims
to their destinations.
1257
01:44:46,568 --> 01:44:48,822
Major Radnitz.
1258
01:44:50,155 --> 01:44:54,876
Your Honours, I would like to request that
Colonel Lawson be sworn in as a witness.
1259
01:44:54,993 --> 01:44:57,045
- Granted.
- Thank you.
1260
01:45:03,126 --> 01:45:04,763
Will you raise your right hand?
1261
01:45:04,878 --> 01:45:06,717
I swear by God the
Almighty and Omniscient
1262
01:45:06,838 --> 01:45:09,602
that I will speak the pure truth
and withhold and add nothing.
1263
01:45:09,716 --> 01:45:11,768
I do.
1264
01:45:14,012 --> 01:45:18,437
Were you active in the United States
army in 1945 at the close of the war?
1265
01:45:18,558 --> 01:45:20,195
Yes, I was.
1266
01:45:20,310 --> 01:45:24,023
Were you in command of troops
liberating concentration camps?
1267
01:45:24,147 --> 01:45:25,820
I was.
1268
01:45:25,941 --> 01:45:29,820
- Were you in Dachau and Belsen?
- Yes.
1269
01:45:29,945 --> 01:45:33,124
Were you present when the films
we are about to see were taken?
1270
01:45:33,240 --> 01:45:35,292
Yes, I was.
1271
01:46:02,727 --> 01:46:04,448
OK.
1272
01:46:12,362 --> 01:46:17,617
The map shows the number of and
location of concentration camps
1273
01:46:18,743 --> 01:46:20,795
under the Third Reich.
1274
01:46:22,080 --> 01:46:27,763
Buchenwald concentration
camp was founded in 1933.
1275
01:46:29,462 --> 01:46:32,559
Its inmates numbered about 80,000.
1276
01:46:34,968 --> 01:46:37,471
There was a motto at Buchenwald:
1277
01:46:37,971 --> 01:46:40,023
"Break the body,
1278
01:46:42,183 --> 01:46:44,817
break the spirit,
1279
01:46:46,897 --> 01:46:49,614
break the heart."
1280
01:46:50,942 --> 01:46:53,327
The ovens at Buchenwald,
1281
01:46:54,654 --> 01:46:59,708
evidence of last-minute
efforts to dispose of bodies.
1282
01:46:59,826 --> 01:47:04,417
The stoves were manufactured
by a well-known company
1283
01:47:04,539 --> 01:47:09,296
which also specialised
in baking ovens.
1284
01:47:09,419 --> 01:47:12,765
The name of the firm
is clearly inscribed.
1285
01:47:12,881 --> 01:47:16,761
An exhibit of by-products
of Buchenwald,
1286
01:47:17,677 --> 01:47:22,933
displayed for the local
townspeople by an Allied officer.
1287
01:47:23,391 --> 01:47:25,527
Brushes of every description.
1288
01:47:25,644 --> 01:47:29,357
Shoes... adults' and children's.
1289
01:47:30,607 --> 01:47:32,694
Spectacles.
1290
01:47:32,817 --> 01:47:34,905
Gold from teeth, melted down,
1291
01:47:35,028 --> 01:47:40,462
sent once a month to the medical
department of the Waffen SS.
1292
01:47:40,575 --> 01:47:43,790
A lampshade made from human skin.
1293
01:47:46,206 --> 01:47:48,887
Skin being used for paintings,
1294
01:47:50,502 --> 01:47:53,183
many having an obscene nature.
1295
01:47:54,589 --> 01:47:57,722
The heads of two Polish labourers,
1296
01:47:58,760 --> 01:48:02,473
shrunken to one-fifth
their normal size.
1297
01:48:02,597 --> 01:48:06,441
A human pelvis used as an ashtray.
1298
01:48:10,605 --> 01:48:16,905
Children who had been tattooed to
mark them for eventual extermination.
1299
01:48:19,322 --> 01:48:22,870
Sometimes mercy was
shown to the children.
1300
01:48:23,577 --> 01:48:25,961
They were injected with morphia
1301
01:48:26,079 --> 01:48:29,673
so they'd be unconscious
when hanged.
1302
01:48:29,833 --> 01:48:34,424
One of the doctors described how they'd
then place ropes around their necks,
1303
01:48:34,546 --> 01:48:37,049
and in the doctor's own words:
1304
01:48:37,173 --> 01:48:43,390
"Like pictures, they were then
hanged by hooks on the walls."
1305
01:48:47,267 --> 01:48:50,945
The bodies of those who
had come in boxcars,
1306
01:48:51,062 --> 01:48:53,743
without food and without air,
1307
01:48:53,857 --> 01:48:58,163
who hadn't survived the
journey to Dachau.
1308
01:48:58,278 --> 01:49:00,959
Hundreds of inmates were
used as human guinea pigs
1309
01:49:01,072 --> 01:49:04,833
for atrocious medical experiments.
1310
01:49:06,995 --> 01:49:12,879
A witness at an execution at Dachau
gave the following description:
1311
01:49:14,002 --> 01:49:17,265
"inmates were made to leave
their clothing on a rack."
1312
01:49:17,839 --> 01:49:21,470
"They were told they were
going to take baths."
1313
01:49:21,593 --> 01:49:24,606
"Then the doors were locked."
1314
01:49:24,721 --> 01:49:30,439
"Tins of Zyklon B were released through
the specially constructed apertures."
1315
01:49:32,270 --> 01:49:37,241
"You could hear the groaning
and the whimpering inside."
1316
01:49:37,400 --> 01:49:41,707
"After two or three
minutes, all was quiet."
1317
01:49:50,038 --> 01:49:55,840
Death transports that had arrived
included 90,000 from Slovakia,
1318
01:49:57,712 --> 01:50:00,477
65,000 from Greece,
1319
01:50:01,633 --> 01:50:04,053
11,000 from France,
1320
01:50:06,638 --> 01:50:08,892
90,000 from Holland,
1321
01:50:11,643 --> 01:50:13,980
400,000 from Hungary,
1322
01:50:16,606 --> 01:50:20,200
250,000 from Poland
and Upper Silesia,
1323
01:50:22,237 --> 01:50:25,167
and 100,000 from Germany.
1324
01:50:28,618 --> 01:50:30,670
And this is what was filmed
1325
01:50:30,787 --> 01:50:34,844
when British troops liberated
Belsen concentration camp.
1326
01:50:39,170 --> 01:50:43,892
For sanitary reasons a British
bulldozer had to bury the bodies
1327
01:50:44,009 --> 01:50:46,061
as quickly as possible.
1328
01:50:52,684 --> 01:50:55,152
Who were the bodies?
1329
01:50:56,479 --> 01:51:00,406
Members of every occupied
country of Europe.
1330
01:51:01,526 --> 01:51:06,995
Two-thirds of the Jews
of Europe... exterminated.
1331
01:51:08,700 --> 01:51:10,752
More than six million,
1332
01:51:12,078 --> 01:51:16,669
according to reports from
the Nazis' own figures.
1333
01:51:20,253 --> 01:51:22,305
But the real figure...
1334
01:51:27,302 --> 01:51:29,354
no one knows.
1335
01:51:36,102 --> 01:51:40,243
How dare they show us
those films? How dare they?
1336
01:51:40,899 --> 01:51:44,493
We are not executioners!
We are judges.
1337
01:51:44,611 --> 01:51:47,992
You do not think it was
like that, do you?
1338
01:51:49,699 --> 01:51:53,412
There were executions, yes,
but nothing like that.
1339
01:51:53,536 --> 01:51:55,589
Nothing at all!
1340
01:52:01,544 --> 01:52:03,182
Pohl!
1341
01:52:03,630 --> 01:52:05,682
Pohl!
1342
01:52:07,467 --> 01:52:12,106
You ran those concentration
camps, you and Eichmann.
1343
01:52:12,931 --> 01:52:16,395
They say we killed
millions of people.
1344
01:52:16,518 --> 01:52:18,487
Millions of people!
1345
01:52:18,603 --> 01:52:21,451
How could it be possible?
1346
01:52:21,565 --> 01:52:25,408
Tell them!
How could it be possible?
1347
01:52:28,446 --> 01:52:30,498
It's possible.
1348
01:52:31,449 --> 01:52:33,419
How?
1349
01:52:33,535 --> 01:52:35,587
You mean technically?
1350
01:52:37,455 --> 01:52:40,220
It all depends on your facilities.
1351
01:52:40,333 --> 01:52:44,759
Say you have two chambers that
accommodate 2,000 people apiece.
1352
01:52:44,879 --> 01:52:47,050
Figure it out.
1353
01:52:47,173 --> 01:52:51,765
It's possible to get rid
of 10,000 in a half hour.
1354
01:52:51,887 --> 01:52:54,604
You don't even need
guards to do it.
1355
01:52:54,723 --> 01:52:57,736
You can tell them they are
going to take a shower,
1356
01:52:57,851 --> 01:53:02,074
and then instead of the
water, you tum on the gas.
1357
01:53:02,772 --> 01:53:08,123
It's not the killing that is the problem.
It's disposing of the bodies.
1358
01:53:08,236 --> 01:53:10,288
That's the problem.
1359
01:53:17,996 --> 01:53:21,259
Das ist schön
1360
01:53:21,374 --> 01:53:23,344
Wunderschön
1361
01:53:23,460 --> 01:53:25,512
Das tut gut
1362
01:53:25,629 --> 01:53:32,094
Was man alles im Liebesrausch tut
1363
01:53:32,469 --> 01:53:38,235
Und zur Nacht fliegt
ein flüsterndes Fleh'n
1364
01:53:38,350 --> 01:53:45,776
"ach verweile,
du bist ja so schön"
1365
01:53:45,982 --> 01:53:51,866
Doch die Liebe bleibt
nur, wo sie ist
1366
01:53:51,988 --> 01:53:58,798
Wenn man immer aufs neue sich küsst
1367
01:53:58,912 --> 01:54:00,383
Und so lebt...
1368
01:54:00,497 --> 01:54:02,833
- I'm sorry I'm late.
- That's all right.
1369
01:54:02,958 --> 01:54:07,383
I was doing some work for
the rebuilding committee.
1370
01:54:08,338 --> 01:54:12,929
I brought you some folders so we can
decide what you should see next.
1371
01:54:13,051 --> 01:54:16,479
There's the Albrecht Durer house.
And the museum.
1372
01:54:16,596 --> 01:54:20,309
- When do you think you could make it?
- Any time.
1373
01:54:20,433 --> 01:54:24,942
- Would you like to order now?
- Can I help you with the menu?
1374
01:54:25,063 --> 01:54:27,613
I don't think I'll have
anything, thank you.
1375
01:54:27,732 --> 01:54:30,034
A glass of Moselle, please.
1376
01:54:30,151 --> 01:54:32,203
Moselle.
1377
01:54:34,739 --> 01:54:36,791
What is the matter?
1378
01:54:36,908 --> 01:54:40,502
Nothing. I'm just not
hungry, that's all.
1379
01:54:47,335 --> 01:54:49,387
You know...
1380
01:54:50,922 --> 01:54:54,185
the last few days have
meant a great deal to me.
1381
01:54:54,301 --> 01:54:56,306
How?
1382
01:54:56,428 --> 01:55:01,482
I don't think you realise what
a provincial man I really am.
1383
01:55:02,183 --> 01:55:06,360
I've been abroad just
exactly once before this.
1384
01:55:06,479 --> 01:55:09,197
That was when I was a
doughboy in World War I.
1385
01:55:09,316 --> 01:55:13,408
I used to pass places like this
and wonder what they were like.
1386
01:55:13,528 --> 01:55:16,743
- They've meant a great deal to me, too.
- How?
1387
01:55:16,865 --> 01:55:20,079
They gave me back the feeling
I had of the Americans.
1388
01:55:20,201 --> 01:55:24,627
The feeling I used to have
when I was in your country.
1389
01:55:27,500 --> 01:55:29,921
It's too bad this isn't
a magazine story.
1390
01:55:30,045 --> 01:55:31,088
Why?
1391
01:55:31,212 --> 01:55:35,721
If it were, two people like us,
the rapidly ageing jurist...
1392
01:55:35,842 --> 01:55:37,313
Oh, no.
1393
01:55:37,427 --> 01:55:41,058
The rapidly ageing jurist
and the beautiful widow
1394
01:55:41,181 --> 01:55:48,026
would transcend their difficulties and
travel places either by land or by sea.
1395
01:56:02,118 --> 01:56:04,289
I saw Mr Perkins today.
1396
01:56:04,412 --> 01:56:08,256
He told me they showed those
pictures in the courtroom,
1397
01:56:08,375 --> 01:56:10,795
Colonel Lawson's
favourite pictures.
1398
01:56:11,711 --> 01:56:14,760
He drags them out at any
pretext, doesn't he?
1399
01:56:14,881 --> 01:56:18,179
Colonel Lawson's private
chamber of horrors.
1400
01:56:21,263 --> 01:56:26,186
Is that what you think we are?
Do you think we knew of those things?
1401
01:56:26,309 --> 01:56:30,735
Do you think we wanted to
murder women and children?
1402
01:56:31,898 --> 01:56:35,410
Do you believe that? Do you?
1403
01:56:37,320 --> 01:56:40,951
Mrs Bertholt, I don't
know what to believe.
1404
01:56:41,074 --> 01:56:44,871
Good God.
We're sitting here drinking.
1405
01:56:44,995 --> 01:56:47,759
How could you think that we knew?
1406
01:56:47,914 --> 01:56:50,133
We did not know.
1407
01:56:50,250 --> 01:56:52,302
We did not know!
1408
01:56:54,379 --> 01:56:58,721
As far as I can make out,
no one in this country knew.
1409
01:57:01,011 --> 01:57:05,187
Mrs Bertholt, your husband was
one of the heads of the army.
1410
01:57:05,307 --> 01:57:08,190
And he did not know.
I tell you, he did not know.
1411
01:57:08,310 --> 01:57:11,904
It was Himmler. It was Goebbels.
The SS knew what happened.
1412
01:57:12,022 --> 01:57:13,861
We did not know.
1413
01:57:13,982 --> 01:57:18,454
Listen to me. There are things
that happened on both sides.
1414
01:57:18,570 --> 01:57:21,868
My husband was a military
man all his life.
1415
01:57:22,616 --> 01:57:25,878
He was entitled to a soldier's
death. He asked for that.
1416
01:57:25,994 --> 01:57:30,300
I tried to get that for him. Just that,
that he would die with some honour.
1417
01:57:30,415 --> 01:57:35,220
I went from official to official.
I begged for that!
1418
01:57:35,337 --> 01:57:39,678
That he should be permitted
the dignity of a firing squad.
1419
01:57:40,425 --> 01:57:42,477
You know what happened.
1420
01:57:43,803 --> 01:57:49,901
He was hanged with the others. And after
that, I knew what it was to hate.
1421
01:57:50,018 --> 01:57:54,159
I never left the house.
I never left the room. I drank.
1422
01:57:54,272 --> 01:58:00,536
I hated with every fibre of my being.
I hated every American I've ever known.
1423
01:58:00,654 --> 01:58:04,165
But one can't live
with hate. I know that.
1424
01:58:07,869 --> 01:58:10,254
Dan,
1425
01:58:10,372 --> 01:58:14,678
we have to forget if we
are to go on living.
1426
01:58:16,711 --> 01:58:18,681
Du darfst auf mich bauen
1427
01:58:18,797 --> 01:58:21,929
Weißt ja, wie gut ich dir bin
1428
01:58:22,050 --> 01:58:26,012
Ja, ja, ja, ja
1429
01:58:26,137 --> 01:58:29,934
Weißt doch, wie gut ich dir bin.
1430
01:58:30,058 --> 01:58:34,115
Und, und, wenn in der Ferne
1431
01:58:34,229 --> 01:58:38,025
Dir, dir, mein Bild erscheint
1432
01:58:38,149 --> 01:58:41,697
Dann, dann, wünscht' so gerne
1433
01:58:41,820 --> 01:58:44,619
Dass uns die Liebe vereint
1434
01:59:03,258 --> 01:59:05,310
Herr Rolfe.
1435
01:59:25,780 --> 01:59:28,117
May it please the tribunal.
1436
01:59:33,455 --> 01:59:37,465
Yesterday the tribunal
witnessed some films.
1437
01:59:38,710 --> 01:59:43,681
They were... shocking films.
1438
01:59:44,466 --> 01:59:46,518
Devastating films.
1439
01:59:48,136 --> 01:59:50,188
As a German,
1440
01:59:52,557 --> 01:59:58,441
I feel ashamed that such things could
have taken place in my country.
1441
01:59:59,856 --> 02:00:04,696
There can never be a
justification for them,
1442
02:00:04,819 --> 02:00:09,624
not in generations,
not in centuries.
1443
02:00:13,495 --> 02:00:15,547
But...
1444
02:00:17,791 --> 02:00:21,255
I do think it was wrong,
1445
02:00:23,088 --> 02:00:25,140
indecent
1446
02:00:26,049 --> 02:00:29,846
and terribly unfair
of the prosecution
1447
02:00:30,929 --> 02:00:37,988
to show such films in this case,
in this court, at this time
1448
02:00:38,103 --> 02:00:40,867
against these defendants!
1449
02:00:40,981 --> 02:00:46,498
And I cannot protest too
strongly against such tactics.
1450
02:00:54,035 --> 02:00:57,915
What is the prosecution
trying to prove?
1451
02:00:58,039 --> 02:01:03,259
That the German people as a whole
were responsible for these events?
1452
02:01:03,378 --> 02:01:06,308
Or that they were
even aware of them?
1453
02:01:06,423 --> 02:01:08,759
Because, if he is,
1454
02:01:10,427 --> 02:01:12,728
he's not stating facts
1455
02:01:14,014 --> 02:01:16,648
and he knows he's not.
1456
02:01:19,269 --> 02:01:21,950
The secrecy of the operations,
1457
02:01:22,063 --> 02:01:24,649
the geographical
location of the camps,
1458
02:01:24,774 --> 02:01:28,452
the breakdown of communications
in the last days of the war
1459
02:01:28,570 --> 02:01:31,370
when the exterminations
rose into the millions,
1460
02:01:31,489 --> 02:01:35,796
show only too clearly that
he is not telling the truth.
1461
02:01:35,911 --> 02:01:42,839
The truth is that these brutalities were
brought about by the few extremists.
1462
02:01:42,959 --> 02:01:45,011
The criminals.
1463
02:01:46,796 --> 02:01:50,011
Very few Germans knew
what was going on.
1464
02:01:50,133 --> 02:01:52,185
Very few.
1465
02:01:53,220 --> 02:01:59,151
None of us knew what was happening
in the places shown on these films.
1466
02:02:00,435 --> 02:02:02,487
None of us.
1467
02:02:08,068 --> 02:02:11,496
But the most ironic part of it
1468
02:02:11,613 --> 02:02:18,162
is that the prosecution showed these
films against these defendants,
1469
02:02:18,286 --> 02:02:23,174
men who stayed in power
for one reason only:
1470
02:02:23,291 --> 02:02:26,803
to prevent worse
things from happening.
1471
02:02:27,712 --> 02:02:30,393
Who is the braver man?
1472
02:02:30,507 --> 02:02:34,647
The man who escapes or
resigns in times of peril?
1473
02:02:35,512 --> 02:02:41,728
Or the man who stays on his post at
the risk of his own personal safety?
1474
02:02:42,394 --> 02:02:46,700
The defence will present witnesses
and letters and documents
1475
02:02:46,815 --> 02:02:49,365
from religious and political
refugees all over the world
1476
02:02:49,484 --> 02:02:52,663
telling how Ernst Janning
saved them from execution.
1477
02:02:52,779 --> 02:02:55,330
The defence will
show the many times
1478
02:02:55,448 --> 02:02:58,497
Ernst Janning was able to
effect mitigation of sentences,
1479
02:02:58,618 --> 02:03:03,542
when without his influence the
results would have been much worse.
1480
02:03:03,665 --> 02:03:06,215
The defence will show
1481
02:03:06,334 --> 02:03:11,638
that Ernst Janning's personal
physician was a non-Aryan.
1482
02:03:11,756 --> 02:03:17,273
A Jewish man who he kept in
attendance, much to his own peril.
1483
02:03:21,224 --> 02:03:24,487
The defence presents affidavits
1484
02:03:24,603 --> 02:03:28,565
from legal authorities and
famed jurists the world over,
1485
02:03:28,690 --> 02:03:32,866
pleading that special consideration
must be made in this case,
1486
02:03:32,986 --> 02:03:39,249
saying that the entire work of Ernst
Janning was inspired by one motive only:
1487
02:03:39,367 --> 02:03:44,754
the endeavour to preserve justice
and the concept of justice.
1488
02:03:48,627 --> 02:03:56,848
Now, what has the prosecution
to offer against this?
1489
02:03:57,886 --> 02:04:02,856
The prosecution, in fact, has presented
in the case of Ernst Janning
1490
02:04:02,974 --> 02:04:05,988
only one tangible
piece of evidence.
1491
02:04:06,102 --> 02:04:09,400
The Feldenstein case. A notorious
case, as the defence said.
1492
02:04:09,522 --> 02:04:12,073
A case which never should
have been reopened.
1493
02:04:12,192 --> 02:04:17,365
A case which the defence
is obliged to review now.
1494
02:04:19,241 --> 02:04:21,874
The defence calls Mrs Elsa Lindnow.
1495
02:04:40,303 --> 02:04:42,605
Will you raise your right hand?
1496
02:04:42,722 --> 02:04:44,692
I swear by God the
Almighty and Omniscient
1497
02:04:44,808 --> 02:04:48,022
that I will speak the pure truth
and withhold and add nothing.
1498
02:04:48,144 --> 02:04:50,196
I do.
1499
02:04:53,441 --> 02:04:55,493
Mrs Lindnow.
1500
02:04:58,113 --> 02:05:00,332
What is your occupation?
1501
02:05:00,448 --> 02:05:02,500
I am a cleaning woman.
1502
02:05:02,993 --> 02:05:05,840
Where are you employed?
1503
02:05:05,954 --> 02:05:11,091
4... 345 Grosseplatz.
1504
02:05:11,209 --> 02:05:14,591
- Did you know Lehman Feldenstein?
- Yes, I knew him.
1505
02:05:14,713 --> 02:05:20,312
- In what capacity?
- He was my employer in 1935.
1506
02:05:20,427 --> 02:05:22,811
Do you know Mrs Irene
Hoffman Wallner?
1507
02:05:22,929 --> 02:05:24,270
Yes.
1508
02:05:24,389 --> 02:05:29,110
- In what capacity?
- She was a tenant in the building.
1509
02:05:29,227 --> 02:05:33,699
Did you ever see Miss Hoffman
and Mr Feldenstein together?
1510
02:05:33,815 --> 02:05:37,327
- Yes.
- How did this happen?
1511
02:05:37,444 --> 02:05:42,498
Mr Feldenstein came to see
Miss Hoffman at her apartment.
1512
02:05:43,116 --> 02:05:46,462
- Often?
- Quite often.
1513
02:05:46,578 --> 02:05:50,458
Were there any occasions in which
you noticed anything unusual?
1514
02:05:50,582 --> 02:05:52,634
Yes.
1515
02:05:52,751 --> 02:05:59,300
I saw Miss Hoffman kissing Mr Feldenstein
at the door of her apartment.
1516
02:05:59,424 --> 02:06:04,229
- Was there any other occasion?
- Yes. There was one.
1517
02:06:04,346 --> 02:06:08,985
- What was it?
- I came to Miss Hoffman's apartment.
1518
02:06:09,100 --> 02:06:13,609
I wanted to clean up.
I thought it was empty.
1519
02:06:14,898 --> 02:06:20,865
I saw Miss Hoffman sitting
on Mr Feldenstein's lap.
1520
02:06:20,987 --> 02:06:24,285
Thank you, Mrs Lindnow. That's all.
1521
02:06:26,618 --> 02:06:28,670
Colonel Lawson?
1522
02:06:33,959 --> 02:06:36,094
Earphones, please.
1523
02:06:38,797 --> 02:06:43,436
Mrs Lindnow, what are your
political affiliations?
1524
02:06:45,679 --> 02:06:47,102
Political?
1525
02:06:47,222 --> 02:06:49,357
Objection, Your Honour.
1526
02:06:51,059 --> 02:06:55,152
This witness' political affiliations
have nothing to do with the testimony.
1527
02:06:55,272 --> 02:07:00,278
Colonel Lawson is again trying to
appeal to the emotion of the court.
1528
02:07:00,402 --> 02:07:02,454
Objection overruled.
1529
02:07:02,571 --> 02:07:04,955
Now would you answer
the question, please?
1530
02:07:05,073 --> 02:07:09,083
Were you a member of the
National Socialist party?
1531
02:07:09,202 --> 02:07:11,883
Yes, I was.
1532
02:07:13,456 --> 02:07:15,462
We were forced to be.
1533
02:07:15,584 --> 02:07:17,920
"We were forced to be."
1534
02:07:18,962 --> 02:07:21,845
When did you become a
member of the Nazi party?
1535
02:07:24,092 --> 02:07:27,520
1933.
1536
02:07:27,637 --> 02:07:34,269
Were all German nationals forced to
become Nazi party members in 1933?
1537
02:07:35,395 --> 02:07:37,696
Please answer me, Mrs Lindnow!
1538
02:07:37,814 --> 02:07:42,239
Were you forced to become a
member of the Nazi party?
1539
02:07:45,822 --> 02:07:47,661
That's all.
1540
02:07:48,950 --> 02:07:51,002
Witness is excused.
1541
02:08:06,968 --> 02:08:09,020
Defence may continue.
1542
02:08:16,645 --> 02:08:21,401
The defence calls Irene
Hoffman Wallner to the stand.
1543
02:08:37,290 --> 02:08:39,342
Mrs Wallner,
1544
02:08:41,753 --> 02:08:43,889
you are still under oath.
1545
02:08:45,632 --> 02:08:48,681
Mrs Wallner, did you
come here voluntarily?
1546
02:08:49,302 --> 02:08:52,600
Did you report voluntarily
to speak as a witness?
1547
02:08:52,722 --> 02:08:54,774
Yes.
1548
02:08:55,850 --> 02:08:59,362
Is it not true that the prosecution
asked you to come here?
1549
02:09:00,021 --> 02:09:03,616
That it was very disagreeable
for you to come here?
1550
02:09:03,733 --> 02:09:07,874
It is always very disagreeable
to live over those times.
1551
02:09:09,406 --> 02:09:12,704
That would be in agreement
with the information I have,
1552
02:09:12,826 --> 02:09:16,373
that you did not want to come.
Thank you, Mrs Wallner.
1553
02:09:16,538 --> 02:09:18,590
Mrs Wallner,
1554
02:09:21,126 --> 02:09:25,385
the Nuremberg laws were
stated September 15th, 1935.
1555
02:09:26,172 --> 02:09:28,972
- Where were you at that time?
- In Nuremberg.
1556
02:09:29,092 --> 02:09:31,144
Did you know these laws?
1557
02:09:31,261 --> 02:09:36,350
That a physical relationship
with Jews was against the law?
1558
02:09:36,474 --> 02:09:37,483
Yes.
1559
02:09:37,601 --> 02:09:42,524
Were you aware that in Nuremberg,
and in Nuremberg in particular,
1560
02:09:42,647 --> 02:09:47,571
not only a physical relationship with Jews
was disdained, but every social contact?
1561
02:09:47,694 --> 02:09:49,450
Yes.
1562
02:09:49,571 --> 02:09:53,451
Were you aware that it might have
some danger for you personally?
1563
02:09:53,575 --> 02:09:55,710
Yes, I was aware of it.
1564
02:09:55,827 --> 02:10:00,217
But how can you discard a friendship
from day to day because of some...
1565
02:10:00,332 --> 02:10:05,682
That is another question, Mrs Wallner.
I did not ask you that question.
1566
02:10:05,795 --> 02:10:09,592
- Were you aware of it?
- Yes, I was aware.
1567
02:10:09,716 --> 02:10:12,397
Yet you still continued
to see each other?
1568
02:10:12,510 --> 02:10:14,563
Yes.
1569
02:10:15,847 --> 02:10:21,102
It was brought out that Mr Feldenstein
bought you candy and cigarettes.
1570
02:10:21,228 --> 02:10:22,236
Yes.
1571
02:10:22,354 --> 02:10:25,533
Remember that sometimes
he bought you flowers?
1572
02:10:25,649 --> 02:10:28,662
Yes, he bought me many things.
1573
02:10:28,777 --> 02:10:30,912
That was because he was kind.
1574
02:10:31,863 --> 02:10:34,960
He was the kindest man I ever knew.
1575
02:10:37,535 --> 02:10:40,798
Do you know the witness,
Mrs Elsa Lindnow?
1576
02:10:40,914 --> 02:10:42,421
Yes, I know her.
1577
02:10:42,540 --> 02:10:45,755
- Was she a cleaner at your apartment?
- Yes.
1578
02:10:45,877 --> 02:10:48,926
Did Mr Feldenstein come to
see you at your apartment?
1579
02:10:49,047 --> 02:10:51,728
- Yes.
- How many times?
1580
02:10:53,260 --> 02:10:55,940
I don't remember.
1581
02:10:56,054 --> 02:10:58,937
- Several times?
- Yes.
1582
02:10:59,057 --> 02:11:01,738
- Many times?
- Many times.
1583
02:11:01,851 --> 02:11:04,437
- Did you kiss him?
- Yes, I kissed him.
1584
02:11:04,563 --> 02:11:07,611
Was there more than one kiss?
1585
02:11:07,732 --> 02:11:10,200
Yes.
1586
02:11:10,318 --> 02:11:15,206
But it was not in the way you
are trying to make it sound.
1587
02:11:15,323 --> 02:11:20,461
He was like a father to me.
He was more than a father.
1588
02:11:20,579 --> 02:11:23,544
More than a father?!
Did you sit on his lap?
1589
02:11:23,665 --> 02:11:26,513
Objection! Counsel is
persecuting the witness
1590
02:11:26,626 --> 02:11:28,678
in the pretext of
gaining testimony.
1591
02:11:30,005 --> 02:11:31,595
Objection overruled.
1592
02:11:31,715 --> 02:11:36,804
The defence is re-enacting what was
a travesty of justice in the first place.
1593
02:11:36,928 --> 02:11:42,445
Colonel Lawson, the tribunal makes the
rulings in this case, not the prosecution.
1594
02:11:42,559 --> 02:11:45,109
- You may proceed.
- Did you sit on his lap?
1595
02:11:46,021 --> 02:11:52,237
Yes. But there was nothing
wrong or ugly about it.
1596
02:11:52,360 --> 02:11:54,911
Did you sit on his lap?
1597
02:11:55,030 --> 02:11:56,620
Yes. But...
1598
02:11:56,740 --> 02:11:59,374
You sat on his lap!
What else did you do?
1599
02:12:01,411 --> 02:12:05,468
There was nothing that you are
trying to say, nothing like that.
1600
02:12:05,582 --> 02:12:08,465
What else did you do, Mrs Wallner?
1601
02:12:09,169 --> 02:12:11,304
What are you trying to do?
1602
02:12:13,048 --> 02:12:15,100
Are you trying to...
1603
02:12:17,469 --> 02:12:21,859
Why do you not let
me speak the truth?
1604
02:12:21,973 --> 02:12:25,651
That's what we want, Mrs
Wallner, the truth. The truth!
1605
02:12:25,769 --> 02:12:28,023
You admitted that you
continued to see him.
1606
02:12:28,146 --> 02:12:30,697
You admitted that he
came to your apartment.
1607
02:12:30,815 --> 02:12:34,410
You admitted you kissed him.
You admitted you sat on his lap.
1608
02:12:34,527 --> 02:12:36,948
What else do you admit to?
What else?
1609
02:12:37,072 --> 02:12:42,042
Nothing! There was nothing like
you're trying to make it sound.
1610
02:12:42,160 --> 02:12:47,084
- What else?
- There was nothing! Nothing.
1611
02:12:47,207 --> 02:12:49,129
Stop it!
1612
02:12:49,251 --> 02:12:50,378
Stop it!
1613
02:12:50,502 --> 02:12:52,886
What else do you admit
to, Mrs Wallner?
1614
02:12:53,004 --> 02:12:55,056
Herr Rolfe!
1615
02:12:59,302 --> 02:13:01,354
Are we going to do this again?
1616
02:13:06,935 --> 02:13:12,986
Your Honour, the defendant has been under
such stress that he is not aware...
1617
02:13:13,108 --> 02:13:16,821
I am aware. I am aware.
1618
02:13:16,945 --> 02:13:19,495
Your Honour, the defendant
wishes to make a statement.
1619
02:13:19,614 --> 02:13:23,245
- I believe the defence has a right to...
- Order, order.
1620
02:13:23,368 --> 02:13:25,420
Order!
1621
02:13:28,623 --> 02:13:31,553
Does the defendant wish
to make a statement?
1622
02:13:31,668 --> 02:13:34,931
I wish to make a statement, yes.
1623
02:13:35,839 --> 02:13:38,603
Your Honour, the defence
has the right to request...
1624
02:13:38,717 --> 02:13:41,730
The defendant has the right
to make his statement now.
1625
02:13:41,845 --> 02:13:47,065
- I have to speak with my client.
- He has the right to make it now!
1626
02:13:56,943 --> 02:14:00,158
Tribunal is adjourned until
10.30 tomorrow morning.
1627
02:14:05,035 --> 02:14:07,585
What are you doing?
1628
02:14:07,704 --> 02:14:10,967
What do you think
you're trying to do?
1629
02:14:11,082 --> 02:14:16,006
They've had Göring, Frank,
Streicher... That's over.
1630
02:14:16,796 --> 02:14:21,471
Do you think I have enjoyed being
defence counsel during this trial?
1631
02:14:21,593 --> 02:14:25,306
There were things I had to do in
that courtroom that made me cringe.
1632
02:14:25,430 --> 02:14:27,649
Why did I do them?
1633
02:14:27,766 --> 02:14:30,731
Because I want to leave the
German people something.
1634
02:14:30,852 --> 02:14:33,237
I want to leave them
a shred of dignity.
1635
02:14:33,355 --> 02:14:36,119
I want to call a halt
to these proceedings.
1636
02:14:36,233 --> 02:14:39,365
If we allow them to discredit
every German like you,
1637
02:14:39,486 --> 02:14:43,282
we lose the right to
rule ourselves forever!
1638
02:14:43,865 --> 02:14:47,459
We have to look at the future.
We can't look back now.
1639
02:14:47,577 --> 02:14:50,507
Do you want the Americans
to stay here forever?
1640
02:14:50,622 --> 02:14:54,418
I could show you a picture
of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
1641
02:14:54,542 --> 02:14:57,046
Thousands and thousands
of burnt bodies.
1642
02:14:57,170 --> 02:14:59,222
Women and children.
1643
02:15:00,257 --> 02:15:03,603
Is that their superior morality?
1644
02:15:03,718 --> 02:15:06,103
Where do you think they take us?
Do they know?
1645
02:15:06,221 --> 02:15:10,563
Do you think they have any
concept of our problems?
1646
02:15:14,563 --> 02:15:16,698
What can I say to you?
1647
02:15:18,108 --> 02:15:21,157
What can I say to you
to make you see?
1648
02:15:27,784 --> 02:15:30,916
There is nothing you can say.
1649
02:15:32,706 --> 02:15:33,714
Nothing.
1650
02:15:33,832 --> 02:15:37,046
Nothing has happened
to alleviate the crisis.
1651
02:15:37,168 --> 02:15:39,256
The crisis reached a
head this afternoon
1652
02:15:39,379 --> 02:15:42,926
when all rail travel between western
zones and Berlin was stopped.
1653
02:15:43,049 --> 02:15:46,229
The blockade by land
is now complete.
1654
02:15:52,851 --> 02:15:56,564
What do you think we're going
to do, General? Withdraw?
1655
02:15:56,688 --> 02:15:59,322
We can't. If we withdraw
under pressure,
1656
02:15:59,441 --> 02:16:01,861
our prestige all over the
world is threatened.
1657
02:16:01,985 --> 02:16:04,370
The Communists will
move in on every front.
1658
02:16:04,487 --> 02:16:09,956
What about these trials, General?
How do you feel about them now?
1659
02:16:10,076 --> 02:16:12,461
We're committed to the trials,
1660
02:16:12,579 --> 02:16:16,459
but I think it would be realistic to
accelerate them as much as possible.
1661
02:16:16,583 --> 02:16:20,177
What would happen if they fired
on one of our planes, General?
1662
02:16:20,295 --> 02:16:24,804
We'll have to face that when it happens.
There is no other answer to that now.
1663
02:16:28,220 --> 02:16:30,900
You should try the strudel.
It's excellent here.
1664
02:16:31,014 --> 02:16:33,019
No, thanks.
1665
02:16:33,141 --> 02:16:37,282
Dan, I've just come back
from Berlin, as you know.
1666
02:16:37,395 --> 02:16:41,821
I don't think this is going to be it.
A lot of people do, but I don't.
1667
02:16:41,942 --> 02:16:47,826
But it is going to be a fight for survival...
for the next ten years, maybe the next 20.
1668
02:16:47,948 --> 02:16:50,284
Germany is the key
to that survival.
1669
02:16:50,408 --> 02:16:54,999
Any high-school student in
geography can tell you that.
1670
02:16:55,121 --> 02:16:57,921
Just what are you
trying to say, Senator?
1671
02:16:58,041 --> 02:17:00,461
What I'm trying to say is this:
1672
02:17:00,585 --> 02:17:04,263
while nobody's trying to
influence your decision,
1673
02:17:04,381 --> 02:17:08,391
it's important that you realise
this because it's a fact of life.
1674
02:17:08,510 --> 02:17:13,018
Let's face it, gentlemen,
the handwriting is on the wall.
1675
02:17:13,139 --> 02:17:15,608
We're going to need all
the help we can get.
1676
02:17:15,725 --> 02:17:20,234
We're going to need the
support of the German people.
1677
02:17:20,355 --> 02:17:22,609
More strudel, gentlemen?
1678
02:17:26,820 --> 02:17:29,288
Herr Janning, you may proceed.
1679
02:17:34,327 --> 02:17:38,254
I wish to testify about
the Feldenstein case
1680
02:17:39,457 --> 02:17:44,630
because it was the most
significant trial of the period.
1681
02:17:44,754 --> 02:17:50,058
It is important not only for
the tribunal to understand it,
1682
02:17:50,176 --> 02:17:52,941
but for the whole German people.
1683
02:17:53,805 --> 02:17:56,356
But in order to understand it,
1684
02:17:56,558 --> 02:18:01,113
one must understand the
period in which it happened.
1685
02:18:02,147 --> 02:18:04,864
There was a fever over the land.
1686
02:18:04,983 --> 02:18:09,574
A fever of disgrace,
of indignity, of hunger.
1687
02:18:10,739 --> 02:18:13,325
We had a democracy, yes,
1688
02:18:13,450 --> 02:18:16,415
but it was tom by elements within.
1689
02:18:17,037 --> 02:18:20,667
Above all, there was fear.
1690
02:18:20,790 --> 02:18:24,503
Fear of today, fear of tomorrow,
1691
02:18:24,628 --> 02:18:26,715
fear of our neighbours,
1692
02:18:26,838 --> 02:18:29,686
and fear of ourselves.
1693
02:18:31,051 --> 02:18:33,554
Only when you understand that
1694
02:18:33,678 --> 02:18:37,107
can you understand what
Hitler meant to us.
1695
02:18:37,224 --> 02:18:39,276
Because he said to us:
1696
02:18:40,644 --> 02:18:44,950
"Lift your heads.
Be proud to be German."
1697
02:18:45,065 --> 02:18:50,071
"There are devils among us...
communists, liberals, Jews, Gypsies."
1698
02:18:50,195 --> 02:18:56,495
"Once these devils will be destroyed,
your misery will be destroyed."
1699
02:18:56,618 --> 02:19:01,588
It was the old, old story
of the sacrificial lamb.
1700
02:19:05,627 --> 02:19:08,047
What about those of
us who knew better?
1701
02:19:08,171 --> 02:19:12,478
We who knew the words were
lies and worse than lies?
1702
02:19:12,592 --> 02:19:16,685
Why did we sit silent?
Why did we take part?
1703
02:19:18,223 --> 02:19:20,773
Because we loved our country.
1704
02:19:21,977 --> 02:19:27,196
What difference does it make if a few
political extremists lose their rights?
1705
02:19:27,315 --> 02:19:31,871
What difference does it make if a few
racial minorities lose their rights?
1706
02:19:31,987 --> 02:19:34,074
It is only a passing phase.
1707
02:19:34,197 --> 02:19:36,582
It is only a stage we
are going through.
1708
02:19:36,700 --> 02:19:38,954
It will be discarded
sooner or later.
1709
02:19:39,077 --> 02:19:43,419
Hitler himself will be
discarded sooner or later.
1710
02:19:43,623 --> 02:19:46,838
"The country is in danger!
We will march out of the shadows."
1711
02:19:46,960 --> 02:19:51,717
"We will go forward."
"Forward" is the great password.
1712
02:19:54,509 --> 02:19:59,231
And history tells how well
we succeeded, Your Honour.
1713
02:20:00,557 --> 02:20:03,985
We succeeded beyond
our wildest dreams.
1714
02:20:04,102 --> 02:20:09,536
The very elements of hate and power
about Hitler that mesmerised Germany,
1715
02:20:09,649 --> 02:20:11,868
mesmerised the world!
1716
02:20:11,985 --> 02:20:15,579
We found ourselves with
sudden powerful allies.
1717
02:20:15,697 --> 02:20:21,131
Things that had been denied to us
as a democracy were open to us now.
1718
02:20:21,244 --> 02:20:25,835
The world said
"Go ahead. Take it. Take it!"
1719
02:20:25,957 --> 02:20:29,837
"Take Sudetenland.
Take the Rhineland. Remilitarise it."
1720
02:20:29,961 --> 02:20:32,429
"Take all of Austria! Take it."
1721
02:20:35,634 --> 02:20:39,395
And then one day we looked around
1722
02:20:39,512 --> 02:20:43,143
and found that we were in an
even more terrible danger.
1723
02:20:43,266 --> 02:20:45,651
The ritual began in this courtroom,
1724
02:20:45,769 --> 02:20:50,324
swept over the land like a
raging, roaring disease!
1725
02:20:50,440 --> 02:20:54,034
What was going to
be a passing phase
1726
02:20:55,695 --> 02:20:57,950
had become the way of life.
1727
02:21:03,495 --> 02:21:05,547
Your Honour,
1728
02:21:06,915 --> 02:21:12,004
I was content to sit
silent during this trial.
1729
02:21:13,296 --> 02:21:17,140
I was content to tend my roses.
1730
02:21:18,969 --> 02:21:24,486
I was even content to let
counsel try to save my name...
1731
02:21:26,309 --> 02:21:30,532
until I realised that
in order to save it
1732
02:21:31,606 --> 02:21:35,118
he would have to raise
the spectre again.
1733
02:21:37,529 --> 02:21:39,664
You have seen him do it.
1734
02:21:39,781 --> 02:21:42,711
He has done it here
in this courtroom.
1735
02:21:42,826 --> 02:21:47,749
He has suggested that the Third Reich
worked for the benefit of people.
1736
02:21:47,872 --> 02:21:53,341
He has suggested that we sterilised
men for the welfare of the country.
1737
02:21:53,461 --> 02:22:00,354
He suggested that perhaps the old Jew did
sleep with the 16-year-old girl after all.
1738
02:22:00,468 --> 02:22:07,444
Once more, it is being
done for love of country.
1739
02:22:10,061 --> 02:22:14,202
It is not easy to tell the truth.
1740
02:22:15,942 --> 02:22:20,118
But if there is to be any
salvation for Germany,
1741
02:22:20,238 --> 02:22:23,999
we who know our guilt
must admit it,
1742
02:22:24,117 --> 02:22:29,005
whatever the pain and humiliation.
1743
02:22:34,753 --> 02:22:40,471
I had reached my verdict
on the Feldenstein case
1744
02:22:40,592 --> 02:22:43,142
before I ever came
into the courtroom.
1745
02:22:43,261 --> 02:22:47,770
I would have found him guilty whatever
the evidence. It was not a trial at all.
1746
02:22:47,891 --> 02:22:52,861
It was a sacrificial ritual, and Feldenstein
the Jew was the helpless victim.
1747
02:22:52,979 --> 02:22:57,535
Your Honour, the defendant is
not aware of what he is saying.
1748
02:22:57,651 --> 02:22:59,703
He is not aware of
the implications.
1749
02:22:59,819 --> 02:23:02,500
I am aware. I am aware!
1750
02:23:04,407 --> 02:23:06,875
My counsel would have you believe
1751
02:23:06,993 --> 02:23:11,086
we were not aware of the
concentration camps.
1752
02:23:11,206 --> 02:23:13,756
Not aware.
1753
02:23:13,875 --> 02:23:15,714
Where were we?
1754
02:23:15,835 --> 02:23:19,715
Where were we when Hitler began
shrieking his hate in the Reichstag?
1755
02:23:19,839 --> 02:23:24,229
When our neighbours were dragged out
in the middle of the night to Dachau?
1756
02:23:24,344 --> 02:23:27,725
Where were we when every village
in Germany has a railroad terminal
1757
02:23:27,847 --> 02:23:33,482
where cattle cars were filled with children
being carried off to their extermination?
1758
02:23:33,603 --> 02:23:36,700
Where were we when they cried
out in the night to us?
1759
02:23:36,815 --> 02:23:40,029
Were we deaf? Dumb? Blind?
1760
02:23:40,151 --> 02:23:42,073
Your Honour, I must protest.
1761
02:23:42,195 --> 02:23:47,794
My counsel says we were not aware of
the extermination of the millions.
1762
02:23:47,909 --> 02:23:50,210
He would give you the excuse
1763
02:23:50,328 --> 02:23:55,169
we were only aware of the
extermination of the hundreds.
1764
02:23:55,959 --> 02:23:59,138
Does that make us any
the less guilty?
1765
02:24:00,547 --> 02:24:03,050
Maybe we didn't know the details,
1766
02:24:03,174 --> 02:24:07,931
but if we didn't know, it was
because we didn't want to know.
1767
02:24:08,054 --> 02:24:12,147
- Traitor! Traitor!
- Order. Order.
1768
02:24:12,726 --> 02:24:14,695
Order!
1769
02:24:14,811 --> 02:24:18,109
Put that man back in his
seat and keep him there.
1770
02:24:22,193 --> 02:24:24,958
I am going to tell them the truth.
1771
02:24:25,864 --> 02:24:31,499
I am going to tell them the truth if
the whole world conspires against it.
1772
02:24:31,620 --> 02:24:37,219
I am going to tell them the truth
about their Ministry of Justice.
1773
02:24:38,793 --> 02:24:43,764
Werner Lampe, an old man who
cries into his Bible now.
1774
02:24:44,382 --> 02:24:47,431
An old man who profited by
the property expropriation
1775
02:24:47,552 --> 02:24:51,230
of every man he sent to
a concentration camp.
1776
02:24:51,348 --> 02:24:56,603
Friedrich Hofstetter, the good German,
who knew how to take orders,
1777
02:24:56,728 --> 02:25:01,983
who sent men before him to be
sterilised, like so many digits.
1778
02:25:04,110 --> 02:25:06,614
Emil Hahn,
1779
02:25:06,738 --> 02:25:09,787
the decayed, corrupt bigot,
1780
02:25:09,908 --> 02:25:13,087
obsessed by the evil
within himself.
1781
02:25:18,291 --> 02:25:20,343
And Ernst Janning,
1782
02:25:22,379 --> 02:25:24,633
worse than any of them...
1783
02:25:25,465 --> 02:25:28,644
because he knew what they were,
1784
02:25:28,760 --> 02:25:31,097
and he went along with them.
1785
02:25:34,140 --> 02:25:38,233
Ernst Janning, who made his life...
1786
02:25:40,730 --> 02:25:42,782
excrement...
1787
02:25:44,568 --> 02:25:47,036
because he walked with them.
1788
02:27:13,323 --> 02:27:15,375
Your Honour,
1789
02:27:16,701 --> 02:27:21,506
it is my duty to
defend Ernst Janning,
1790
02:27:22,582 --> 02:27:26,924
and yet Ernst Janning
has said he is guilty.
1791
02:27:27,045 --> 02:27:31,221
There is no doubt
he feels his guilt.
1792
02:27:32,926 --> 02:27:37,565
He made a great error in going
along with the Nazi movement,
1793
02:27:38,181 --> 02:27:41,278
hoping it would be
good for his country.
1794
02:27:41,393 --> 02:27:45,320
But, if he is to be found guilty,
1795
02:27:46,523 --> 02:27:50,782
there are others who
also went along,
1796
02:27:51,861 --> 02:27:54,412
who also must be found guilty.
1797
02:27:56,199 --> 02:28:01,586
Ernst Janning said "We succeeded
beyond our wildest dreams".
1798
02:28:03,582 --> 02:28:07,176
Why did we succeed, Your Honour?
1799
02:28:08,920 --> 02:28:11,684
What about the rest of the world?
1800
02:28:13,174 --> 02:28:17,351
Did it not know the intentions
of the Third Reich?
1801
02:28:17,470 --> 02:28:22,359
Did it not hear the words of Hitler
broadcast all over the world?
1802
02:28:22,475 --> 02:28:24,896
Did it not read his
intentions in Mein Kampf,
1803
02:28:25,020 --> 02:28:28,234
published in every
corner of the world?
1804
02:28:28,857 --> 02:28:32,155
Where is the responsibility
of the Soviet Union,
1805
02:28:32,277 --> 02:28:38,375
who signed in 1939 the pact with
Hitler that enabled him to make war?
1806
02:28:39,659 --> 02:28:42,423
Are we now to find Russia guilty?
1807
02:28:43,663 --> 02:28:47,045
Where is the responsibility
of the Vatican,
1808
02:28:47,167 --> 02:28:50,631
who signed in 1933 the
concordat with Hitler,
1809
02:28:50,754 --> 02:28:54,467
giving him his first
tremendous prestige?
1810
02:28:55,216 --> 02:28:58,396
Are we now to find
the Vatican guilty?
1811
02:28:59,721 --> 02:29:03,067
Where is the responsibility of the
world leader Winston Churchill,
1812
02:29:03,183 --> 02:29:06,979
who said in an open letter to
the London Times in 1938...
1813
02:29:07,103 --> 02:29:10,651
1938, Your Honour...
1814
02:29:11,733 --> 02:29:15,115
"Were England to suffer national
disaster, I should pray to God
1815
02:29:15,237 --> 02:29:19,745
to send a man of the strength of
mind and will of an Adolf Hitler."
1816
02:29:19,866 --> 02:29:23,045
Are we now to find Winston
Churchill guilty?
1817
02:29:23,161 --> 02:29:26,507
Where is the responsibility of
those American industrialists
1818
02:29:26,623 --> 02:29:29,304
who helped Hitler to
rebuild his armaments,
1819
02:29:29,417 --> 02:29:32,715
and profited by that rebuilding?
1820
02:29:32,837 --> 02:29:36,017
Are we now to find the American
industrialists guilty?
1821
02:29:36,132 --> 02:29:38,636
No, Your Honour. No.
1822
02:29:39,719 --> 02:29:41,771
Germany alone is not guilty.
1823
02:29:41,888 --> 02:29:45,566
The whole world is as responsible
for Hitler as Germany.
1824
02:29:45,684 --> 02:29:48,614
It is an easy thing to
condemn one man in the dock.
1825
02:29:48,728 --> 02:29:52,489
It is easy to speak of the "basic
flaw" in the German character
1826
02:29:52,607 --> 02:29:54,659
that allowed Hitler
to rise to power,
1827
02:29:54,776 --> 02:29:57,991
and at the same time ignore
the "basic flaw" of character
1828
02:29:58,113 --> 02:30:01,956
that made the Russians sign pacts with
him, Winston Churchill praise him,
1829
02:30:02,075 --> 02:30:05,587
American industrialists
profit by him!
1830
02:30:08,498 --> 02:30:11,962
Ernst Janning said he is guilty.
1831
02:30:14,004 --> 02:30:19,971
If he is, Ernst Janning's
guilt is the world's guilt.
1832
02:30:21,928 --> 02:30:25,025
No more and no less.
1833
02:30:38,653 --> 02:30:44,170
Major, we have to give the military
governor every help we can give him.
1834
02:30:44,284 --> 02:30:47,463
We have to get 700
tons in the air a day.
1835
02:30:47,579 --> 02:30:49,631
700 tons.
1836
02:30:55,128 --> 02:30:57,180
This is some operation.
1837
02:30:59,507 --> 02:31:05,309
Did you ever think we'd be flying
coal and tomatoes in these crates?
1838
02:31:07,474 --> 02:31:11,151
Tad, you and I have been
friends a long time.
1839
02:31:11,269 --> 02:31:13,737
That's why I called you here.
1840
02:31:16,650 --> 02:31:20,493
What are you going to
do in court tomorrow?
1841
02:31:22,739 --> 02:31:25,373
You know damn well
what I'm going to do.
1842
02:31:25,909 --> 02:31:31,129
I know what you want to do... put them
behind bars and throw away the key.
1843
02:31:31,248 --> 02:31:34,131
You know what's going on here now?
1844
02:31:35,335 --> 02:31:39,013
Yeah, I know what's going on.
1845
02:31:39,130 --> 02:31:41,848
You're an army man. You
know what we're up against.
1846
02:31:41,967 --> 02:31:45,810
The others may not, but you do.
I'll tell you the truth.
1847
02:31:45,929 --> 02:31:50,650
I don't know what's going to happen
if they fire on one of those planes.
1848
02:31:50,767 --> 02:31:53,271
I don't know what's
going to happen.
1849
02:31:53,395 --> 02:31:57,986
But if I do know this:
if Berlin goes, Germany goes.
1850
02:31:58,108 --> 02:32:01,489
If Germany goes, Europe goes.
1851
02:32:02,320 --> 02:32:06,911
That's the way things stand.
That's the way they stand.
1852
02:32:07,033 --> 02:32:10,545
Look, Matt. I'm going
to go the limit.
1853
02:32:10,662 --> 02:32:14,008
And not you, not the Pentagon,
not God on his throne is...
1854
02:32:14,124 --> 02:32:17,089
Who do you think you're talking to?
1855
02:32:18,545 --> 02:32:21,345
Who the hell do you think
you're talking to?
1856
02:32:21,464 --> 02:32:24,478
When you were marching into
Dachau, I was there too.
1857
02:32:24,593 --> 02:32:27,096
You think I'll ever forget it?
1858
02:32:28,138 --> 02:32:32,278
I'm not your commanding officer.
I can't and won't influence your decision.
1859
02:32:32,392 --> 02:32:37,066
But I want to give this to you,
and I want to give it to you straight.
1860
02:32:37,188 --> 02:32:40,368
We need the help of
the German people.
1861
02:32:42,277 --> 02:32:48,458
You don't get their help by sentencing
their leaders to stiff prison sentences.
1862
02:32:59,544 --> 02:33:03,886
Tad, the thing to do
is survive, isn't it?
1863
02:33:04,925 --> 02:33:09,148
Survive as best we
can, but survive.
1864
02:33:18,897 --> 02:33:21,116
Just for laughs, Matt.
1865
02:33:22,067 --> 02:33:24,701
What was the war all about?
1866
02:33:26,321 --> 02:33:28,373
What was it about?
1867
02:33:34,537 --> 02:33:38,797
That concludes presentation
of documentary evidence
1868
02:33:38,917 --> 02:33:41,254
against these defendants.
1869
02:33:50,053 --> 02:33:52,105
Your Honours,
1870
02:33:53,181 --> 02:33:57,404
during the three years that have passed
since the end of the war in Europe,
1871
02:33:58,270 --> 02:34:02,529
mankind has not crossed
over into Jordan.
1872
02:34:03,441 --> 02:34:06,953
In our own country, fear
of war has been revived
1873
02:34:07,070 --> 02:34:10,664
and we must look once
more to our defences.
1874
02:34:11,575 --> 02:34:16,830
There's talk of cold war while
men and women die in real wars,
1875
02:34:17,706 --> 02:34:25,725
and the echoes of persecution and
atrocities will not be stilled.
1876
02:34:28,341 --> 02:34:34,807
These events cannot help but colour
what happens in this courtroom.
1877
02:34:34,931 --> 02:34:38,644
But somewhere in the
midst of these events,
1878
02:34:39,603 --> 02:34:46,234
the responsibility for the crimes that
we brought forward during this trial
1879
02:34:46,359 --> 02:34:50,831
must be placed in true perspective.
1880
02:34:50,947 --> 02:34:57,211
And this is the decision
that faces Your Honours.
1881
02:34:57,329 --> 02:35:00,259
It is the dilemma of our times.
1882
02:35:02,584 --> 02:35:08,350
It is a dilemma that
rests with you.
1883
02:35:15,055 --> 02:35:17,107
The prosecution rests.
1884
02:35:38,495 --> 02:35:42,552
The defendants may now make
their final statements.
1885
02:35:46,962 --> 02:35:50,972
Defendant Emil Hahn may
address the tribunal.
1886
02:35:55,971 --> 02:36:01,226
Your Honours, I do not evade the
responsibility for my actions.
1887
02:36:02,060 --> 02:36:06,900
On the contrary, I stand by
them before the entire world.
1888
02:36:07,774 --> 02:36:11,368
But I will not follow
the policy of others.
1889
02:36:12,195 --> 02:36:14,876
I will not say of our policy
today that it was wrong
1890
02:36:14,990 --> 02:36:18,336
when yesterday I say it was right.
1891
02:36:18,451 --> 02:36:21,169
Germany was fighting for its life.
1892
02:36:21,288 --> 02:36:24,502
Certain measures were needed to
protect it from its enemies.
1893
02:36:24,624 --> 02:36:27,757
I cannot say that I am sorry
we applied those measures.
1894
02:36:28,378 --> 02:36:31,226
We were a bulwark
against Bolshevism.
1895
02:36:31,339 --> 02:36:35,017
We were a pillar of
Western culture.
1896
02:36:35,468 --> 02:36:39,941
A bulwark and a pillar the
West may yet wish to retain.
1897
02:36:44,269 --> 02:36:49,868
The defendant Friedrich Hofstetter
may address the tribunal.
1898
02:36:56,114 --> 02:36:59,994
I have served my country
throughout my life,
1899
02:37:00,118 --> 02:37:02,669
and in whatever position
I was assigned to,
1900
02:37:02,787 --> 02:37:07,544
in faithfulness, with a pure
heart and without malice.
1901
02:37:08,501 --> 02:37:13,757
I followed the concept that I believed
to be the highest in my profession,
1902
02:37:13,882 --> 02:37:15,969
the concept that says:
1903
02:37:16,092 --> 02:37:22,392
to sacrifice one's own sense of justice
to the authoritative legal order,
1904
02:37:22,515 --> 02:37:25,280
to ask only what the law is,
1905
02:37:26,144 --> 02:37:29,193
and not to ask whether or
not it is also justice.
1906
02:37:30,148 --> 02:37:34,028
As a judge, I could do no other.
1907
02:37:34,152 --> 02:37:38,458
I believe Your Honours will find me,
and millions of Germans like me,
1908
02:37:38,573 --> 02:37:41,752
who believed they were doing
their duty to their country,
1909
02:37:41,868 --> 02:37:45,047
to be not guilty.
1910
02:37:50,043 --> 02:37:53,341
The defendant Werner Lampe
may address the tribunal.
1911
02:38:01,429 --> 02:38:03,481
Your Honours...
1912
02:38:14,693 --> 02:38:16,745
Your Honours...
1913
02:38:35,171 --> 02:38:38,434
The defendant Ernst Janning
may address the tribunal.
1914
02:38:48,768 --> 02:38:52,150
I have nothing to add
to what I have said.
1915
02:39:02,949 --> 02:39:06,497
Testimony has been received,
final arguments have been heard.
1916
02:39:06,620 --> 02:39:12,386
There remains nothing now but the task
of the tribunal to render its decision.
1917
02:39:12,500 --> 02:39:16,558
The tribunal will recess
until further notification.
1918
02:39:37,692 --> 02:39:40,077
I've collected
precedents and arguments
1919
02:39:40,195 --> 02:39:42,532
that have a bearing on
the basis of the case,
1920
02:39:42,656 --> 02:39:46,748
which is the conflict between
allegiance to international law
1921
02:39:46,868 --> 02:39:49,882
and to the laws of
one's own country.
1922
02:39:49,996 --> 02:39:54,505
Dan, we have a mountain of
material to go over here.
1923
02:39:54,626 --> 02:39:56,845
- What are you looking at, Dan?
- Mm?
1924
02:39:56,962 --> 02:40:02,561
I was looking at some of these pictures
attached to the warrants for arrest.
1925
02:40:02,676 --> 02:40:04,728
What pictures?
1926
02:40:05,971 --> 02:40:09,814
There's Petersen before
they operated on him.
1927
02:40:09,933 --> 02:40:11,938
Here's Irene Hoffman.
1928
02:40:12,060 --> 02:40:15,025
She really was 16 once, wasn't she?
1929
02:40:16,398 --> 02:40:18,450
Feldenstein.
1930
02:40:20,569 --> 02:40:25,492
And here's a boy... he certainly
couldn't have been more than 14...
1931
02:40:25,615 --> 02:40:28,712
executed for saying things
against the Third Reich.
1932
02:40:28,827 --> 02:40:32,540
"By order of Justice
Friedrich Hofstetter."
1933
02:40:32,664 --> 02:40:37,089
If I may say so, more pertinent
to the legal basis of the case,
1934
02:40:37,210 --> 02:40:39,595
I have the address of
the French prosecutor
1935
02:40:39,713 --> 02:40:42,347
before the international
military tribunal.
1936
02:40:42,465 --> 02:40:46,060
"It is obvious that, in the state
organised along modem lines,
1937
02:40:46,177 --> 02:40:50,567
responsibility is confined to those
who act directly for the state."
1938
02:40:50,682 --> 02:40:54,609
"Since they alone are in a position to
judge the legitimacy of the given orders,
1939
02:40:54,728 --> 02:40:57,196
they alone can be prosecuted."
1940
02:40:57,314 --> 02:40:59,947
I have another from
Professor Jahreiss...
1941
02:41:00,066 --> 02:41:03,578
"Legal aspects: trial of
the major war criminals".
1942
02:41:03,695 --> 02:41:06,910
On the basis of these, I don't
see where the prosecution
1943
02:41:07,032 --> 02:41:10,164
has put forth a really clear-cut
case against the defence
1944
02:41:10,285 --> 02:41:12,788
pertaining to the charges
in the indictment.
1945
02:41:12,913 --> 02:41:17,053
Regardless of the acts committed,
we cannot make the interpretation
1946
02:41:17,167 --> 02:41:23,798
that these defendants are really
responsible for crimes against humanity.
1947
02:41:24,591 --> 02:41:28,103
- What do you think, Dan?
- We've been going over this all day!
1948
02:41:28,220 --> 02:41:30,272
If it isn't clear now...
1949
02:41:31,723 --> 02:41:34,772
Aren't you going to look
at these precedents?
1950
02:41:34,893 --> 02:41:37,443
Aren't you interested at all?
1951
02:41:39,439 --> 02:41:44,529
I'm interested, Curtiss. You were
speaking of crimes against humanity,
1952
02:41:44,653 --> 02:41:47,999
saying the defendants were not
responsible for their acts.
1953
02:41:48,114 --> 02:41:51,163
I'd like you to explain that to me.
1954
02:41:51,284 --> 02:41:54,298
- I've just been explaining it.
- Maybe.
1955
02:41:54,412 --> 02:41:59,846
But all I've heard is a lot of legalistic
double talk and rationalisation.
1956
02:41:59,960 --> 02:42:03,554
You know, when I
first became a judge
1957
02:42:03,672 --> 02:42:07,385
I knew there were certain people in
town I wasn't supposed to touch.
1958
02:42:07,509 --> 02:42:11,649
I knew that if I was to
remain a judge, this was so.
1959
02:42:12,639 --> 02:42:15,604
But how in God's name do you
expect me to look the other way
1960
02:42:15,725 --> 02:42:17,565
at the murder of six
million people?
1961
02:42:17,686 --> 02:42:21,233
- I'm sure he didn't mean...
- I'm not asking you to look the other way.
1962
02:42:21,356 --> 02:42:25,698
I'm asking you what good is it
going to do to pursue this policy?
1963
02:42:28,321 --> 02:42:32,830
Curtiss, you were saying that the men
are not responsible for their acts.
1964
02:42:32,951 --> 02:42:35,205
You're going to have
to explain that to me.
1965
02:42:35,328 --> 02:42:38,294
You're going to have to
explain it very carefully.
1966
02:42:45,922 --> 02:42:47,844
The tribunal is now in session.
1967
02:42:47,966 --> 02:42:53,981
God bless the United States of America
and this honourable tribunal.
1968
02:43:12,949 --> 02:43:16,331
The trial conducted before this
tribunal began over eight months ago.
1969
02:43:16,453 --> 02:43:20,629
The record of evidence is
more than 10,000 pages long,
1970
02:43:20,749 --> 02:43:25,304
and final arguments of
counsel have been concluded.
1971
02:43:26,838 --> 02:43:30,101
Simple murders and atrocities
1972
02:43:30,216 --> 02:43:34,891
do not constitute the gravamen of
the charges in this indictment.
1973
02:43:35,013 --> 02:43:40,363
Rather, the charge is that
of conscious participation
1974
02:43:40,477 --> 02:43:46,278
in a nationwide, government-organised
system of cruelty and injustice,
1975
02:43:47,108 --> 02:43:53,870
in violation of every moral and legal
principle known to all civilised nations.
1976
02:43:54,824 --> 02:43:59,047
The tribunal has carefully
studied the record
1977
02:43:59,162 --> 02:44:03,671
and found therein abundant evidence
1978
02:44:03,792 --> 02:44:10,222
to support beyond a reasonable doubt
the charges against these defendants.
1979
02:44:21,601 --> 02:44:26,489
Herr Rolfe, in his
very skilful defence,
1980
02:44:27,148 --> 02:44:32,119
has asserted that there are others
1981
02:44:32,237 --> 02:44:35,167
who must share the
ultimate responsibility
1982
02:44:35,282 --> 02:44:37,832
for what happened here in Germany.
1983
02:44:37,951 --> 02:44:40,003
There is truth in this.
1984
02:44:41,162 --> 02:44:47,426
The real complaining party at the bar
in this courtroom is civilisation.
1985
02:44:49,004 --> 02:44:53,974
But the tribunal does say
that the men in the dock
1986
02:44:54,092 --> 02:44:57,189
are responsible for their actions.
1987
02:44:59,014 --> 02:45:02,691
Men who sat in black robes,
1988
02:45:04,185 --> 02:45:07,069
in judgment on other men.
1989
02:45:09,274 --> 02:45:15,787
Men who took part in the
enactment of laws and decrees,
1990
02:45:18,742 --> 02:45:22,965
the purpose of which was the
extermination of human beings.
1991
02:45:23,079 --> 02:45:26,176
Men who, in executive positions,
1992
02:45:26,291 --> 02:45:31,380
actively participated in the
enforcement of these laws,
1993
02:45:31,504 --> 02:45:34,719
illegal even under German law.
1994
02:45:40,972 --> 02:45:47,983
The principle of criminal law
in every civilised society
1995
02:45:48,104 --> 02:45:50,441
has this in common:
1996
02:45:51,942 --> 02:45:57,292
any person who sways
another to commit murder,
1997
02:45:58,782 --> 02:46:05,212
any person who furnishes the lethal
weapon for the purpose of the crime,
1998
02:46:06,456 --> 02:46:10,169
any person who is an
accessory to the crime,
1999
02:46:11,920 --> 02:46:13,972
is guilty.
2000
02:46:18,176 --> 02:46:24,357
Herr Rolfe further asserts
that the defendant Janning
2001
02:46:26,226 --> 02:46:28,445
was an extraordinary jurist
2002
02:46:28,562 --> 02:46:32,025
and acted in what he thought was
the best interest of his country.
2003
02:46:32,148 --> 02:46:34,485
There is truth in this also.
2004
02:46:36,528 --> 02:46:41,083
Janning, to be sure,
is a tragic figure.
2005
02:46:41,658 --> 02:46:45,252
We believe he loathed
the evil he did.
2006
02:46:45,370 --> 02:46:48,751
But compassion for the
present torture of his soul
2007
02:46:48,873 --> 02:46:51,175
must not beget forgetfulness
2008
02:46:51,293 --> 02:46:57,758
of the torture and the death of millions
by the government of which he was part.
2009
02:46:57,882 --> 02:47:01,845
Janning's record and his fate
illuminate the most shattering truth
2010
02:47:01,970 --> 02:47:04,271
that has emerged from this trial.
2011
02:47:04,389 --> 02:47:09,739
If he, and all of the other defendants,
had been degraded perverts,
2012
02:47:09,853 --> 02:47:16,153
if all of the leaders of the Third Reich
had been sadistic monsters and maniacs,
2013
02:47:16,276 --> 02:47:20,369
then these events would have
no more moral significance
2014
02:47:20,488 --> 02:47:24,083
than an earthquake, or any
other natural catastrophe.
2015
02:47:24,200 --> 02:47:30,334
But this trial has shown
that under a national crisis
2016
02:47:30,457 --> 02:47:35,297
ordinary, even able and
extraordinary men,
2017
02:47:35,420 --> 02:47:39,347
can delude themselves into
the commission of crimes
2018
02:47:39,466 --> 02:47:42,764
so vast and heinous that
they beggar the imagination.
2019
02:47:42,886 --> 02:47:46,148
No one who has sat through the
trial can ever forget them.
2020
02:47:47,557 --> 02:47:51,188
Men sterilised because
of political belief.
2021
02:47:51,311 --> 02:47:54,609
A mockery made of
friendship and faith.
2022
02:47:54,731 --> 02:47:56,783
The murder of children.
2023
02:47:57,984 --> 02:48:00,120
How easily it can happen.
2024
02:48:01,947 --> 02:48:04,117
There are those in
our own country too
2025
02:48:04,241 --> 02:48:08,962
who today speak of the protection
of country, of survival.
2026
02:48:09,079 --> 02:48:12,425
A decision must be made in
the life of every nation.
2027
02:48:12,540 --> 02:48:16,633
At the very moment when the grasp
of the enemy is at its throat,
2028
02:48:16,753 --> 02:48:20,633
then it seems that the only way to survive
is to use the means of the enemy,
2029
02:48:20,757 --> 02:48:23,438
to rest survival upon
what is expedient,
2030
02:48:23,551 --> 02:48:25,853
to look the other way.
2031
02:48:26,846 --> 02:48:32,897
Well, the answer to that is...
survival as what?
2032
02:48:33,019 --> 02:48:35,321
A country isn't a rock.
2033
02:48:35,438 --> 02:48:38,072
It's not an extension
of one's self.
2034
02:48:38,191 --> 02:48:40,327
It's what it stands for.
2035
02:48:40,443 --> 02:48:46,874
It's what it stands for when standing
for something is the most difficult.
2036
02:48:48,994 --> 02:48:51,924
Before the people of the world,
2037
02:48:52,038 --> 02:48:59,014
let it now be noted that here, in our
decision, this is what we stand for:
2038
02:49:00,088 --> 02:49:02,769
justice, truth...
2039
02:49:05,468 --> 02:49:08,648
and the value of a
single human being.
2040
02:49:19,399 --> 02:49:23,030
The marshal will produce before
the tribunal the defendant Hahn.
2041
02:49:25,947 --> 02:49:28,083
Emil Hahn,
2042
02:49:28,199 --> 02:49:32,838
the tribunal finds you guilty and
sentences you to life imprisonment.
2043
02:49:32,954 --> 02:49:38,341
Today you sentence me. Tomorrow
the Bolsheviks sentence you!
2044
02:49:43,340 --> 02:49:50,102
The marshal will produce the defendant
Hofstetter before the tribunal.
2045
02:49:51,056 --> 02:49:53,108
Fried rich Hofstetter,
2046
02:49:53,225 --> 02:49:59,322
the tribunal finds you guilty and
sentences you to life imprisonment.
2047
02:50:02,275 --> 02:50:08,077
The marshal will produce the
defendant Lampe before the tribunal.
2048
02:50:12,494 --> 02:50:14,546
Werner Lampe,
2049
02:50:15,830 --> 02:50:21,928
the tribunal finds you guilty and
sentences you to life imprisonment.
2050
02:50:31,388 --> 02:50:36,027
The marshal will produce the defendant
Ernst Janning before the tribunal.
2051
02:50:51,449 --> 02:50:53,501
Ernst Janning,
2052
02:50:54,744 --> 02:51:00,344
the tribunal finds you guilty and
sentences you to life imprisonment.
2053
02:51:06,089 --> 02:51:08,141
He doesn't understand.
2054
02:51:09,301 --> 02:51:11,769
He just doesn't understand.
2055
02:51:12,470 --> 02:51:14,522
He understands.
2056
02:51:28,028 --> 02:51:30,496
Justice Ives dissenting.
2057
02:51:32,741 --> 02:51:38,507
I wish to point out strongly my dissenting
vote from the decision of this tribunal
2058
02:51:38,622 --> 02:51:44,470
as stated by Justice Haywood, and
in which Justice Norris concurred.
2059
02:51:44,586 --> 02:51:47,551
The issue of the actions
of the defendants,
2060
02:51:47,672 --> 02:51:51,848
who believed they were acting in the
best interests of their country,
2061
02:51:51,968 --> 02:51:57,271
is an issue that cannot be
decided in a courtroom alone.
2062
02:51:57,390 --> 02:52:00,653
It can only be decided objectively,
2063
02:52:00,769 --> 02:52:05,324
in years to come, in the
true perspective of history.
2064
02:52:12,364 --> 02:52:14,998
Where shall I put these
books, Your Honour?
2065
02:52:15,116 --> 02:52:18,296
Put them in the
trunk, Mr Halbestadt.
2066
02:52:20,372 --> 02:52:24,713
Your Honour, here's something
for you to have on the plane.
2067
02:52:24,834 --> 02:52:29,639
Oh, no. If you give me any more food,
I won't have any room for anything else.
2068
02:52:29,756 --> 02:52:32,057
But it's strudel, the
way you like it.
2069
02:52:32,175 --> 02:52:35,853
- Thank you. Thank you for everything.
- Ja, ja.
2070
02:52:35,971 --> 02:52:38,023
- I'll put it in the car.
- Thanks.
2071
02:52:38,139 --> 02:52:43,443
Tickets, passport, immunisation. I'll
have your boarding pass at the airport.
2072
02:52:43,562 --> 02:52:45,946
See you there no later
than three o'clock.
2073
02:52:46,064 --> 02:52:48,912
Oh, and give my regards to Miss...
what was her name?
2074
02:52:49,025 --> 02:52:51,362
Scheffler. Elsa.
2075
02:52:51,486 --> 02:52:54,037
- That's one you owe me.
- What do you mean?
2076
02:52:54,155 --> 02:52:59,209
Americans aren't very popular
in Nuremberg this morning.
2077
02:53:58,637 --> 02:54:01,851
- Good afternoon, Your Honour.
- Good afternoon.
2078
02:54:03,141 --> 02:54:07,780
I came here at the request
of my client, Ernst Janning.
2079
02:54:09,481 --> 02:54:12,115
He wishes to see you.
2080
02:54:12,234 --> 02:54:15,117
I'm just leaving for the airport.
2081
02:54:16,321 --> 02:54:19,915
He says it would mean
a great deal to him.
2082
02:54:26,248 --> 02:54:30,174
Have you heard about the
verdict in the IG Farben case?
2083
02:54:30,293 --> 02:54:34,765
Most of them were acquitted.
The others received light sentences.
2084
02:54:34,881 --> 02:54:39,141
- The verdict came in today.
- No, I hadn't heard.
2085
02:54:39,261 --> 02:54:41,811
I will make you a wager.
2086
02:54:41,930 --> 02:54:44,398
I don't make wagers.
2087
02:54:44,516 --> 02:54:46,272
A gentlemen's wager.
2088
02:54:47,644 --> 02:54:53,410
In five years, the men you sentenced
to life imprisonment will be free.
2089
02:54:56,444 --> 02:55:00,667
Herr Rolfe, I have admired your work
in the courtroom for many months.
2090
02:55:00,782 --> 02:55:05,005
You are particularly brilliant
in your use of logic.
2091
02:55:05,120 --> 02:55:10,293
So, what you suggest
may very well happen.
2092
02:55:10,417 --> 02:55:14,759
It is logical, in view of
the times in which we live.
2093
02:55:15,755 --> 02:55:19,018
But to be logical
is not to be right.
2094
02:55:19,134 --> 02:55:22,432
And nothing on God's earth
could ever make it right.
2095
02:55:33,356 --> 02:55:35,408
Someone to see you.
2096
02:55:47,537 --> 02:55:49,589
Herr Janning.
2097
02:55:51,041 --> 02:55:53,093
Judge Haywood.
2098
02:55:54,836 --> 02:55:57,055
Please, sit down.
2099
02:55:57,797 --> 02:56:01,261
Thank you. You wanted to see me.
2100
02:56:01,384 --> 02:56:05,644
Yes. There is something
I want to give you.
2101
02:56:05,764 --> 02:56:07,816
A record.
2102
02:56:09,184 --> 02:56:13,111
A record of my cases,
the ones I remember.
2103
02:56:14,606 --> 02:56:18,616
I want to give them to
someone I can trust,
2104
02:56:18,735 --> 02:56:22,033
someone I felt I got to
know during the trial.
2105
02:56:28,536 --> 02:56:30,589
Thank you.
2106
02:56:32,666 --> 02:56:35,050
I'll take good care of them.
2107
02:56:35,168 --> 02:56:39,973
I know the pressures that
had been brought upon you.
2108
02:56:40,090 --> 02:56:42,474
You will be criticised greatly.
2109
02:56:42,592 --> 02:56:45,974
Your decision will not
be a popular one.
2110
02:56:47,889 --> 02:56:51,152
But, if it means anything to you,
2111
02:56:51,268 --> 02:56:56,785
you have the respect of at least
one of the men you convicted.
2112
02:56:56,898 --> 02:57:02,664
By all that is right in this world,
your verdict was a just one.
2113
02:57:04,364 --> 02:57:06,416
Thank you.
2114
02:57:07,909 --> 02:57:12,251
What you said in the courtroom,
it needed to be said.
2115
02:57:12,372 --> 02:57:14,009
Judge Haywood...
2116
02:57:17,419 --> 02:57:19,720
The reason I asked you to come...
2117
02:57:27,470 --> 02:57:32,026
Those people, those
millions of people,
2118
02:57:34,185 --> 02:57:37,567
I never knew it would come to that.
2119
02:57:37,689 --> 02:57:41,651
You must believe it.
You must believe it.
2120
02:57:44,905 --> 02:57:48,784
Herr Janning, it came to that
2121
02:57:48,909 --> 02:57:53,713
the first time you sentenced a man
to death you knew to be innocent.