1
00:07:03,790 --> 00:07:05,917
I didn't know it was so bad.
2
00:07:06,325 --> 00:07:10,659
Couple of incendiaries,
these old buildings go up like cellophane.
3
00:07:12,298 --> 00:07:15,927
There's a wall that separates
the old section of Nuremberg from the new.
4
00:07:16,002 --> 00:07:17,560
Goes back to...
5
00:07:18,571 --> 00:07:20,368
How far does it go back, Schmidt?
6
00:07:20,440 --> 00:07:22,908
- 1219, sir.
- 1219.
7
00:07:25,344 --> 00:07:29,007
This is where the Nazi Party
held their rallies, isn't it?
8
00:07:29,282 --> 00:07:33,309
They all came here.
Hitler. Goebbels. The whole crew.
9
00:07:33,553 --> 00:07:36,351
Thousands of them, from all over Germany.
10
00:07:44,263 --> 00:07:47,164
Does he have to blow that damn horn
so much?
11
00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:50,767
It's not necessary
to blow the horn so much, Schmidt.
12
00:08:02,648 --> 00:08:04,673
You both know your duties?
13
00:08:04,951 --> 00:08:08,011
Well, here we are.
A little bit of old Germany.
14
00:08:08,254 --> 00:08:09,983
- Senator Burkette.
- Captain.
15
00:08:10,056 --> 00:08:12,183
Captain Byers, this is Judge Haywood.
16
00:08:12,258 --> 00:08:14,818
- Byers here will be your aide.
- My what?
17
00:08:14,894 --> 00:08:18,523
Clerk. General guide. Liaison.
Any capacity you wish to use me in.
18
00:08:18,598 --> 00:08:21,192
This will be your staff, sir.
Mr. And Mrs. Halbestadt.
19
00:08:21,267 --> 00:08:22,325
Hello.
20
00:08:22,401 --> 00:08:25,199
- Good afternoon.
- Good afternoon, Your Honor.
21
00:08:25,271 --> 00:08:26,329
Welcome.
22
00:08:26,405 --> 00:08:28,270
You've already met your driver, Schmidt.
23
00:08:28,341 --> 00:08:31,139
I am at your service any time you need me.
Day or night.
24
00:08:31,210 --> 00:08:32,404
Thanks.
25
00:08:32,478 --> 00:08:35,174
Let's show him around
the rest of the place. Dan?
26
00:08:35,248 --> 00:08:37,375
We're in the reception room.
27
00:08:39,385 --> 00:08:40,784
Living room.
28
00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:42,444
Study is in there.
29
00:08:42,522 --> 00:08:45,923
There are two bedrooms on this floor,
three upstairs.
30
00:08:47,727 --> 00:08:50,525
Furniture is part antique, part US Army.
31
00:08:55,735 --> 00:09:00,001
The piano's showing signs of wear and tear,
but it's a genuine Bechstein.
32
00:09:00,573 --> 00:09:02,700
Quite a view, isn't it, sir?
33
00:09:06,445 --> 00:09:09,039
Senator, I really don't need all this.
34
00:09:09,482 --> 00:09:11,950
The United States government
always does it right.
35
00:09:12,018 --> 00:09:13,986
- You know that, Dan.
- Who used to live here?
36
00:09:14,053 --> 00:09:16,283
An important Nazi general and his wife, sir.
37
00:09:16,355 --> 00:09:19,381
Let's see. Is there anything else
Judge Haywood ought to know?
38
00:09:19,458 --> 00:09:21,323
Sir, are there any questions?
39
00:09:21,394 --> 00:09:22,486
Yes.
40
00:09:23,529 --> 00:09:25,997
- You're West Point, aren't you, Captain?
- Yes, sir.
41
00:09:26,065 --> 00:09:28,863
- What's your first name?
- Harrison. Harry.
42
00:09:29,101 --> 00:09:31,262
Harry, look, I'm not West Point.
43
00:09:31,337 --> 00:09:35,899
And all this formality gets me down a little,
not to say puts me ill at ease.
44
00:09:35,975 --> 00:09:39,001
Do you think it would be
too much an infraction of the rules...
45
00:09:39,078 --> 00:09:41,945
if you were to call me Judge,
or Dan, or something?
46
00:09:42,014 --> 00:09:43,413
Okay, Judge.
47
00:09:43,482 --> 00:09:45,473
We shop at the army commissary.
48
00:09:45,551 --> 00:09:48,315
There isn't enough food at the local markets
for the Germans.
49
00:09:48,387 --> 00:09:49,786
The driver knows where it is.
50
00:09:49,855 --> 00:09:53,882
Here's a copy of the indictment of the case.
Thought you might want to look it over.
51
00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:56,292
I hope you'll be comfortable here, sir.
52
00:09:56,362 --> 00:09:59,889
Captain, I think the whole state of Maine
would be comfortable here.
53
00:09:59,966 --> 00:10:02,594
My office is next to yours
at the Palace of Justice...
54
00:10:02,668 --> 00:10:04,465
- if you need anything.
- Thank you.
55
00:10:04,537 --> 00:10:05,765
Senator?
56
00:10:12,011 --> 00:10:14,536
Do you think
I really need the three servants?
57
00:10:14,614 --> 00:10:17,105
It kind of makes me feel like a damn fool.
58
00:10:17,984 --> 00:10:21,545
It helps them out, as well as you.
You see, here they eat.
59
00:10:22,989 --> 00:10:25,116
I need three servants.
60
00:10:26,225 --> 00:10:29,160
It's good to have a man
of your stature here, Dan.
61
00:10:29,228 --> 00:10:30,354
Sure.
62
00:10:30,663 --> 00:10:34,030
I was the only man in America
qualified for this job.
63
00:10:34,567 --> 00:10:37,661
Senator, you know I wasn't the first choice,
nor even the tenth.
64
00:10:37,737 --> 00:10:39,864
- You know it, and I know it.
- What do you mean?
65
00:10:39,939 --> 00:10:42,965
Let's face it.
Hitler is gone, Goebbels is gone.
66
00:10:43,042 --> 00:10:45,909
Goering is gone. Committed suicide
before they could hang him.
67
00:10:45,978 --> 00:10:49,744
Now we're down to the business of judging
the doctors, businessmen and judges.
68
00:10:49,815 --> 00:10:52,045
Some people think
they shouldn't be judged at all.
69
00:10:52,118 --> 00:10:53,142
So?
70
00:10:53,586 --> 00:10:56,953
So it makes for a hell of a lack of candidates
for the job.
71
00:10:57,023 --> 00:11:00,891
You had to beat the backwoods of Maine
to come up with a hick like me.
72
00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:02,951
I hope you're not sorry you came.
73
00:11:03,029 --> 00:11:05,020
No. I'm not sorry I came.
74
00:11:05,097 --> 00:11:08,260
I just wanted you to know
that I know where the body is buried.
75
00:11:08,334 --> 00:11:10,734
No, I think the trials should go on.
76
00:11:10,803 --> 00:11:14,466
Especially the trials of the German judges.
I hope I'm up to it.
77
00:11:15,174 --> 00:11:16,801
You're up to it.
78
00:11:17,109 --> 00:11:18,406
Relax.
79
00:11:18,978 --> 00:11:20,036
Thanks.
80
00:11:20,112 --> 00:11:22,342
Enjoy this place while you can.
81
00:11:22,415 --> 00:11:24,474
You're going to be a pretty busy fellow.
82
00:11:24,550 --> 00:11:26,245
Thanks for everything, Senator.
83
00:11:26,318 --> 00:11:28,548
- See you tomorrow, Judge.
- Right.
84
00:11:29,588 --> 00:11:32,148
Shall we take these upstairs?
85
00:11:32,625 --> 00:11:34,388
Yes. Thank you.
86
00:11:37,830 --> 00:11:41,732
- Here, I can take that...
- No, let me take it. Please.
87
00:12:17,803 --> 00:12:19,361
Here they come.
88
00:12:51,036 --> 00:12:53,334
The tribunal is now in session.
89
00:12:53,439 --> 00:12:56,966
God bless the United States
and this honorable tribunal.
90
00:13:31,143 --> 00:13:33,907
The tribunal will now arraign
the defendants.
91
00:13:33,979 --> 00:13:38,109
The microphone will be placed
in front of the defendant, Emil Hahn.
92
00:13:43,856 --> 00:13:45,255
Emil Hahn?
93
00:13:45,324 --> 00:13:48,259
Are you represented by counsel
before this tribunal?
94
00:13:53,499 --> 00:13:54,830
Not guilty.
95
00:13:54,900 --> 00:13:58,392
The question was, are you represented
by counsel before this tribunal?
96
00:14:03,642 --> 00:14:05,075
I am represented.
97
00:14:05,144 --> 00:14:08,011
How do you plead to the charges
and specifications...
98
00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:11,379
in the indictment against you?
Guilty or not guilty?
99
00:14:13,652 --> 00:14:15,677
Not guilty on all counts.
100
00:14:16,555 --> 00:14:18,420
Friedrich Hoffstetter?
101
00:14:20,292 --> 00:14:23,420
Are you represented by counsel
before this tribunal?
102
00:14:25,130 --> 00:14:26,461
I am represented.
103
00:14:26,532 --> 00:14:29,228
How do you plead? Guilty or not guilty?
104
00:14:32,104 --> 00:14:33,765
You may be seated.
105
00:14:38,844 --> 00:14:40,368
Werner Lammpe?
106
00:14:45,551 --> 00:14:48,850
Are you represented by counsel
before this tribunal?
107
00:14:49,221 --> 00:14:50,449
Counsel?
108
00:14:55,060 --> 00:14:57,460
Yes, of course. I am represented.
109
00:14:58,797 --> 00:15:02,255
How do you plead to the charges?
Guilty or not guilty?
110
00:15:05,204 --> 00:15:06,865
You may be seated.
111
00:15:09,708 --> 00:15:11,232
Ernst Janning?
112
00:15:12,711 --> 00:15:16,010
Are you represented by counsel
before this tribunal?
113
00:15:35,734 --> 00:15:39,033
Are you represented by counsel
before this tribunal?
114
00:15:49,848 --> 00:15:52,476
I represent the defendant, Your Honor.
115
00:15:53,385 --> 00:15:57,082
How do you plead to the charges
and specifications set forth...
116
00:15:57,156 --> 00:16:00,455
in the indictment against you?
Guilty or not guilty?
117
00:16:04,897 --> 00:16:07,422
Your Honor, may I address the court?
118
00:16:19,411 --> 00:16:22,505
The defendant does not recognize
the authority of this tribunal...
119
00:16:22,581 --> 00:16:26,142
and wishes to lodge a formal protest
in lieu of pleading.
120
00:16:26,652 --> 00:16:29,246
A plea of "not guilty" will be entered.
121
00:16:43,335 --> 00:16:46,429
The prosecution
will begin its opening address.
122
00:16:47,906 --> 00:16:49,237
Slow and easy, Junior.
123
00:17:03,956 --> 00:17:05,787
The case is unusual...
124
00:17:06,692 --> 00:17:09,422
in that the defendants
are charged with crimes...
125
00:17:09,495 --> 00:17:11,929
committed in the name of the law.
126
00:17:12,965 --> 00:17:16,992
These men, together with their deceased
or fugitive colleagues...
127
00:17:18,337 --> 00:17:22,933
are the embodiment of what passed
for justice during the Third Reich.
128
00:17:24,243 --> 00:17:28,509
The defendants served as judges
during the period of the Third Reich.
129
00:17:29,648 --> 00:17:33,106
Therefore, you, Your Honors,
as judges on the bench...
130
00:17:33,419 --> 00:17:35,683
will be sitting in judgment...
131
00:17:36,455 --> 00:17:38,355
of judges in the dock.
132
00:17:40,125 --> 00:17:42,252
And this is as it should be.
133
00:17:42,761 --> 00:17:47,130
For only a judge knows
how much more a court is than a courtroom.
134
00:17:48,700 --> 00:17:50,895
It is a process and a spirit.
135
00:17:52,571 --> 00:17:54,471
It is the house of law.
136
00:17:57,009 --> 00:18:00,570
The defendants knew this, too.
They knew courtrooms well.
137
00:18:00,846 --> 00:18:02,575
They sat in their black robes...
138
00:18:02,648 --> 00:18:07,108
and they distorted, they perverted,
they destroyed justice and law in Germany.
139
00:18:07,186 --> 00:18:10,451
Will the prosecution please watch the light?
140
00:18:11,323 --> 00:18:14,656
- The interpreter cannot follow you.
- I'm sorry, Your Honor.
141
00:18:14,827 --> 00:18:17,762
They distorted, they perverted...
142
00:18:18,130 --> 00:18:21,691
they destroyed justice and law in Germany.
143
00:18:23,435 --> 00:18:26,598
Now, this in itself
is undoubtedly a great crime.
144
00:18:26,772 --> 00:18:29,366
But the prosecution
is not calling the defendants...
145
00:18:29,441 --> 00:18:32,842
to account for violating
constitutional guarantees...
146
00:18:32,911 --> 00:18:35,379
or withholding due process of law.
147
00:18:36,215 --> 00:18:39,150
The prosecution
is calling them to account...
148
00:18:39,918 --> 00:18:41,283
for murder...
149
00:18:42,254 --> 00:18:43,687
brutalities...
150
00:18:45,090 --> 00:18:46,352
torture...
151
00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:48,758
atrocities.
152
00:18:49,795 --> 00:18:53,561
They share with all the leaders
of the Third Reich...
153
00:18:53,632 --> 00:18:57,193
responsibility for the most malignant,
the most calculated...
154
00:18:57,269 --> 00:19:00,932
the most devastating crimes
in the history of all mankind.
155
00:19:01,807 --> 00:19:04,970
And they are perhaps more guilty
than some of the others.
156
00:19:05,043 --> 00:19:09,446
For they had attained maturity
long before Hitler's rise to power.
157
00:19:10,215 --> 00:19:14,379
Their minds weren't warped at an early age
by Nazi teachings.
158
00:19:15,053 --> 00:19:19,956
They embraced the ideologies
of the Third Reich as educated adults...
159
00:19:20,692 --> 00:19:23,627
when they, most of all...
160
00:19:23,695 --> 00:19:25,788
should have valued justice.
161
00:19:31,603 --> 00:19:34,936
Here they'll receive the justice
they denied others.
162
00:19:37,242 --> 00:19:41,736
They'll be judged according to the evidence
presented in this courtroom.
163
00:19:42,381 --> 00:19:44,815
The prosecution asks nothing more.
164
00:19:48,887 --> 00:19:52,584
Herr Rolfe will make the opening statement
for the defense.
165
00:20:08,340 --> 00:20:10,535
May it please the tribunal...
166
00:20:12,978 --> 00:20:15,276
it is not only a great honor...
167
00:20:17,416 --> 00:20:19,008
but also a great challenge...
168
00:20:19,785 --> 00:20:21,184
for an advocate...
169
00:20:23,121 --> 00:20:25,555
to aid this tribunal in its task.
170
00:20:28,093 --> 00:20:29,685
The entire civilized world...
171
00:20:31,129 --> 00:20:33,029
will follow closely what we do here.
172
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:36,968
For this is not an ordinary trial...
173
00:20:38,403 --> 00:20:41,338
by any means
of the accepted, parochial sense.
174
00:20:44,276 --> 00:20:46,073
The avowed purpose of this tribunal...
175
00:20:46,144 --> 00:20:49,705
Is broader than the visiting of retribution
on a few men.
176
00:20:50,749 --> 00:20:54,480
It is dedicated to the reconsecration...
177
00:20:55,587 --> 00:20:57,578
of the temple of justice.
178
00:20:57,656 --> 00:21:00,784
It is dedicated to finding a code of justice...
179
00:21:00,993 --> 00:21:03,723
the whole world will be responsible to.
180
00:21:07,132 --> 00:21:09,566
How will this code be established?
181
00:21:12,738 --> 00:21:14,729
It will be established...
182
00:21:17,509 --> 00:21:18,999
in a clear...
183
00:21:20,045 --> 00:21:22,570
honest evaluation...
184
00:21:22,648 --> 00:21:27,517
of the responsibility for the crimes
in the indictment stated by the prosecution.
185
00:21:28,920 --> 00:21:33,254
In the words of the great American jurist,
Oliver Wendell Holmes:
186
00:21:34,493 --> 00:21:37,587
"This responsibility will not be found
only in documents...
187
00:21:37,663 --> 00:21:40,029
"that no one contests or denies.
188
00:21:40,732 --> 00:21:44,896
"It will be found in considerations
of a political or social nature.
189
00:21:46,138 --> 00:21:49,198
"It will be found, most of all...
190
00:21:50,776 --> 00:21:52,801
"in the character of men. "
191
00:21:55,514 --> 00:21:58,210
What is the character of Ernst Janning?
192
00:22:00,552 --> 00:22:03,146
Let us examine his life for a moment.
193
00:22:04,656 --> 00:22:06,453
He was born in 1885.
194
00:22:07,159 --> 00:22:10,128
Received the degree
of Doctor of Law in 1907.
195
00:22:10,195 --> 00:22:12,959
Became a judge in East Prussia in 1940.
196
00:22:13,031 --> 00:22:16,694
Following WWI, he became one
of the leaders of the Weimar Republic...
197
00:22:16,768 --> 00:22:19,669
and was one of the framers
of its democratic constitution.
198
00:22:19,738 --> 00:22:22,536
In subsequent years
he achieved international fame...
199
00:22:22,607 --> 00:22:26,805
not only for his work as a great jurist,
but also as the author of legal text books...
200
00:22:26,878 --> 00:22:29,870
which are still used in universities
all over the world.
201
00:22:29,948 --> 00:22:33,816
He became Minister of Justice
in Germany in 1935.
202
00:22:35,020 --> 00:22:37,853
If Ernst Janning is to be found guilty...
203
00:22:38,357 --> 00:22:40,825
certain implications must arise.
204
00:22:41,593 --> 00:22:45,256
A judge does not make the laws.
205
00:22:46,865 --> 00:22:49,595
He carries out the laws of his country.
206
00:22:50,836 --> 00:22:52,565
The statement:
207
00:22:52,637 --> 00:22:55,299
"My country, right or wrong... "
208
00:22:56,508 --> 00:22:59,341
was expressed by a great American patriot.
209
00:23:01,747 --> 00:23:04,477
It is no less true for a German patriot.
210
00:23:08,253 --> 00:23:12,087
Should Ernst Janning have carried out
the laws of his country?
211
00:23:12,157 --> 00:23:16,150
Or should he have refused to carry them out
and become a traitor?
212
00:23:16,762 --> 00:23:20,391
This is the crux of the issue
at the bottom of this trial.
213
00:23:24,336 --> 00:23:27,828
The defense is as dedicated
to finding responsibility...
214
00:23:29,107 --> 00:23:31,007
as is the prosecution.
215
00:23:32,711 --> 00:23:36,442
For it is not only Ernst Janning
who is on trial here...
216
00:23:40,685 --> 00:23:42,676
it is the German people.
217
00:23:46,758 --> 00:23:50,091
The tribunal will recess
until further notification.
218
00:24:27,833 --> 00:24:31,633
If it's all right with you,
Byers can file these briefs later.
219
00:24:32,938 --> 00:24:36,635
That was quite a damning speech
by Col. Lawson, wasn't it?
220
00:24:37,509 --> 00:24:40,740
I wonder if those men in the dock
can really be responsible...
221
00:24:40,812 --> 00:24:42,939
for the things he listed in the indictment.
222
00:24:43,014 --> 00:24:45,881
I've been here for two years,
and after that long...
223
00:24:45,951 --> 00:24:49,546
you find that responsibility
is not a cut-and-dried thing.
224
00:24:49,988 --> 00:24:52,354
What are you fellows up to
over the weekend?
225
00:24:52,424 --> 00:24:54,858
My wife and I are going to Li�ge.
226
00:24:54,926 --> 00:24:57,156
There's nothing in Li�ge. I've been there.
227
00:24:57,229 --> 00:24:59,197
My son was in the 101st.
228
00:24:59,264 --> 00:25:02,290
He's buried in the American cemetery
outside Li�ge.
229
00:25:02,901 --> 00:25:04,266
I'm sorry.
230
00:25:04,636 --> 00:25:06,263
That's all right.
231
00:25:06,338 --> 00:25:08,101
See you Monday, Dan.
232
00:25:09,841 --> 00:25:11,308
Coming my way?
233
00:25:11,376 --> 00:25:15,540
No, I'm going to stay here for a moment.
I'm waiting for some records from Byers.
234
00:25:15,614 --> 00:25:16,774
Right.
235
00:25:38,603 --> 00:25:40,537
Here are the reports you asked for, sir.
236
00:25:40,605 --> 00:25:41,970
Thank you.
237
00:25:44,376 --> 00:25:49,040
Captain, do you think you can get me a copy
of the books Ernst Janning wrote?
238
00:25:49,414 --> 00:25:52,508
- There are quite a few of them.
- I'd like all of them.
239
00:25:52,584 --> 00:25:55,052
And also a copy of the Weimar constitution.
240
00:25:55,120 --> 00:25:57,384
- Do you think you can get that for me?
- Of course.
241
00:25:57,455 --> 00:25:58,786
Thank you.
242
00:26:02,794 --> 00:26:05,991
- How long have you been here, Captain?
- Two years.
243
00:26:06,064 --> 00:26:08,862
- Two years? That's a long time.
- Yes, sir.
244
00:26:09,034 --> 00:26:11,025
- Any friends?
- Sure.
245
00:26:13,171 --> 00:26:14,695
German friends?
246
00:26:14,906 --> 00:26:15,964
Yes.
247
00:26:16,808 --> 00:26:18,002
A girl?
248
00:26:18,276 --> 00:26:19,436
Yes.
249
00:26:20,312 --> 00:26:23,338
Her parents were Nazis,
but she was eight when they came in.
250
00:26:23,415 --> 00:26:25,110
- I didn't ask you that.
- I know.
251
00:26:25,183 --> 00:26:28,516
But maybe you were thinking it.
It's natural to think about it.
252
00:26:28,587 --> 00:26:32,148
I thought if anybody was going to
indoctrinate her, it might as well be me.
253
00:26:32,223 --> 00:26:33,417
Will there be anything else?
254
00:26:33,491 --> 00:26:36,153
No, I think I'll just take a walk around town
on my own.
255
00:26:36,227 --> 00:26:39,196
Try the old section.
Everyone stops for beer and sausage there.
256
00:26:39,264 --> 00:26:40,595
Thank you.
257
00:28:10,221 --> 00:28:12,553
- Do you understand English?
- Yes, a little.
258
00:28:12,624 --> 00:28:16,060
- What did she say?
- She said, "Goodbye, Grandpa. "
259
00:29:30,168 --> 00:29:31,863
Are they treating you all right?
260
00:29:31,936 --> 00:29:34,427
Yes. They're treating me all right.
261
00:29:34,539 --> 00:29:36,700
We still have some friends...
262
00:29:37,142 --> 00:29:39,940
who have contact
with the American authorities.
263
00:29:40,145 --> 00:29:42,579
I can tell them
if they're not treating you all right.
264
00:29:42,647 --> 00:29:44,877
They're treating me all right.
265
00:29:47,752 --> 00:29:49,379
Dr. Janning...
266
00:29:51,823 --> 00:29:54,348
we are both in an embarrassing position.
267
00:29:54,425 --> 00:29:56,620
I know you didn't want me as your counsel.
268
00:29:56,694 --> 00:29:58,889
I know you didn't want anyone.
269
00:30:00,298 --> 00:30:04,166
But I must tell you something.
Will you listen to me?
270
00:30:04,669 --> 00:30:05,761
Yes.
271
00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:12,701
I intend to represent your case
with complete dignity.
272
00:30:13,978 --> 00:30:15,309
There will be...
273
00:30:16,481 --> 00:30:20,975
no appeal to sentiment,
no falling at the mercy of the court.
274
00:30:21,619 --> 00:30:22,984
The game...
275
00:30:24,355 --> 00:30:27,654
will be played according to their own rules.
276
00:30:29,394 --> 00:30:34,058
We'll see whether they have the courage
to sit in judgment on a man like you.
277
00:30:35,867 --> 00:30:37,630
The way I see it...
278
00:30:39,270 --> 00:30:43,206
the most important elements in the case...
279
00:30:44,142 --> 00:30:48,203
are the sterilization decrees,
and the Feldenstein-Hoffman affair.
280
00:30:53,685 --> 00:30:57,086
Dr. Janning, I must tell you something.
281
00:31:02,260 --> 00:31:03,852
I admired you...
282
00:31:05,163 --> 00:31:07,688
since I was a boy in the university.
283
00:31:09,067 --> 00:31:12,468
It was because I thought
I might be able to achieve...
284
00:31:12,537 --> 00:31:14,971
some of the things you have done...
285
00:31:19,244 --> 00:31:21,337
that saw me through the war.
286
00:31:22,881 --> 00:31:26,647
You have been somebody to look up to,
for all of us.
287
00:31:29,854 --> 00:31:31,822
Is that all, Herr Rolfe?
288
00:31:36,594 --> 00:31:37,652
Yes.
289
00:31:37,729 --> 00:31:39,060
Thank you.
290
00:31:49,107 --> 00:31:53,100
Dr. Wieck, do you know the defendant,
Ernst Janning?
291
00:31:56,214 --> 00:31:57,875
Yes, I know him.
292
00:31:57,949 --> 00:32:00,383
Will you tell us in what capacity?
293
00:32:01,119 --> 00:32:05,818
We served in the Ministry of Justice together
from 1929 till 1935.
294
00:32:06,457 --> 00:32:08,516
Did you know him before that?
295
00:32:08,593 --> 00:32:09,651
Yes.
296
00:32:10,695 --> 00:32:12,526
He was a law student of mine.
297
00:32:12,597 --> 00:32:14,258
- Did you know him well?
- Yes.
298
00:32:14,332 --> 00:32:16,129
- Was he a prot�g� of yours?
- Yes.
299
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:17,258
Why?
300
00:32:18,670 --> 00:32:21,537
He was always a man of great intelligence.
301
00:32:22,740 --> 00:32:26,801
He was a man born with the qualities
of a great legal mind.
302
00:32:31,783 --> 00:32:34,718
Would you tell us
from your own experience...
303
00:32:35,353 --> 00:32:40,188
the position of the judge in Germany
prior to the advent of Adolf Hitler.
304
00:32:41,893 --> 00:32:45,590
The position of the judge
was one of complete independence.
305
00:32:46,965 --> 00:32:50,230
Now, would you describe
the contrast, if any...
306
00:32:51,135 --> 00:32:54,969
after the coming to power
of National Socialism in 1933?
307
00:32:55,673 --> 00:33:00,133
Judges became subject
to something outside of objective justice.
308
00:33:01,479 --> 00:33:06,382
They became subject to what was necessary
for the protection of the country.
309
00:33:07,385 --> 00:33:09,250
Would you explain this, please?
310
00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:11,151
The first consideration of the judge...
311
00:33:11,222 --> 00:33:14,316
became the punishment of acts
against the state...
312
00:33:14,826 --> 00:33:18,159
rather than objective consideration
of the case.
313
00:33:18,396 --> 00:33:20,830
And what other changes were there?
314
00:33:21,466 --> 00:33:24,492
The right to appeal was eliminated.
315
00:33:25,303 --> 00:33:28,466
The Supreme Court of the Reich
was replaced by...
316
00:33:29,407 --> 00:33:31,568
People's and Special Courts.
317
00:33:32,777 --> 00:33:37,646
The concept of race
was made a legal concept for the first time.
318
00:33:38,249 --> 00:33:40,581
And what was the result of this?
319
00:33:41,352 --> 00:33:42,717
The result?
320
00:33:44,555 --> 00:33:48,286
The result was
to hand over the administration of justice...
321
00:33:48,359 --> 00:33:50,850
into the hands of the dictatorship.
322
00:33:51,229 --> 00:33:52,560
Now, Dr. Wieck...
323
00:33:52,630 --> 00:33:55,963
Col. Lawson, I would like
to ask a few questions.
324
00:33:56,667 --> 00:34:01,070
Did the judiciary protest these laws
abridging their independence?
325
00:34:01,139 --> 00:34:02,800
A few of them did.
326
00:34:03,041 --> 00:34:06,204
Those who did resigned,
or were forced to resign.
327
00:34:10,481 --> 00:34:13,541
Others adapted themselves
to the new situation.
328
00:34:15,219 --> 00:34:19,212
Do you think the judiciary was aware
of the consequences to come?
329
00:34:20,224 --> 00:34:22,089
At first, perhaps not.
330
00:34:24,562 --> 00:34:28,328
Later it became clear to anyone
who had eyes and ears.
331
00:34:28,399 --> 00:34:29,730
Thank you.
332
00:34:31,269 --> 00:34:35,899
Now, would you please describe for us
the changes in criminal law?
333
00:34:36,707 --> 00:34:38,732
It was characterized by...
334
00:34:38,810 --> 00:34:42,041
an ever-increasing inflation
of the death penalty.
335
00:34:43,014 --> 00:34:45,744
Sentences were passed
against defendants...
336
00:34:45,817 --> 00:34:50,516
just because they were Poles, or Jews,
or politically undesirable.
337
00:34:52,256 --> 00:34:55,817
Novel National Socialist measures
were introduced.
338
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:57,525
Among them...
339
00:34:57,595 --> 00:35:02,032
sexual sterilization for those
who were categorized as asocial.
340
00:35:02,366 --> 00:35:04,766
Did it become necessary for judges...
341
00:35:04,836 --> 00:35:09,296
to wear any distinctive mark
on their robes in 1935?
342
00:35:09,907 --> 00:35:12,171
The so-called Fuehrer's Decree...
343
00:35:12,243 --> 00:35:16,407
required judges to wear the insignia
of the swastika on their robes.
344
00:35:16,747 --> 00:35:19,238
- Did you wear such an insignia?
- No.
345
00:35:20,251 --> 00:35:22,515
I would have been ashamed to wear it.
346
00:35:22,587 --> 00:35:24,851
Did you resign in 1935?
347
00:35:25,089 --> 00:35:26,351
Yes, sir.
348
00:35:26,924 --> 00:35:29,916
Did Ernst Janning wear a swastika
on his robe?
349
00:35:34,298 --> 00:35:35,356
Yes.
350
00:35:36,534 --> 00:35:38,399
That's all. Thank you.
351
00:35:42,974 --> 00:35:44,339
Herr Rolfe.
352
00:35:56,120 --> 00:36:00,716
You used the phrase, "What was necessary
for the protection of the country. "
353
00:36:02,860 --> 00:36:04,885
Will you explain for the tribunal...
354
00:36:04,962 --> 00:36:08,796
the conditions in Germany at the time
National Socialism came to power?
355
00:36:08,866 --> 00:36:10,458
What conditions?
356
00:36:13,871 --> 00:36:16,237
Would you say
there was widespread hunger?
357
00:36:16,307 --> 00:36:17,467
Yes.
358
00:36:17,542 --> 00:36:20,067
Would you say there was internal disunity?
359
00:36:20,144 --> 00:36:21,202
Yes.
360
00:36:21,412 --> 00:36:23,277
Was there a Communist Party?
361
00:36:23,347 --> 00:36:24,371
Yes.
362
00:36:24,448 --> 00:36:27,315
Was it the third-largest party in Germany?
363
00:36:27,385 --> 00:36:28,443
Yes.
364
00:36:29,020 --> 00:36:30,612
Would you say...
365
00:36:31,656 --> 00:36:35,990
that National Socialism helped to cure
some of these conditions?
366
00:36:36,961 --> 00:36:38,861
Yes, but at a terrible price...
367
00:36:38,930 --> 00:36:42,832
Please confine yourself
to answering the questions only.
368
00:36:44,435 --> 00:36:48,531
Therefore, was it not possible
that a judge might wear a swastika...
369
00:36:48,606 --> 00:36:51,541
and yet work for what he thought was best
for his country?
370
00:36:51,609 --> 00:36:53,600
No. It was not possible.
371
00:37:01,452 --> 00:37:03,579
You were not in the administration...
372
00:37:03,654 --> 00:37:07,988
from the years 1935 to 1943...
373
00:37:08,693 --> 00:37:10,558
by your own admission.
374
00:37:11,329 --> 00:37:15,663
Is it not possible
that your view of the administration...
375
00:37:16,100 --> 00:37:18,193
might be distorted?
376
00:37:18,836 --> 00:37:20,326
No. It is not.
377
00:37:21,973 --> 00:37:26,307
How can you testify about
what was going on in the administration...
378
00:37:26,377 --> 00:37:27,935
if you were not there?
379
00:37:28,012 --> 00:37:30,742
I had many friends
in the legal administration.
380
00:37:30,815 --> 00:37:33,045
There were journals and books.
381
00:37:34,785 --> 00:37:37,413
From journals and books?
382
00:37:41,392 --> 00:37:42,689
I see.
383
00:37:44,829 --> 00:37:47,059
You referred to:
384
00:37:47,131 --> 00:37:49,861
"Novel National Socialist
measures introduced...
385
00:37:49,934 --> 00:37:52,300
"among them sexual sterilization. "
386
00:37:53,471 --> 00:37:57,567
Are you aware that sexual sterilization
was not invented by National Socialism...
387
00:37:57,642 --> 00:38:00,509
but had been advanced for years before
as a weapon...
388
00:38:00,578 --> 00:38:03,877
in dealing with the mentally incompetent
and the criminal?
389
00:38:03,948 --> 00:38:05,779
Yes. I am aware of that.
390
00:38:05,850 --> 00:38:10,150
Are you aware that it has advocates
among leading citizens in other countries?
391
00:38:10,221 --> 00:38:12,553
I am not an expert on such laws.
392
00:38:13,924 --> 00:38:16,358
Then permit me to read one to you.
393
00:38:20,164 --> 00:38:22,428
This is a High Court opinion...
394
00:38:22,700 --> 00:38:26,830
upholding such laws in existence
in another country.
395
00:38:28,639 --> 00:38:30,038
And I quote:
396
00:38:35,112 --> 00:38:37,979
"We have seen more than once
that the public welfare...
397
00:38:38,049 --> 00:38:40,950
"may call upon the best citizens
for their lives.
398
00:38:41,018 --> 00:38:44,385
"It would be strange indeed,
if it could not call upon those...
399
00:38:44,455 --> 00:38:48,585
"who already sapped the strength
of the state for these lesser sacrifices...
400
00:38:48,659 --> 00:38:52,095
"in order to prevent our being swamped
by incompetence.
401
00:38:52,163 --> 00:38:53,630
"It is better for all the world...
402
00:38:53,698 --> 00:38:56,997
"if, instead of waiting to execute
degenerate offsprings for crime...
403
00:38:57,068 --> 00:39:01,528
"or to let them starve for their imbecility,
society can prevent their propagation...
404
00:39:01,605 --> 00:39:04,574
"by medical means in the first place.
405
00:39:07,545 --> 00:39:10,480
"Three generations of imbeciles
are enough. "
406
00:39:14,018 --> 00:39:16,509
Do you recognize it now, Dr. Wieck?
407
00:39:16,854 --> 00:39:18,515
No, sir, I don't.
408
00:39:19,457 --> 00:39:22,858
Actually, there is no particular reason
you should...
409
00:39:23,094 --> 00:39:25,756
since the opinion upholds
the sterilization law...
410
00:39:25,830 --> 00:39:28,993
in the State of Virginia,
of the United States...
411
00:39:29,433 --> 00:39:32,459
and was written and delivered
by that great American jurist...
412
00:39:32,536 --> 00:39:37,530
Supreme Court Justice,
Oliver Wendell Holmes.
413
00:39:47,585 --> 00:39:50,315
Now, Dr. Wieck.
414
00:39:51,489 --> 00:39:53,923
In view of what you have just learned...
415
00:39:53,991 --> 00:39:58,860
can you still say that sexual sterilization
was a novel National Socialist measure?
416
00:39:58,929 --> 00:40:00,396
Yes, I can say it.
417
00:40:01,432 --> 00:40:05,892
Because it was never before used
as a weapon against political opponents.
418
00:40:07,972 --> 00:40:09,940
Do you personally know of a case...
419
00:40:10,007 --> 00:40:13,272
where someone was sterilized
for political reasons?
420
00:40:13,778 --> 00:40:15,609
I know that such things were done.
421
00:40:15,679 --> 00:40:18,978
That's not the question.
Please answer the question.
422
00:40:19,817 --> 00:40:21,375
Do you know of a case?
423
00:40:21,452 --> 00:40:25,013
I don't know of any specific case,
or specific date...
424
00:40:25,089 --> 00:40:29,856
I am asking you if you have any firsthand,
personal knowledge of such a case!
425
00:40:30,161 --> 00:40:33,153
No, I have no such personal knowledge.
426
00:40:33,664 --> 00:40:35,029
Thank you.
427
00:40:50,948 --> 00:40:55,851
You are aware of the charges
in the indictment against Ernst Janning?
428
00:41:01,692 --> 00:41:03,023
Yes, I am.
429
00:41:04,762 --> 00:41:09,028
Can you honestly say
he is responsible for them?
430
00:41:10,501 --> 00:41:11,866
Yes, I can.
431
00:41:13,804 --> 00:41:17,604
Do you consider yourself
free of responsibility?
432
00:41:20,544 --> 00:41:21,875
Yes, I do.
433
00:41:26,684 --> 00:41:30,085
Did you ever swear
to the Civil Servant Loyalty Oath of 1934?
434
00:41:30,154 --> 00:41:32,145
Your Honor, I object.
435
00:41:32,456 --> 00:41:34,686
The witness doesn't have to answer
that question.
436
00:41:34,758 --> 00:41:36,749
He's not on trial.
437
00:41:37,495 --> 00:41:39,486
All Germany is on trial, Your Honor.
438
00:41:39,563 --> 00:41:43,021
This tribunal placed it on trial
when it placed Ernst Janning on trial.
439
00:41:43,100 --> 00:41:47,560
If responsibility is to be found,
the widest latitude is to be permitted.
440
00:41:48,472 --> 00:41:50,235
Objection overruled.
441
00:41:51,475 --> 00:41:55,104
Did you ever swear
to the Civil Servant Loyalty Oath of 1934?
442
00:41:57,882 --> 00:41:59,076
Everyone did.
443
00:41:59,149 --> 00:42:01,879
We are not interested in what everyone did.
444
00:42:01,952 --> 00:42:04,284
We are interested in what you did.
445
00:42:04,355 --> 00:42:08,724
Would you read the oath
from the Reich Law Gazette, March, 1933?
446
00:42:09,627 --> 00:42:11,527
"I swear that I shall be obedient...
447
00:42:11,595 --> 00:42:14,621
"to the leader of the German Reich
and people, Adolf Hitler.
448
00:42:14,698 --> 00:42:17,758
"That I shall be loyal to him,
that I will observe the laws...
449
00:42:17,835 --> 00:42:20,303
"and that I will conscientiously
fulfill my duties...
450
00:42:20,371 --> 00:42:21,929
"so help me God. "
451
00:42:22,806 --> 00:42:24,603
Everyone swore to it.
452
00:42:25,976 --> 00:42:27,637
It was mandatory.
453
00:42:29,747 --> 00:42:30,839
Yes.
454
00:42:32,483 --> 00:42:35,418
But you're such a perceptive man, Dr. Wieck.
455
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:38,515
You could see what was coming.
456
00:42:38,589 --> 00:42:42,889
You could see that National Socialism
was leading Germany to disaster.
457
00:42:43,394 --> 00:42:46,386
"It was clear to anyone
who had eyes and ears. "
458
00:42:48,265 --> 00:42:50,062
Didn't you realize...
459
00:42:50,734 --> 00:42:54,761
what it would have meant if you,
and men like you...
460
00:42:55,506 --> 00:42:58,270
would have refused to swear to the oath?
461
00:42:58,776 --> 00:43:03,213
It would have meant that Hitler
could never have come to absolute power.
462
00:43:06,417 --> 00:43:07,975
Why didn't you?
463
00:43:09,620 --> 00:43:11,178
Why didn't you?
464
00:43:11,889 --> 00:43:14,187
Can you give us an explanation?
465
00:43:15,292 --> 00:43:17,453
Has it something to do with your pension?
466
00:43:17,528 --> 00:43:20,088
Did your pension mean more to you
than your country?
467
00:43:20,164 --> 00:43:21,563
Your Honor!
468
00:43:21,932 --> 00:43:26,266
I object to the entire line of questioning,
and ask that it be stricken from the record.
469
00:43:26,337 --> 00:43:29,773
I thought prosecuting counsel
was dedicated to finding responsibility.
470
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:31,774
Your Honor, I made an objection.
471
00:43:31,842 --> 00:43:34,675
Prosecution is not interested
in finding responsibility?
472
00:43:34,745 --> 00:43:38,681
There is responsibility for more here
than swearing to a loyalty oath...
473
00:43:38,749 --> 00:43:40,740
- and you know it.
- There is indeed.
474
00:43:40,818 --> 00:43:44,914
One thing that even the German machine,
with its monumental efficiency...
475
00:43:44,989 --> 00:43:46,581
has been unable to destroy...
476
00:43:46,657 --> 00:43:47,783
Order.
477
00:43:47,858 --> 00:43:51,021
All the victims.
More victims than the world has ever known.
478
00:43:51,095 --> 00:43:54,030
- They will walk into this courtroom...
- Order!
479
00:43:55,499 --> 00:43:59,993
This tribunal will admonish both counsel.
It will tolerate nothing of this kind again.
480
00:44:00,070 --> 00:44:03,562
We're not here to listen to outbursts
of this kind, but to serve justice.
481
00:44:03,641 --> 00:44:05,404
Your Honor, I made an objection.
482
00:44:05,476 --> 00:44:07,376
The objection is overruled.
483
00:44:08,779 --> 00:44:10,679
The witness is excused.
484
00:44:43,747 --> 00:44:45,806
Did you ever read any books by Janning?
485
00:44:45,883 --> 00:44:47,180
No, I don't think so.
486
00:44:47,251 --> 00:44:50,118
- The Meaning of the Law.
- How is it? Interesting?
487
00:44:50,187 --> 00:44:53,247
All the books by Janning are interesting.
They're more than that.
488
00:44:53,323 --> 00:44:56,952
They're a picture of an era,
its hopes, its aspirations.
489
00:44:57,094 --> 00:44:59,528
They weren't very different from ours, really.
490
00:44:59,596 --> 00:45:03,225
Listen to this, on the signing
of the Weimar constitution:
491
00:45:03,300 --> 00:45:07,327
"Now we can look forward to a Germany
without guns and bloodshed...
492
00:45:07,404 --> 00:45:10,965
"a Germany of justice,
where men can live instead of die...
493
00:45:11,275 --> 00:45:14,335
"a Germany of purpose,
of freedom, of humanity...
494
00:45:14,411 --> 00:45:16,879
"a Germany that calls for the best in man. "
495
00:45:16,947 --> 00:45:19,438
Now, how could a man
who wrote words like these...
496
00:45:19,516 --> 00:45:22,952
be part of sterilizations and murders?
How could he be?
497
00:45:23,020 --> 00:45:26,854
There are a lot of things that happened here
that nobody understands.
498
00:45:26,924 --> 00:45:28,118
I know.
499
00:45:29,393 --> 00:45:31,554
But the prosecution will have to prove...
500
00:45:31,628 --> 00:45:32,959
every inch of its allegation...
501
00:45:33,030 --> 00:45:36,932
against a man like Janning
if I'm to pronounce sentence on him.
502
00:45:37,367 --> 00:45:40,302
Gentlemen, I'm on my way. Coming, Ken?
503
00:45:40,404 --> 00:45:41,564
Right.
504
00:45:42,072 --> 00:45:45,769
There's just this business
on the curtailment of rights.
505
00:45:46,243 --> 00:45:47,574
Tomorrow.
506
00:45:47,644 --> 00:45:51,637
Dan, my wife is planning a little get-together
tomorrow night at the Grand Hotel.
507
00:45:51,715 --> 00:45:53,546
She wants you to come.
508
00:45:53,617 --> 00:45:54,982
I thank you.
509
00:45:55,052 --> 00:45:59,284
And she'd like to provide you
with some kind of female companionship.
510
00:45:59,389 --> 00:46:01,755
She has a feeling
that you might be lonely here.
511
00:46:01,825 --> 00:46:03,986
No, thanks, Curtiss. Thanks very much.
512
00:46:04,061 --> 00:46:06,723
You know how these wives are.
They love to play Cupid.
513
00:46:06,797 --> 00:46:08,662
I think I'll keep it stag.
514
00:46:08,732 --> 00:46:10,324
All right. How about you, Ken?
515
00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:12,960
Thanks. My wife and I
have an engagement. Good night.
516
00:46:13,036 --> 00:46:15,129
- Good night.
- Good night, Dan.
517
00:46:35,459 --> 00:46:37,586
Mrs. Halbestadt, could I...
518
00:46:39,663 --> 00:46:40,755
Hello.
519
00:46:42,065 --> 00:46:43,225
Hello.
520
00:46:44,701 --> 00:46:47,226
Your Honor, this is Madame Bertholt.
521
00:46:47,671 --> 00:46:50,071
This is His Honor, Judge Haywood.
522
00:46:51,175 --> 00:46:53,700
Madame Bertholt, this is her house.
523
00:46:54,511 --> 00:46:57,071
She came to get some of her belongings
from the basement.
524
00:46:57,147 --> 00:46:59,115
I didn't know she was coming.
525
00:46:59,183 --> 00:47:01,743
This is my responsibility, Mrs. Halbestadt.
526
00:47:01,819 --> 00:47:03,810
I've been storing some of my things here...
527
00:47:03,887 --> 00:47:06,856
until I could get a room large enough
to keep them in.
528
00:47:06,924 --> 00:47:08,323
I hope you don't mind.
529
00:47:08,392 --> 00:47:09,916
No. Not at all.
530
00:47:10,194 --> 00:47:12,719
You can examine what I have here,
if you like.
531
00:47:13,130 --> 00:47:14,495
Of course not.
532
00:47:14,832 --> 00:47:16,459
Then I'll just take these out.
533
00:47:16,533 --> 00:47:18,228
- Here.
- Thanks, Mrs. Halbestadt.
534
00:47:18,302 --> 00:47:20,395
- Let me help you.
- No. I can manage all right.
535
00:47:20,470 --> 00:47:21,960
I'll take these outside. Please.
536
00:47:22,039 --> 00:47:23,336
Good night.
537
00:47:37,387 --> 00:47:39,719
It's heavy. It's full of books and pictures...
538
00:47:39,790 --> 00:47:42,623
things that mean nothing to anyone but me.
539
00:47:42,726 --> 00:47:44,717
- Mr. Schmidt?
- Your Honor.
540
00:47:46,630 --> 00:47:48,996
Would you drive
Mrs. Bertholt home, please?
541
00:47:49,066 --> 00:47:50,556
Yes, Your Honor.
542
00:47:50,634 --> 00:47:53,432
- I hope you're comfortable here.
- Yes, I am. Very.
543
00:47:53,503 --> 00:47:55,903
My favorite spot was always the garden.
544
00:47:55,973 --> 00:47:59,067
Remind Mr. Halbestadt
to take good care of the rock garden.
545
00:47:59,142 --> 00:48:02,373
You'll get a great deal of pleasure out of it
in summer.
546
00:48:02,446 --> 00:48:04,641
I'll sit in front, thank you.
547
00:48:06,783 --> 00:48:08,478
- Good night.
- Good night.
548
00:48:08,552 --> 00:48:11,419
- Karolinenstrasse 115, please.
- Yes, madam.
549
00:48:32,009 --> 00:48:33,271
Sit down.
550
00:48:37,314 --> 00:48:40,772
You worked for Mrs. Bertholt, didn't you?
551
00:48:40,851 --> 00:48:42,443
Yes, Your Honor.
552
00:48:42,619 --> 00:48:44,712
How long did she live here?
553
00:48:44,922 --> 00:48:46,514
Madame Bertholt?
554
00:48:47,524 --> 00:48:52,359
Madame Bertholt and her family have lived
here for many generations, Your Honor.
555
00:48:52,696 --> 00:48:54,027
Thank you.
556
00:48:55,766 --> 00:48:58,599
Your Honor, you came in here
for something?
557
00:49:00,203 --> 00:49:02,831
I was just going to make myself a sandwich.
558
00:49:03,006 --> 00:49:04,564
- We will make it for you.
- No.
559
00:49:04,641 --> 00:49:07,109
- We will make anything you want.
- No. It's nothing.
560
00:49:07,177 --> 00:49:09,145
I always used to do it for myself back home.
561
00:49:09,212 --> 00:49:13,046
What would you like? I have some ham
and cheese and liverwurst.
562
00:49:13,784 --> 00:49:15,581
Cheese will be fine.
563
00:49:17,321 --> 00:49:19,312
That's very kind of you.
564
00:49:28,665 --> 00:49:32,066
What was it like,
living under National Socialism?
565
00:49:33,971 --> 00:49:35,598
What was it like?
566
00:49:35,872 --> 00:49:38,864
Yes. I mean, day to day?
567
00:49:39,543 --> 00:49:42,137
You know, I know many people at home
like you.
568
00:49:42,212 --> 00:49:44,703
You're good people. I believe that.
569
00:49:46,383 --> 00:49:49,181
What was it like for you, living under Hitler?
570
00:49:49,252 --> 00:49:53,086
We were not political.
Mr. Halbestadt and I are not political.
571
00:49:55,892 --> 00:49:57,257
No, but...
572
00:49:57,828 --> 00:50:02,094
you must have been aware of some
of the events that were going on.
573
00:50:04,134 --> 00:50:06,568
Many things were going on.
574
00:50:06,636 --> 00:50:08,467
There were parades.
575
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:12,838
Hitler and Goebbels came here every year.
576
00:50:14,411 --> 00:50:16,072
What was it like?
577
00:50:17,014 --> 00:50:19,812
We never attended meetings. Never.
578
00:50:20,984 --> 00:50:23,043
I'm not trying to put you on trial.
579
00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:26,146
I'm just curious. I'd like to know.
580
00:50:27,557 --> 00:50:30,492
- Here's your sandwich, Your Honor.
- Thank you.
581
00:50:30,560 --> 00:50:32,084
You're welcome.
582
00:50:32,596 --> 00:50:33,961
Thank you.
583
00:50:37,267 --> 00:50:39,701
For instance,
there was a place called Dachau...
584
00:50:39,770 --> 00:50:42,466
which was not too many miles from here.
585
00:50:42,639 --> 00:50:45,437
Did you ever know
what was going on there?
586
00:50:46,343 --> 00:50:49,335
We knew nothing about it.
587
00:50:51,481 --> 00:50:55,975
How can you ask
if we knew anything about that?
588
00:50:58,055 --> 00:50:59,386
I'm sorry.
589
00:51:01,792 --> 00:51:05,250
Your Honor, we are only little people.
590
00:51:06,763 --> 00:51:08,890
We lost a son in the army...
591
00:51:10,467 --> 00:51:12,833
and our daughter in the bombing.
592
00:51:14,671 --> 00:51:17,299
During the war we almost starved.
593
00:51:18,642 --> 00:51:20,542
It was terrible for us.
594
00:51:22,245 --> 00:51:23,837
I'm sure it was.
595
00:51:27,784 --> 00:51:29,911
Hitler did some good things.
596
00:51:31,088 --> 00:51:33,921
I won't say he didn't do some good things.
597
00:51:34,925 --> 00:51:36,790
He built the Autobahn.
598
00:51:37,461 --> 00:51:39,452
He gave more people work.
599
00:51:40,297 --> 00:51:43,130
We won't say
he didn't do some good things.
600
00:51:45,035 --> 00:51:47,162
But the other things...
601
00:51:48,405 --> 00:51:51,238
the things they say he did to the Jews
and the rest...
602
00:51:51,308 --> 00:51:53,401
we knew nothing about that.
603
00:51:53,643 --> 00:51:55,474
Very few Germans did.
604
00:51:57,647 --> 00:51:59,979
And if we did know...
605
00:52:01,718 --> 00:52:03,379
what could we do?
606
00:52:04,020 --> 00:52:06,818
But Mrs. Halbestadt said you didn't know.
607
00:52:12,429 --> 00:52:15,830
Mrs. Bertholt. How did she react to all this?
608
00:52:16,633 --> 00:52:20,364
Madame Bertholt is a very fine woman,
Your Honor.
609
00:52:20,570 --> 00:52:23,266
I'm sure she is. What about her husband?
610
00:52:25,342 --> 00:52:27,071
He was in the army.
611
00:52:27,911 --> 00:52:29,708
What happened to him?
612
00:52:31,148 --> 00:52:35,312
He was one of the defendants
in the Malmedy Case.
613
00:52:38,822 --> 00:52:42,451
General Bertholt. Karl Bertholt.
614
00:52:44,261 --> 00:52:46,388
He was executed, Your Honor.
615
00:52:48,798 --> 00:52:50,425
Yes, I know that.
616
00:52:54,671 --> 00:52:57,936
The document then states that
the photographer, Rudolf Lenz...
617
00:52:58,008 --> 00:53:00,374
is requested to present himself
within two weeks...
618
00:53:00,443 --> 00:53:03,139
at one the hospitals mentioned below...
619
00:53:03,547 --> 00:53:06,141
for medical treatment.
620
00:53:07,250 --> 00:53:10,742
Next, prosecution presents
affidavit document no. 488...
621
00:53:10,820 --> 00:53:13,687
which concerns the seamstress,
Anni Meunch.
622
00:53:13,757 --> 00:53:15,782
Document reads as follows:
623
00:53:15,992 --> 00:53:19,223
"District Court, Frankfurt am Main,
has decided the following:
624
00:53:19,296 --> 00:53:22,060
"The seamstress, Anni Meunch,
daughter of Wilhelm Meunch...
625
00:53:22,132 --> 00:53:23,724
"is to be sterilized.
626
00:53:23,800 --> 00:53:26,860
"She is therefore requested
to present herself within two weeks...
627
00:53:26,937 --> 00:53:29,428
"at one of the hospitals mentioned below.
628
00:53:29,506 --> 00:53:31,838
"If she does not take herself voluntarily...
629
00:53:31,908 --> 00:53:34,103
"she will be taken by force. "
630
00:53:35,212 --> 00:53:37,510
Next, document no. 449...
631
00:53:37,614 --> 00:53:40,811
interrogatories in the German
and English text...
632
00:53:41,117 --> 00:53:43,551
concerning the farmer's helper,
Meyer Eichinger.
633
00:53:43,620 --> 00:53:45,087
Your Honor...
634
00:53:48,892 --> 00:53:52,692
defense objects to introduction
of these repetitive documents.
635
00:53:52,762 --> 00:53:55,526
According to the ruling
of the first tribunal...
636
00:53:55,599 --> 00:53:58,033
such documents are not even admissible...
637
00:53:58,101 --> 00:54:02,003
unless supported by independent evidence
of their authenticity.
638
00:54:03,406 --> 00:54:05,169
Objection sustained.
639
00:54:06,576 --> 00:54:09,909
Your Honor,
may I ask the defense a question?
640
00:54:09,980 --> 00:54:11,038
Yes.
641
00:54:11,381 --> 00:54:15,647
Would evidence on sterilization
be admissible if there were a witness?
642
00:54:26,029 --> 00:54:27,860
- Yes.
- Thank you.
643
00:54:29,165 --> 00:54:32,259
Prosecution calls the witness,
Rudolph Petersen.
644
00:54:56,793 --> 00:54:59,091
Will you raise your right hand?
645
00:54:59,462 --> 00:55:01,396
I swear by God,
the Almighty and Omniscient...
646
00:55:01,464 --> 00:55:05,332
that I will speak the pure truth
and withhold and add nothing.
647
00:55:05,402 --> 00:55:06,767
I do.
648
00:55:23,887 --> 00:55:28,153
Will you please tell the court your full name
and place of residence?
649
00:55:28,992 --> 00:55:33,122
Rudolph Petersen.
Frankfurt am Main, Gratweg Nummer 7.
650
00:55:34,464 --> 00:55:36,932
When were you born, Mr. Petersen?
651
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:39,491
May 20, 1914.
652
00:55:40,270 --> 00:55:42,397
And what is your occupation?
653
00:55:43,106 --> 00:55:45,700
I'm a baker's helper.
654
00:55:47,010 --> 00:55:49,706
Are your parents living?
655
00:55:50,413 --> 00:55:51,437
No.
656
00:55:52,482 --> 00:55:55,076
What were the causes of their deaths?
657
00:55:59,322 --> 00:56:02,758
Mr. Petersen, did they die of natural causes?
658
00:56:03,259 --> 00:56:05,284
Yeah, natural.
659
00:56:09,132 --> 00:56:12,568
What political party
did your father belong to?
660
00:56:12,635 --> 00:56:15,763
The Communist Party.
661
00:56:19,542 --> 00:56:21,737
Now think back.
662
00:56:21,878 --> 00:56:24,574
Do you remember anything unusual...
663
00:56:24,748 --> 00:56:27,842
that happened to you and your family
in 1933...
664
00:56:28,585 --> 00:56:30,883
before the Nazis came to power?
665
00:56:31,721 --> 00:56:34,246
I mean, anything of a violent nature.
666
00:56:35,692 --> 00:56:36,818
Yeah.
667
00:56:37,827 --> 00:56:39,920
How old were you at the time?
668
00:56:39,996 --> 00:56:41,258
Nineteen.
669
00:56:42,098 --> 00:56:45,090
Would you please tell the court
what happened?
670
00:56:49,172 --> 00:56:52,938
Some SA men broke into our house...
671
00:56:55,378 --> 00:56:58,245
and they broke the windows and the door...
672
00:56:59,015 --> 00:57:01,176
and they called us traitors...
673
00:57:02,152 --> 00:57:06,953
and they tried to beat up my father.
674
00:57:07,991 --> 00:57:09,891
What happened then?
675
00:57:10,126 --> 00:57:13,323
My brothers and I, we went to help him.
676
00:57:14,531 --> 00:57:16,931
And there was a fight...
677
00:57:17,100 --> 00:57:21,127
and finally we got them outside
in the street...
678
00:57:21,204 --> 00:57:23,001
and we beat them up...
679
00:57:24,040 --> 00:57:26,531
and turned them over to the police.
680
00:57:27,477 --> 00:57:30,002
Did the police do anything about it?
681
00:57:30,146 --> 00:57:31,636
- No.
- Why not?
682
00:57:32,215 --> 00:57:33,682
It was then...
683
00:57:33,750 --> 00:57:37,584
at the time of the national elections.
684
00:57:38,455 --> 00:57:41,447
You mean the time the National Socialists
came to power?
685
00:57:41,524 --> 00:57:42,513
Yeah.
686
00:57:45,295 --> 00:57:48,594
What happened after 1933...
687
00:57:49,299 --> 00:57:51,563
after the Nazis came to power?
688
00:57:52,235 --> 00:57:54,726
I got a job on a farm...
689
00:57:55,505 --> 00:57:59,737
but for the work,
to drive a truck was necessary.
690
00:58:00,777 --> 00:58:05,043
I went to the city building
to apply for a license.
691
00:58:05,448 --> 00:58:07,416
And what happened there?
692
00:58:08,084 --> 00:58:10,848
They took me to an official.
693
00:58:12,822 --> 00:58:16,417
Did you ever have any dealings
with this official before?
694
00:58:17,360 --> 00:58:19,794
He was one of the men...
695
00:58:21,297 --> 00:58:23,857
who broke into our house that night.
696
00:58:24,100 --> 00:58:26,625
What did he say to your application?
697
00:58:28,037 --> 00:58:31,598
He said an examination
there would have to be.
698
00:58:32,609 --> 00:58:35,339
Where was the examination to take place?
699
00:58:35,845 --> 00:58:38,473
In the district court of Stuttgart.
700
00:58:39,716 --> 00:58:42,549
Who was the presiding justice in the court?
701
00:58:46,222 --> 00:58:47,985
Justice Hoffstetter.
702
00:58:50,193 --> 00:58:52,684
What happened in the courtroom?
703
00:58:53,830 --> 00:58:57,425
They asked me my full name...
704
00:58:57,500 --> 00:58:59,559
and so forth.
705
00:59:00,236 --> 00:59:02,363
What else did they ask you?
706
00:59:03,406 --> 00:59:08,070
They asked me when Adolf Hitler
and Dr. Goebbels were born.
707
00:59:09,479 --> 00:59:11,208
What did you reply?
708
00:59:12,115 --> 00:59:17,075
I told them I didn't know,
and also that I didn't care.
709
00:59:23,459 --> 00:59:26,223
Did they ask you any more questions?
710
00:59:27,030 --> 00:59:31,091
No. They told me that
I would be hearing from them in ten days.
711
00:59:31,901 --> 00:59:34,927
I see. Now, Mr. Petersen...
712
00:59:36,940 --> 00:59:39,408
I'd like you to look at something.
713
00:59:52,355 --> 00:59:54,118
Do you recognize it?
714
00:59:54,691 --> 00:59:55,715
Yeah.
715
00:59:55,792 --> 00:59:58,590
Would you please read it for the tribunal?
716
01:00:00,897 --> 01:00:03,923
"District Court of Stuttgart.
717
01:00:04,968 --> 01:00:08,870
"The baker, Rudolph Petersen,
born May 20, 1914...
718
01:00:09,606 --> 01:00:13,440
"son of railway employee, Hans Petersen...
719
01:00:17,647 --> 01:00:19,478
"is to be sterilized. "
720
01:00:20,550 --> 01:00:23,212
Now would you read the last paragraph?
721
01:00:27,957 --> 01:00:31,085
"It is therefore requested...
722
01:00:31,160 --> 01:00:34,391
"he present himself within two weeks...
723
01:00:34,797 --> 01:00:37,789
"to one of the hospitals mentioned below.
724
01:00:39,135 --> 01:00:41,296
"If he does not...
725
01:00:42,505 --> 01:00:45,633
"betake himself voluntarily...
726
01:00:48,144 --> 01:00:50,305
"he will be taken by force. "
727
01:00:54,584 --> 01:00:57,485
Please read the signature at the bottom.
728
01:01:00,556 --> 01:01:03,389
"Presiding Justice Hoffstetter. "
729
01:01:07,463 --> 01:01:10,728
Would you read
what is written below the signature?
730
01:01:11,668 --> 01:01:13,158
- Below?
- Below.
731
01:01:14,871 --> 01:01:17,431
"By authority of...
732
01:01:18,541 --> 01:01:20,509
"Ernst Janning...
733
01:01:21,944 --> 01:01:23,844
"Minister of Justice. "
734
01:01:27,083 --> 01:01:28,573
Your Honor...
735
01:01:31,320 --> 01:01:34,289
may the defense see the file
of Mr. Petersen?
736
01:01:35,892 --> 01:01:39,623
What did you do
after you received the letter, Mr. Petersen?
737
01:01:39,729 --> 01:01:41,094
I ran away.
738
01:01:41,297 --> 01:01:44,494
I stayed at the farm of a friend I have.
739
01:01:45,234 --> 01:01:46,963
And did you return?
740
01:01:48,337 --> 01:01:50,464
- Did I what?
- Did you return?
741
01:01:50,840 --> 01:01:51,932
Yes.
742
01:01:52,408 --> 01:01:54,308
And what happened then?
743
01:01:55,645 --> 01:01:57,237
The police came.
744
01:01:59,949 --> 01:02:01,917
Where did they take you?
745
01:02:03,820 --> 01:02:05,412
To the hospital.
746
01:02:06,622 --> 01:02:08,817
Mr. Petersen, excuse me.
747
01:02:08,891 --> 01:02:12,224
I wonder if you could speak
a little louder, please.
748
01:02:13,096 --> 01:02:14,688
To the hospital.
749
01:02:15,231 --> 01:02:17,665
And what happened at the hospital?
750
01:02:17,800 --> 01:02:19,529
They kept me there.
751
01:02:20,303 --> 01:02:23,238
The nurse who was...
752
01:02:25,441 --> 01:02:27,466
Well, she came in, anyway.
753
01:02:27,944 --> 01:02:30,674
She was to prepare me for the operation.
754
01:02:30,913 --> 01:02:35,441
And she said
she thought the whole thing was terrible.
755
01:02:38,654 --> 01:02:42,954
Then the doctor came in
who was supposed to do the...
756
01:02:45,128 --> 01:02:48,461
And he said he thought it was awful.
757
01:02:50,399 --> 01:02:53,391
Were you, in fact, sterilized?
758
01:03:02,512 --> 01:03:04,946
Thank you very much, Mr. Petersen.
759
01:03:06,482 --> 01:03:07,881
That's all.
760
01:03:10,086 --> 01:03:11,485
Herr Rolfe?
761
01:03:22,098 --> 01:03:23,656
Mr. Petersen...
762
01:03:25,735 --> 01:03:29,193
you may take your earphones off now,
if you want to.
763
01:03:37,814 --> 01:03:41,511
You say you work as a baker's helper?
Is that correct?
764
01:03:41,584 --> 01:03:43,245
Yes, that is right.
765
01:03:45,221 --> 01:03:47,781
What other occupations have you held?
766
01:03:47,857 --> 01:03:50,087
I have worked for my father.
767
01:03:51,294 --> 01:03:53,262
What did your father do?
768
01:03:53,930 --> 01:03:55,921
He was a railroad worker.
769
01:03:56,332 --> 01:03:58,596
Yes, but what did he do?
770
01:03:59,402 --> 01:04:04,135
He would raise and lower the barrier...
771
01:04:05,474 --> 01:04:08,034
at the crossing, for traffic.
772
01:04:11,747 --> 01:04:16,377
And you spoke about your brothers.
How many brothers do you have?
773
01:04:17,486 --> 01:04:18,578
Five.
774
01:04:18,921 --> 01:04:20,320
And sisters?
775
01:04:20,723 --> 01:04:21,815
Four.
776
01:04:21,924 --> 01:04:24,415
- Then you are a family of ten?
- Yes.
777
01:04:27,129 --> 01:04:29,825
What occupations do your brothers have?
778
01:04:30,233 --> 01:04:31,495
Laborers.
779
01:04:32,702 --> 01:04:35,637
All laborers? I see.
780
01:04:39,141 --> 01:04:42,269
You said the court at Stuttgart
asked you two questions:
781
01:04:42,345 --> 01:04:45,906
The birth dates of Hitler and Dr. Goebbels.
Is that correct?
782
01:04:45,982 --> 01:04:47,449
Yes, correct.
783
01:04:47,783 --> 01:04:49,876
What else did they ask you?
784
01:04:52,588 --> 01:04:54,055
Nothing else.
785
01:04:55,458 --> 01:04:56,925
Are you sure?
786
01:04:57,560 --> 01:05:00,688
Are you sure there were no questions
about your schooling?
787
01:05:00,763 --> 01:05:02,094
Objection!
788
01:05:02,965 --> 01:05:06,423
The witness
has already answered that question.
789
01:05:10,139 --> 01:05:11,902
Objection sustained.
790
01:05:17,246 --> 01:05:18,838
May I ask you...
791
01:05:29,558 --> 01:05:31,958
how long did you attend school?
792
01:05:32,328 --> 01:05:33,522
Six years.
793
01:05:33,596 --> 01:05:36,064
Six years? Why not longer?
794
01:05:38,034 --> 01:05:39,797
I had to go to work.
795
01:05:40,469 --> 01:05:44,166
Would you consider yourself
a very bright fellow at school?
796
01:05:45,508 --> 01:05:47,271
School?
797
01:05:48,945 --> 01:05:51,140
It was a long while ago. I don't...
798
01:05:52,515 --> 01:05:55,643
Perhaps you were not able to keep up
with the others...
799
01:05:55,718 --> 01:05:57,948
and that's why you did not continue?
800
01:05:58,020 --> 01:05:59,885
Objection, Your Honor.
801
01:06:00,289 --> 01:06:03,725
The witness' school record has nothing
to do with what happened to him.
802
01:06:03,793 --> 01:06:08,287
It was the task of the Health Court
to sterilize the mentally incompetent.
803
01:06:12,401 --> 01:06:14,198
Objection overruled.
804
01:06:20,443 --> 01:06:24,209
Were you able, or were you not able...
805
01:06:25,014 --> 01:06:27,141
to keep up with the others?
806
01:06:32,655 --> 01:06:37,149
I would like to refer to the efficiency report
made at the school about Mr. Petersen.
807
01:06:37,226 --> 01:06:41,629
He failed to be promoted, and
was placed in a class of backward children.
808
01:06:46,469 --> 01:06:49,927
You say your parents died of natural causes.
809
01:06:50,373 --> 01:06:51,431
Yes.
810
01:06:51,807 --> 01:06:55,538
Would you describe in detail
the illness your mother died of?
811
01:06:55,611 --> 01:06:57,476
She died of her heart.
812
01:06:58,647 --> 01:07:01,275
In the last stages of her illness,
did your mother...
813
01:07:01,350 --> 01:07:05,719
show any mental peculiarities?
814
01:07:07,857 --> 01:07:09,449
No.
815
01:07:11,093 --> 01:07:13,391
In the decision that came down
from Stuttgart...
816
01:07:13,462 --> 01:07:17,193
it is stated that your mother suffered
from hereditary feeble-mindedness.
817
01:07:19,135 --> 01:07:21,365
That is not true!
818
01:07:23,472 --> 01:07:25,167
Can you give us some clarification...
819
01:07:25,241 --> 01:07:29,871
as to how the Hereditary Health Court
in Stuttgart arrived at that decision?
820
01:07:30,146 --> 01:07:35,106
It was just something they said
to put me on the operating table.
821
01:07:35,284 --> 01:07:37,878
- It was just something they said?
- Yes.
822
01:07:38,721 --> 01:07:42,748
Mr. Petersen, there was a simple test...
823
01:07:43,959 --> 01:07:48,259
that the Health Court used to ask
in all cases of mental incompetence.
824
01:07:48,731 --> 01:07:51,427
Since you say they did not ask you then...
825
01:07:51,901 --> 01:07:54,597
perhaps you can answer it for us now.
826
01:07:54,770 --> 01:07:58,536
Form a sentence out of the words
"Hare," "Hunter," "Field. "
827
01:07:58,607 --> 01:08:00,472
Your Honor, objection.
828
01:08:09,151 --> 01:08:13,417
Was the court in Stuttgart
constituted like this one?
829
01:08:14,857 --> 01:08:17,348
I don't understand what...
830
01:08:17,860 --> 01:08:19,725
Was there an audience?
831
01:08:20,830 --> 01:08:22,525
An audience? Yes.
832
01:08:23,833 --> 01:08:25,198
Thank you.
833
01:08:28,370 --> 01:08:30,133
Objection overruled.
834
01:08:32,241 --> 01:08:36,735
"Hare," "Hunter," "Field. "
835
01:08:40,783 --> 01:08:42,341
Take your time.
836
01:08:56,699 --> 01:08:59,361
They had already made up...
837
01:09:00,436 --> 01:09:03,963
When I walked into the court,
they had made up their minds.
838
01:09:07,009 --> 01:09:10,376
They put me in the hospital, like a criminal.
839
01:09:10,446 --> 01:09:13,677
I could not say anything.
I could not do anything.
840
01:09:16,752 --> 01:09:18,515
I had to lay there.
841
01:09:21,323 --> 01:09:23,757
My mother...
842
01:09:25,394 --> 01:09:27,328
what you say about her...
843
01:09:27,396 --> 01:09:31,355
She was a woman,
a servant woman who worked hard.
844
01:09:31,433 --> 01:09:33,367
She was a hardworking woman...
845
01:09:33,435 --> 01:09:36,996
and it is not fair what you say.
846
01:09:43,112 --> 01:09:44,204
Here.
847
01:09:46,348 --> 01:09:50,444
I want to show you. I have here her picture.
848
01:09:51,453 --> 01:09:53,751
I would like you to look at it.
849
01:10:05,434 --> 01:10:07,732
I would like you to judge.
850
01:10:09,672 --> 01:10:13,699
I want that you tell me...
851
01:10:14,176 --> 01:10:16,736
was she feeble-minded?
852
01:10:18,247 --> 01:10:19,874
My mother!
853
01:10:21,650 --> 01:10:23,550
Was she feeble-minded?
854
01:10:26,589 --> 01:10:27,851
Was she?
855
01:10:38,167 --> 01:10:41,500
I feel it is my duty
to point out to the tribunal...
856
01:10:42,438 --> 01:10:46,135
that the witness is not in control
of his mental processes.
857
01:10:46,809 --> 01:10:50,575
I know I am not. Since that day.
858
01:10:52,081 --> 01:10:55,778
I've been half I've ever been.
859
01:11:03,559 --> 01:11:06,619
The tribunal does not know
how you were before.
860
01:11:07,696 --> 01:11:09,391
It can never know.
861
01:11:10,933 --> 01:11:12,833
It has only your word.
862
01:11:34,223 --> 01:11:35,952
Court is adjourned.
863
01:11:48,537 --> 01:11:51,131
That's one problem we have
with the prosecution.
864
01:11:51,206 --> 01:11:54,107
It's filled with young radicals like Lawson.
865
01:11:54,476 --> 01:11:56,876
Is that what Lawson is? A young radical?
866
01:11:56,945 --> 01:11:59,709
He was a personal prot�g� of FDR.
867
01:12:00,015 --> 01:12:03,246
FDR had a few friends who weren't radicals,
didn't he?
868
01:12:03,319 --> 01:12:04,581
Name one.
869
01:12:05,921 --> 01:12:07,548
Wendell Wilkie.
870
01:12:08,824 --> 01:12:11,292
Is he your idea of a conservative?
871
01:12:11,960 --> 01:12:15,760
As a matter of fact, Dan,
I've been wondering how you stand.
872
01:12:16,165 --> 01:12:20,568
I'll clarify that for you, Curtiss.
I'm a rock-ribbed Republican...
873
01:12:20,736 --> 01:12:24,035
who thought that Franklin Roosevelt
was a great man.
874
01:12:24,907 --> 01:12:26,397
One of those?
875
01:12:29,578 --> 01:12:30,670
Max!
876
01:12:31,513 --> 01:12:34,448
- Max Perkins. You know him?
- No, I don't think so.
877
01:12:34,516 --> 01:12:36,643
He's with the United Press.
878
01:12:40,522 --> 01:12:42,319
Max, what are you doing here?
879
01:12:42,391 --> 01:12:44,586
I thought you might kick up a row
or something.
880
01:12:44,660 --> 01:12:47,060
I haven't had that much to drink.
881
01:12:47,429 --> 01:12:49,488
- I'm sorry, this is Judge Ives.
- Hello.
882
01:12:49,565 --> 01:12:51,658
- Mrs. Ives.
- How do you do?
883
01:12:51,734 --> 01:12:53,827
- How do you do?
- Judge Haywood, Mrs. Bertholt.
884
01:12:53,902 --> 01:12:56,029
- We have met.
- Yes, we have.
885
01:12:56,372 --> 01:12:58,431
Won't you join us for a drink?
886
01:12:58,507 --> 01:13:00,304
We would like to very much.
887
01:13:00,376 --> 01:13:02,867
- Max, will you sit here?
- Thank you.
888
01:13:03,212 --> 01:13:07,444
Incidentally, Max, I admired your article
on Mrs. Bertholt very much.
889
01:13:07,516 --> 01:13:09,108
It was straight reporting.
890
01:13:09,184 --> 01:13:11,709
Her defense of her husband
was quite eloquent.
891
01:13:11,787 --> 01:13:14,688
Are you going to do a story on these trials?
892
01:13:14,757 --> 01:13:16,850
I'll tell you something frankly, Judge.
893
01:13:16,925 --> 01:13:20,827
At the moment, I couldn't give a story away
on the Nuremberg Trials.
894
01:13:20,896 --> 01:13:22,488
What do you mean, Mr. Perkins?
895
01:13:22,564 --> 01:13:25,055
The American public
just isn't interested anymore.
896
01:13:25,134 --> 01:13:28,399
But the war's only been over
two years, Mr. Perkins.
897
01:13:28,470 --> 01:13:29,903
That's right.
898
01:13:29,972 --> 01:13:32,941
- May I take your order?
- Yes. See what the ladies will have.
899
01:13:33,008 --> 01:13:34,270
How about some more beer, Dan?
900
01:13:34,343 --> 01:13:38,712
No. I think I've had my fill of beer.
I'd like to try something else, if I may.
901
01:13:38,781 --> 01:13:43,184
Why don't you try some Sonnenberg,
or Schwalbenwinkel? It's the local wine.
902
01:13:43,252 --> 01:13:46,085
- Sonnenberg or...
- Schwalbenwinkel.
903
01:13:46,388 --> 01:13:49,789
Yes, I think I'd like that.
Some Schweissenwinkel.
904
01:13:50,325 --> 01:13:53,260
- Will you have some?
- Yes, thank you. I'll have the same.
905
01:13:53,328 --> 01:13:55,660
- Should we stay with the beer, Max?
- Fine.
906
01:13:55,731 --> 01:13:57,494
Thank you.
907
01:13:57,566 --> 01:14:00,933
- You got home all right the other night?
- Yes, thank you.
908
01:14:01,003 --> 01:14:04,336
I don't know what I would have done
without the car.
909
01:14:04,940 --> 01:14:07,807
You speak English very well, Mrs. Bertholt.
910
01:14:07,910 --> 01:14:11,539
Thank you. My husband and I
spent three years in America.
911
01:14:15,217 --> 01:14:18,414
I hope you had a chance
to see something of Nuremberg.
912
01:14:19,421 --> 01:14:24,324
I'm afraid mainly the road between my house
and the Palace of Justice.
913
01:14:24,827 --> 01:14:29,389
And then some places that have to do
with the case, the historical aspects.
914
01:14:29,598 --> 01:14:31,225
The Nazi aspects.
915
01:14:31,900 --> 01:14:34,494
You should see some of the other parts
of Nuremberg.
916
01:14:34,570 --> 01:14:37,562
There are many beautiful things to see
in the old part of town.
917
01:14:37,639 --> 01:14:39,869
Museums we're trying to rebuild.
918
01:14:39,942 --> 01:14:44,311
And there's a concert, a piano concert
next week at the old opera house.
919
01:14:44,379 --> 01:14:48,611
Arthur Reiss. He was a refugee from Hitler
in the early days.
920
01:14:49,418 --> 01:14:51,045
We've persuaded him to come back.
921
01:14:51,119 --> 01:14:54,646
It ought to be quite an evening.
Would you like to come?
922
01:14:54,990 --> 01:14:56,514
Yes, I would.
923
01:14:57,359 --> 01:15:01,318
I'll tell them to leave a ticket for you
at the box office. I'm on the committee.
924
01:15:01,396 --> 01:15:04,229
- Thank you very much, Mrs. Bertholt.
- It's nothing.
925
01:15:04,299 --> 01:15:08,258
You see, I have a mission with
the Americans, as Mr. Perkins can tell you.
926
01:15:08,337 --> 01:15:09,964
What is that?
927
01:15:10,906 --> 01:15:13,841
To convince you that we're not all monsters.
928
01:15:17,813 --> 01:15:19,474
- Good evening, Colonel.
- Good evening.
929
01:15:19,548 --> 01:15:21,482
Colonel. Maj. Radnitz.
930
01:15:21,717 --> 01:15:23,844
Good evening, Mrs. Bertholt.
931
01:15:27,122 --> 01:15:28,521
I hope you'll excuse me.
932
01:15:28,590 --> 01:15:29,955
But you've just come...
933
01:15:30,025 --> 01:15:33,392
No, I must go. Please excuse me.
It was awfully nice meeting you.
934
01:15:33,462 --> 01:15:37,296
If you want to hear the concert,
there'll be a ticket for you at the box office.
935
01:15:37,366 --> 01:15:39,095
- Thank you.
- Good night.
936
01:15:39,167 --> 01:15:41,635
- Good night.
- Good night, Mrs. Bertholt.
937
01:15:47,809 --> 01:15:52,246
Mrs. Bertholt doesn't hold
a burning passion for me.
938
01:15:53,482 --> 01:15:55,712
I prosecuted her husband.
939
01:15:57,519 --> 01:16:00,044
There are many people
who think a death sentence...
940
01:16:00,122 --> 01:16:02,955
would not have been passed
against Gen. Bertholt today.
941
01:16:03,025 --> 01:16:04,890
I'm sure there are.
942
01:16:05,494 --> 01:16:07,519
I'm sure there are people who think...
943
01:16:07,596 --> 01:16:10,963
all the prisoners in Nuremberg
should be free today.
944
01:16:11,033 --> 01:16:12,796
All of them. Let...
945
01:16:14,169 --> 01:16:15,864
Excuse me.
946
01:16:18,040 --> 01:16:20,167
I've had one or two too many...
947
01:16:20,242 --> 01:16:23,177
as might be painfully obvious
to you gentlemen.
948
01:16:23,579 --> 01:16:28,175
The spectacle this afternoon with
Mr. Petersen put me off my feed. I'm sorry.
949
01:16:28,250 --> 01:16:32,380
Three beers and Schwalbenwinkel, please.
950
01:16:38,994 --> 01:16:40,359
Schwalbenwinkel.
951
01:16:42,764 --> 01:16:46,325
It's good beer.
They make it good in this country.
952
01:16:49,204 --> 01:16:52,503
You know, there's one thing
about Americans.
953
01:16:53,642 --> 01:16:56,076
We're not cut out to be occupiers.
954
01:16:56,211 --> 01:16:59,146
We're new at it. We're not very good at it.
955
01:16:59,348 --> 01:17:02,215
We come over here, and what do we see?
956
01:17:03,218 --> 01:17:05,550
We see this beautiful country.
957
01:17:05,754 --> 01:17:08,348
It is beautiful. It's very beautiful.
958
01:17:08,890 --> 01:17:12,155
We see the culture that goes back
for hundreds of years.
959
01:17:12,227 --> 01:17:14,559
We see its gem�tlich charm...
960
01:17:15,163 --> 01:17:18,724
and the charm of people like Mrs. Bertholt.
961
01:17:20,135 --> 01:17:23,036
We've got a built-in inferiority complex.
962
01:17:23,105 --> 01:17:25,232
We forgive and forget easy.
963
01:17:25,874 --> 01:17:28,069
We give the other guy
the benefit of the doubt.
964
01:17:28,143 --> 01:17:30,111
That's the American way.
965
01:17:32,080 --> 01:17:35,811
We beat the greatest war machine
since Alexander the Great.
966
01:17:37,285 --> 01:17:39,685
And now the boy scouts take over.
967
01:17:41,223 --> 01:17:44,818
The trouble with you, Colonel,
is you'd like to indict the whole country.
968
01:17:44,893 --> 01:17:47,953
That might be emotionally satisfying
to you...
969
01:17:48,030 --> 01:17:51,466
but it wouldn't be exactly practical,
and hardly fair.
970
01:17:52,467 --> 01:17:53,866
Hardly fair?
971
01:17:57,172 --> 01:17:58,400
"Hare. "
972
01:17:59,474 --> 01:18:00,771
"Hunter. "
973
01:18:02,110 --> 01:18:03,372
"Field. "
974
01:18:04,980 --> 01:18:07,141
That's right, let's be fair.
975
01:18:08,116 --> 01:18:11,176
"The hare was shot by the hunter
in the field. "
976
01:18:11,953 --> 01:18:13,944
It's really quite simple.
977
01:18:17,292 --> 01:18:20,420
Colonel, I think we ought to be going.
978
01:18:21,129 --> 01:18:23,563
Yes, we really shouldn't be discussing this.
979
01:18:23,632 --> 01:18:27,295
No, Judge.
We're fair Americans, and true-blue.
980
01:18:27,369 --> 01:18:29,303
We mustn't do anything that's out of order.
981
01:18:29,371 --> 01:18:32,568
No, sir. We can't do anything
that's out of order.
982
01:18:36,278 --> 01:18:39,975
There are no Nazis in Germany.
Didn't you know that, Judge?
983
01:18:40,782 --> 01:18:43,842
The Eskimos invaded Germany
and took over.
984
01:18:43,919 --> 01:18:46,547
That's how
all those terrible things happened.
985
01:18:46,621 --> 01:18:51,217
It wasn't the fault of the Germans.
It was the fault of those damn Eskimos.
986
01:18:53,795 --> 01:18:55,160
Excuse me.
987
01:18:56,698 --> 01:18:59,030
- Good night, Colonel.
- Good night.
988
01:19:13,648 --> 01:19:17,084
Can I have your attention, please?
I'm sorry to interrupt your dancing.
989
01:19:17,152 --> 01:19:20,986
The following officers
are requested to report to their units.
990
01:19:21,256 --> 01:19:26,125
Maj. McCarthy, Maj. Citron,
Maj. Cantor, Capt. Byers...
991
01:19:26,461 --> 01:19:29,988
Capt. Connell, Capt. Douglas, Capt. Wolfe...
992
01:19:30,365 --> 01:19:32,833
Maj. Booth, and Maj. Rice.
993
01:19:33,568 --> 01:19:36,128
Thank you. You can continue dancing.
994
01:19:39,407 --> 01:19:41,102
Harry, what is it?
995
01:19:41,777 --> 01:19:44,177
The Russians have made their move
in Czechoslovakia.
996
01:19:44,246 --> 01:19:47,340
It's rumored Masaryk committed suicide.
We're sending units up.
997
01:19:47,415 --> 01:19:49,474
What do you think's going to happen?
998
01:19:49,551 --> 01:19:51,018
I don't know.
999
01:19:54,556 --> 01:19:56,148
Judge Haywood...
1000
01:19:58,260 --> 01:19:59,818
Elsa Scheffler.
1001
01:20:08,537 --> 01:20:10,801
"President Truman responded to the crisis...
1002
01:20:10,872 --> 01:20:13,500
"by calling for an extension
of military training.
1003
01:20:13,675 --> 01:20:18,374
"He stated that he is deeply concerned
with the survival of the Western nations...
1004
01:20:18,446 --> 01:20:21,074
"in face of the threat from the East. "
1005
01:20:21,449 --> 01:20:23,280
"Threat from the East. "
1006
01:20:23,418 --> 01:20:25,477
Herr Janning, did you hear this?
1007
01:20:25,554 --> 01:20:29,251
Did you hear what's in the paper?
Exactly what Hitler said.
1008
01:20:29,324 --> 01:20:32,054
"The clash for survival
between East and West. "
1009
01:20:32,127 --> 01:20:33,788
He knew!
1010
01:20:34,362 --> 01:20:38,230
They'll see that we knew exactly
what we were doing all the time.
1011
01:20:38,300 --> 01:20:42,634
They cannot call us criminals,
and at the same time ask us to help them.
1012
01:20:42,704 --> 01:20:44,467
We must stand together now.
1013
01:20:44,539 --> 01:20:47,303
The most crucial part of this case
is coming up.
1014
01:20:47,876 --> 01:20:50,777
We have fallen on happy times, Herr Hahn.
1015
01:20:50,846 --> 01:20:55,408
In old times it would have made your day
if I'd deigned to say good morning to you.
1016
01:20:55,483 --> 01:20:58,179
Now that we are here
in this place together...
1017
01:20:58,253 --> 01:21:01,552
you feel obliged to tell me
what to do with my life.
1018
01:21:01,756 --> 01:21:03,724
Herr Janning, you must stand with us.
1019
01:21:03,792 --> 01:21:06,090
It is not good for Germans
to turn on one another.
1020
01:21:06,161 --> 01:21:08,322
We have a common ground now.
1021
01:21:09,898 --> 01:21:11,763
Listen to me, Herr Hahn.
1022
01:21:11,833 --> 01:21:14,996
There have been terrible things
that have happened to me in my life.
1023
01:21:15,070 --> 01:21:17,038
But the worst thing
that has ever happened...
1024
01:21:17,105 --> 01:21:20,199
is to find myself
in the company of men like you.
1025
01:21:20,275 --> 01:21:23,039
I have nothing in common with you
and Party hacks like you.
1026
01:21:23,111 --> 01:21:26,569
You have something in common.
You were part of that same regime.
1027
01:21:26,648 --> 01:21:29,014
You stood by that regime,
the same as the rest of us.
1028
01:21:29,084 --> 01:21:32,110
And there's something else
you have in common.
1029
01:21:32,554 --> 01:21:34,181
You are a German.
1030
01:23:07,882 --> 01:23:09,349
Good evening. Did you like it?
1031
01:23:09,417 --> 01:23:12,215
Yes, I did. Very much indeed.
1032
01:23:12,387 --> 01:23:13,376
Can I drop you?
1033
01:23:13,455 --> 01:23:16,982
I only live a few blocks from here.
I was going to walk.
1034
01:23:17,192 --> 01:23:18,921
Would you like to go for a walk?
1035
01:23:19,060 --> 01:23:20,186
Yes, I would.
1036
01:23:20,261 --> 01:23:22,957
I won't need the car now.
I'll walk with Mrs. Bertholt.
1037
01:23:23,031 --> 01:23:25,864
- Shall I wait for you, Your Honor?
- That won't be necessary.
1038
01:23:25,934 --> 01:23:28,198
I'll wait for you, Your Honor.
1039
01:24:03,972 --> 01:24:07,703
The German people love to sing,
no matter what the situation.
1040
01:24:07,876 --> 01:24:09,537
I've noticed that.
1041
01:24:10,779 --> 01:24:14,806
Do American people sing in bars, too?
I have forgotten.
1042
01:24:15,884 --> 01:24:18,717
No. We're apt to be pretty sullen in bars.
1043
01:24:30,698 --> 01:24:32,893
I wish you understood German.
1044
01:24:33,802 --> 01:24:36,100
The words are very beautiful.
1045
01:24:36,304 --> 01:24:37,566
Very sad.
1046
01:24:38,239 --> 01:24:40,707
Much sadder than the English words.
1047
01:24:41,676 --> 01:24:45,112
The German soldier knows
he's going to lose his girl...
1048
01:24:46,648 --> 01:24:47,876
and his life.
1049
01:24:50,885 --> 01:24:52,682
The lantern burns every night.
1050
01:24:52,754 --> 01:24:54,551
It knows the steps...
1051
01:24:55,623 --> 01:24:56,954
and the way you walk.
1052
01:24:58,726 --> 01:25:02,059
It burns every night,
but I've been long forgotten.
1053
01:25:03,649 --> 01:25:05,276
Should harm come to me...
1054
01:25:06,519 --> 01:25:08,510
who will stand with you...
1055
01:25:09,488 --> 01:25:11,149
under the lantern?
1056
01:25:12,358 --> 01:25:15,623
With you, Lili Marleen.
1057
01:25:23,936 --> 01:25:28,134
What is your life like in America?
Do you have a family?
1058
01:25:28,207 --> 01:25:31,404
Yes, I have a daughter,
and she has four children.
1059
01:25:31,744 --> 01:25:34,975
Four? You must be very proud of them.
1060
01:25:35,147 --> 01:25:37,047
Yes, I am. I admit it.
1061
01:25:37,917 --> 01:25:41,648
- And where's your wife?
- She died a few years ago.
1062
01:25:45,324 --> 01:25:48,691
- How about you? Do you have children?
- No, I don't.
1063
01:25:50,362 --> 01:25:53,820
What is your position in America?
It must be important.
1064
01:25:53,899 --> 01:25:56,993
No, it isn't, really. I'm a District Court Judge.
1065
01:25:57,536 --> 01:26:00,061
I haven't even been that for the last year.
1066
01:26:00,239 --> 01:26:01,797
Are you retired?
1067
01:26:01,874 --> 01:26:04,104
Forcibly, by the electorate.
1068
01:26:04,443 --> 01:26:07,310
You elect judges in the United States?
1069
01:26:07,780 --> 01:26:11,648
- Yes, in some states.
- I didn't know that.
1070
01:26:11,717 --> 01:26:15,710
It's either one of the virtues
or one of the defects of our judicial system.
1071
01:26:15,788 --> 01:26:19,690
I thought it was one of the virtues
until last year, when I was defeated.
1072
01:26:19,858 --> 01:26:23,089
I'm sure it was the fault
of the electorate, not yours.
1073
01:26:23,229 --> 01:26:26,528
Seems to be some difference of opinion
about that.
1074
01:26:30,002 --> 01:26:31,765
This is where I live.
1075
01:26:31,837 --> 01:26:35,329
- Here?
- Yes. It's not so bad inside.
1076
01:26:35,407 --> 01:26:38,001
Would you like to come up?
I could make some coffee.
1077
01:26:38,077 --> 01:26:39,669
Yes, thank you.
1078
01:26:57,730 --> 01:27:00,290
Things haven't been very easy for you,
have they?
1079
01:27:00,532 --> 01:27:02,762
I'm not used to them being easy.
1080
01:27:02,901 --> 01:27:05,233
I'm not fragile, Judge Haywood.
1081
01:27:05,838 --> 01:27:09,968
I'm a daughter of the military.
You know what that means, don't you?
1082
01:27:10,843 --> 01:27:12,435
No, I'm afraid I don't.
1083
01:27:13,078 --> 01:27:15,478
It means I was taught discipline.
1084
01:27:16,448 --> 01:27:18,473
A very special kind of discipline.
1085
01:27:18,550 --> 01:27:20,074
For instance, when I was a child...
1086
01:27:20,152 --> 01:27:23,053
we used to go for long rides
into the country in summertime.
1087
01:27:23,389 --> 01:27:26,825
But I was never allowed to run
to the lemonade stand with the others.
1088
01:27:27,793 --> 01:27:30,694
I was told, "Control your thirst.
1089
01:27:32,331 --> 01:27:33,923
"Control hunger.
1090
01:27:35,267 --> 01:27:36,734
"Control emotion. "
1091
01:27:37,403 --> 01:27:39,268
It has served me well.
1092
01:27:40,506 --> 01:27:41,871
And your husband?
1093
01:27:41,940 --> 01:27:44,135
Was he of that heritage, too?
1094
01:27:44,410 --> 01:27:46,071
My husband was a soldier.
1095
01:27:46,145 --> 01:27:50,582
He was brought up to do one thing:
To fight in the battle, and fight well.
1096
01:27:54,153 --> 01:27:57,122
- Is the coffee all right?
- Fine, thank you.
1097
01:27:57,189 --> 01:27:59,680
It's ersatz, but I always try to make it strong.
1098
01:27:59,758 --> 01:28:01,089
It's fine.
1099
01:28:07,199 --> 01:28:08,393
I'm curious.
1100
01:28:10,602 --> 01:28:12,536
What do you think of Ernst Janning?
1101
01:28:16,208 --> 01:28:20,542
I really am not at liberty to discuss the case
outside of the courtroom.
1102
01:28:20,846 --> 01:28:22,643
Yes, of course.
1103
01:28:27,753 --> 01:28:29,744
I knew Ernst Janning a little.
1104
01:28:29,822 --> 01:28:32,347
We used to attend the same concerts.
1105
01:28:32,658 --> 01:28:36,219
I remember there was a reception given
for Wagner's daughter-in-law.
1106
01:28:36,295 --> 01:28:37,922
Hitler was there.
1107
01:28:38,330 --> 01:28:40,958
Ernst Janning was there with his wife.
1108
01:28:41,567 --> 01:28:43,467
She was very beautiful...
1109
01:28:43,802 --> 01:28:46,100
very small, very delicate.
1110
01:28:46,372 --> 01:28:47,896
She's dead now.
1111
01:28:49,174 --> 01:28:51,438
Hitler was quite taken with her.
1112
01:28:51,510 --> 01:28:54,536
He made advances towards her
during the reception.
1113
01:28:54,613 --> 01:28:57,980
He used to do things like that
in a burst of emotion.
1114
01:28:58,217 --> 01:29:01,653
I will never forget
the way Ernst Janning cut him down.
1115
01:29:02,321 --> 01:29:05,154
I don't think anybody ever did it
to him quite that way.
1116
01:29:05,224 --> 01:29:07,522
He said, "Chancellor...
1117
01:29:07,960 --> 01:29:11,123
"I do not object so much
that you are so ill-mannered.
1118
01:29:12,164 --> 01:29:14,064
"I do not object to that so much.
1119
01:29:15,501 --> 01:29:17,901
"I object that you are such a bourgeois. "
1120
01:29:19,438 --> 01:29:22,669
Hitler whitened, stared at Janning,
and walked out.
1121
01:29:27,746 --> 01:29:32,046
- Is the coffee really all right?
- Fine, thank you.
1122
01:29:34,586 --> 01:29:35,951
Men like Janning...
1123
01:29:37,089 --> 01:29:38,454
my husband and I...
1124
01:29:38,690 --> 01:29:40,988
we hated Hitler. I want you to know that.
1125
01:29:41,593 --> 01:29:43,151
And he hated us.
1126
01:29:43,996 --> 01:29:47,261
He hated my husband
because he was a real war hero...
1127
01:29:47,399 --> 01:29:50,493
and the little corporal couldn't tolerate that.
1128
01:29:50,836 --> 01:29:53,430
And he hated him
because he married into nobility...
1129
01:29:54,273 --> 01:29:55,740
which was my family.
1130
01:29:56,775 --> 01:30:00,074
Hitler was in awe of the nobility,
but he hated it.
1131
01:30:01,947 --> 01:30:05,508
That's why it's so ironic, what happened.
1132
01:30:09,955 --> 01:30:12,355
You know what happened to my husband,
don't you?
1133
01:30:12,424 --> 01:30:13,482
Yes.
1134
01:30:13,959 --> 01:30:17,053
What did he know of the crimes
they cited him for?
1135
01:30:18,096 --> 01:30:21,554
He was placed on trial
with the other military leaders.
1136
01:30:22,000 --> 01:30:25,629
It was part of their revenge.
The victors always take on the vanquished.
1137
01:30:27,940 --> 01:30:29,931
It was political murder.
1138
01:30:30,943 --> 01:30:33,104
You can see that, can't you?
1139
01:30:34,279 --> 01:30:37,510
Mrs. Bertholt, I don't know what I see.
1140
01:30:38,851 --> 01:30:42,810
I probably shouldn't be here
talking with you about this at all.
1141
01:30:44,089 --> 01:30:47,820
But I want to understand.
I do want to understand.
1142
01:30:49,027 --> 01:30:50,358
I have to.
1143
01:31:04,142 --> 01:31:06,042
Would you like some more coffee?
1144
01:31:07,112 --> 01:31:08,636
Yes, thank you.
1145
01:31:18,023 --> 01:31:19,149
Hi.
1146
01:31:24,162 --> 01:31:25,891
We found Irene Hoffman.
1147
01:31:27,766 --> 01:31:29,461
- Where?
- Berlin.
1148
01:31:30,302 --> 01:31:31,667
Berlin, eh?
1149
01:31:31,937 --> 01:31:36,567
She got married. Her name is Wallner now.
That's why we had difficulty locating her.
1150
01:31:36,642 --> 01:31:39,736
- When is she coming?
- She's not coming.
1151
01:31:40,012 --> 01:31:41,912
What do you mean, she's not coming?
1152
01:31:41,980 --> 01:31:43,880
She doesn't want to come.
1153
01:31:43,949 --> 01:31:48,079
You know what it's like.
None of them want to testify anymore.
1154
01:31:48,620 --> 01:31:50,611
If I catch the midnight...
1155
01:31:50,956 --> 01:31:54,016
I could make it to Berlin,
and be back by tomorrow afternoon.
1156
01:31:54,092 --> 01:31:57,755
- Tad, you haven't had any sleep...
- It'll be worth it if I can get Hoffman.
1157
01:31:57,829 --> 01:32:00,798
Take over for me in court
in the morning, will you?
1158
01:32:53,685 --> 01:32:54,811
Colonel, please!
1159
01:32:54,886 --> 01:32:59,585
I told you before, when you first came in.
I say it again now.
1160
01:32:59,691 --> 01:33:01,454
We are through with all this.
1161
01:33:01,927 --> 01:33:04,987
She does not have to go,
you have no right to order her to go.
1162
01:33:05,063 --> 01:33:07,361
Mr. Wallner, I'm not ordering her to go.
1163
01:33:07,432 --> 01:33:09,866
I have no authority to order her to go.
1164
01:33:10,035 --> 01:33:13,163
Do you think we get a medal
for appearing at these trials?
1165
01:33:13,338 --> 01:33:14,600
The people do not like them.
1166
01:33:14,673 --> 01:33:18,006
They do not believe that Germans
should testify against other Germans.
1167
01:33:18,276 --> 01:33:23,111
I haven't been prosecuting these cases
for the past two years without knowing that.
1168
01:33:31,423 --> 01:33:33,618
It is easy for you to say go.
1169
01:33:33,692 --> 01:33:37,856
After the trial you will go back to America,
but we must stay and live with these people.
1170
01:33:37,929 --> 01:33:41,057
Don't you think I realize what I'm asking?
1171
01:33:41,133 --> 01:33:44,534
Then how can you come in like the Gestapo,
in the middle of the night...
1172
01:33:44,603 --> 01:33:48,403
Because they must not be allowed
to get away with what they did.
1173
01:33:49,408 --> 01:33:53,037
You really think they won't get away with it
in the end?
1174
01:33:55,847 --> 01:33:58,247
I say the hell with them,
and the hell with you.
1175
01:33:58,316 --> 01:33:59,442
Hugo.
1176
01:34:10,495 --> 01:34:12,895
Emil Hahn will be there?
1177
01:34:14,332 --> 01:34:16,493
Yes. In the dock.
1178
01:34:19,705 --> 01:34:21,195
Ernst Janning?
1179
01:34:23,308 --> 01:34:24,366
Yes.
1180
01:34:34,519 --> 01:34:36,714
You saw the store downstairs.
1181
01:34:40,092 --> 01:34:41,684
It's not much...
1182
01:34:42,594 --> 01:34:44,687
but it's a new start for us.
1183
01:34:46,898 --> 01:34:49,662
They will come if I go to Nuremberg.
1184
01:34:52,537 --> 01:34:53,936
They will come...
1185
01:34:55,173 --> 01:34:56,868
and break the windows of the store.
1186
01:34:56,942 --> 01:34:59,502
I'll place a guard in front of the store,
24 hours a day.
1187
01:34:59,578 --> 01:35:02,172
You do not have to go.
He has no right to ask you to go.
1188
01:35:02,247 --> 01:35:03,942
You do have to go.
1189
01:35:04,783 --> 01:35:08,719
You have to go, for all those people
who can't get up on the stand themselves.
1190
01:35:08,787 --> 01:35:12,120
- You do not owe it to anybody!
- Yes, you do!
1191
01:35:16,628 --> 01:35:18,755
You owe it to one person, at least.
1192
01:35:39,417 --> 01:35:40,816
In the night...
1193
01:35:41,620 --> 01:35:43,178
every night...
1194
01:35:45,056 --> 01:35:48,753
we've known somehow
it would come to this.
1195
01:36:05,177 --> 01:36:08,237
Dr. Geuter, do you recognize that headline?
1196
01:36:08,680 --> 01:36:10,045
Yes, sir.
1197
01:36:10,115 --> 01:36:12,549
Would you read it to the tribunal?
1198
01:36:12,717 --> 01:36:14,844
"Death to the race defiler. "
1199
01:36:15,020 --> 01:36:17,352
In what newspaper did it appear?
1200
01:36:17,656 --> 01:36:20,352
In Julius Streicher's Der St�rmer.
1201
01:36:20,425 --> 01:36:22,723
What was it in connection with?
1202
01:36:23,662 --> 01:36:25,562
The Feldenstein case.
1203
01:36:25,764 --> 01:36:27,994
What was the Feldenstein case?
1204
01:36:28,233 --> 01:36:29,723
Your Honor...
1205
01:36:29,901 --> 01:36:32,665
defense objects
to the introduction of the Feldenstein case.
1206
01:36:32,737 --> 01:36:36,571
It is a notorious case,
perhaps the most notorious of the period.
1207
01:36:36,641 --> 01:36:41,305
It has overtones, and appeals to emotion...
1208
01:36:41,680 --> 01:36:44,615
that would perhaps be best not raised.
1209
01:36:44,683 --> 01:36:48,744
There are no issues or overtones
that may not be raised in this courtroom.
1210
01:36:48,887 --> 01:36:51,879
The tribunal is interested in everything
that is relevant.
1211
01:36:51,957 --> 01:36:53,857
Objection is overruled.
1212
01:36:58,296 --> 01:37:00,491
It's all right. I'll take it.
1213
01:37:03,902 --> 01:37:05,927
May it please the tribunal?
1214
01:37:06,004 --> 01:37:08,199
- You may continue.
- Thank you.
1215
01:37:17,582 --> 01:37:18,742
Now.
1216
01:37:19,417 --> 01:37:21,282
What was the Feldenstein case?
1217
01:37:22,654 --> 01:37:26,249
The case of a man
accused of racial pollution.
1218
01:37:26,892 --> 01:37:30,726
Will you explain what is meant
by "racial pollution"?
1219
01:37:31,730 --> 01:37:35,791
This is the charge
that is referred to in the Nuremberg Laws.
1220
01:37:37,002 --> 01:37:41,564
It says that any non-Aryan
having sexual relations with an Aryan...
1221
01:37:41,940 --> 01:37:43,840
may be punished by death.
1222
01:37:44,009 --> 01:37:47,809
When did you first become acquainted
with the Feldenstein case?
1223
01:37:49,080 --> 01:37:53,244
In September 1935,
I was contacted by the police.
1224
01:37:53,318 --> 01:37:56,412
They said that Mr. Feldenstein
was being held...
1225
01:37:56,621 --> 01:38:00,921
and that he requested
that I serve as his counselor.
1226
01:38:01,059 --> 01:38:03,425
What position did he hold
in the community?
1227
01:38:03,595 --> 01:38:06,325
He was a very well-known merchant.
1228
01:38:06,598 --> 01:38:10,591
He was one of the heads
of the Jewish congregation in Nuremberg.
1229
01:38:11,102 --> 01:38:14,435
What was the nature of the charge
against him?
1230
01:38:15,440 --> 01:38:18,637
He was accused
of having intimate relations...
1231
01:38:19,311 --> 01:38:22,769
with a 16-year-old girl, Irene Hoffman.
1232
01:38:23,949 --> 01:38:25,211
I see.
1233
01:38:26,451 --> 01:38:29,682
And what did he say to you about the case?
1234
01:38:30,555 --> 01:38:32,352
He said it was false.
1235
01:38:32,657 --> 01:38:35,353
He said he knew the girl and her family
a long time.
1236
01:38:35,493 --> 01:38:37,893
He'd gone to visit her since they died.
1237
01:38:38,063 --> 01:38:42,227
But there had never been anything
of the kind charged between them.
1238
01:38:43,969 --> 01:38:48,702
Doctor, would you please tell the tribunal
what happened then?
1239
01:38:50,041 --> 01:38:53,738
He was indicted before
the special court at Nuremberg.
1240
01:38:53,912 --> 01:38:56,312
And where was this special court?
1241
01:38:56,514 --> 01:38:59,210
It was right here, this building.
1242
01:39:00,018 --> 01:39:01,485
This very courtroom.
1243
01:39:04,356 --> 01:39:06,950
What were the circumstances
surrounding the trial?
1244
01:39:09,227 --> 01:39:14,028
It was used as a show place
for National Socialism.
1245
01:39:15,533 --> 01:39:18,866
It was the time
of the September celebrations...
1246
01:39:19,437 --> 01:39:21,098
the Nuremberg rallies.
1247
01:39:22,207 --> 01:39:24,266
The courtroom was crowded.
1248
01:39:24,976 --> 01:39:27,536
Back there, people were standing up.
1249
01:39:29,047 --> 01:39:32,539
Julius Streicher was sitting
in one of the front seats.
1250
01:39:33,485 --> 01:39:36,750
And high officials of the Nazi Party
were all over.
1251
01:39:39,824 --> 01:39:41,291
Would you please tell us...
1252
01:39:41,826 --> 01:39:45,523
what were your expectations for the trial
in this climate?
1253
01:39:46,097 --> 01:39:47,792
I expected the worst...
1254
01:39:48,633 --> 01:39:50,362
when I saw...
1255
01:39:51,302 --> 01:39:53,736
that Emil Hahn was the public prosecutor.
1256
01:39:54,639 --> 01:39:56,266
He was a fanatic.
1257
01:39:56,941 --> 01:40:00,433
His trials were always marked
by extreme brutality.
1258
01:40:06,384 --> 01:40:09,285
But I had one hope for the outcome...
1259
01:40:12,090 --> 01:40:14,524
because sitting on the judge's bench...
1260
01:40:16,027 --> 01:40:17,494
was Ernst Janning.
1261
01:40:18,797 --> 01:40:22,995
His reputation
was known throughout Germany.
1262
01:40:23,068 --> 01:40:27,368
He was known
to have dedicated his life to justice.
1263
01:40:28,173 --> 01:40:30,198
To the concept of justice.
1264
01:40:33,745 --> 01:40:35,610
Thank you. That's all.
1265
01:40:38,750 --> 01:40:40,240
Any questions?
1266
01:40:42,220 --> 01:40:44,188
Thank you. No questions.
1267
01:40:44,556 --> 01:40:46,456
The witness is excused.
1268
01:40:48,026 --> 01:40:50,256
The prosecution calls to the stand...
1269
01:40:51,362 --> 01:40:53,330
Irene Hoffman Wallner.
1270
01:41:17,622 --> 01:41:19,920
Will you raise your right hand?
1271
01:41:20,458 --> 01:41:22,517
I swear by God,
the Almighty and Omniscient...
1272
01:41:22,594 --> 01:41:25,825
that I will speak the pure truth,
and will withhold and add nothing.
1273
01:41:25,897 --> 01:41:26,989
I do.
1274
01:41:31,736 --> 01:41:35,103
Will you please state your name
to the tribunal?
1275
01:41:37,942 --> 01:41:40,274
Irene Hoffman Wallner.
1276
01:41:40,778 --> 01:41:42,268
Mrs. Wallner...
1277
01:41:43,548 --> 01:41:46,312
did you know Lehman Feldenstein?
1278
01:41:47,018 --> 01:41:48,212
Yes.
1279
01:41:48,286 --> 01:41:50,516
When did you first meet him?
1280
01:41:51,222 --> 01:41:54,419
It was 1925 or 1926.
1281
01:41:55,593 --> 01:41:57,390
I am not sure exactly.
1282
01:41:58,096 --> 01:42:00,064
How old was he at this time?
1283
01:42:00,198 --> 01:42:02,063
He was in his 50s.
1284
01:42:02,534 --> 01:42:05,469
And how old was he
at the time of his arrest?
1285
01:42:07,572 --> 01:42:09,938
He was 65.
1286
01:42:10,742 --> 01:42:12,107
I see.
1287
01:42:12,777 --> 01:42:15,575
What was the nature of your relationship?
1288
01:42:17,415 --> 01:42:19,007
We were friends.
1289
01:42:20,251 --> 01:42:23,482
Did you continue to see him
after your parents died?
1290
01:42:23,655 --> 01:42:25,555
- Yes.
- Why?
1291
01:42:27,325 --> 01:42:28,917
We were friends.
1292
01:42:30,795 --> 01:42:33,696
He owned the building that I lived in.
1293
01:42:34,532 --> 01:42:37,501
His business took him there quite often.
1294
01:42:39,571 --> 01:42:44,531
What did you say to the police
when they questioned you...
1295
01:42:44,609 --> 01:42:47,442
about having intimate relations with him?
1296
01:42:48,379 --> 01:42:51,280
I told them it was a lie.
1297
01:42:51,983 --> 01:42:55,111
Could you tell me
who the public prosecutor was?
1298
01:42:58,656 --> 01:42:59,987
Emil Hahn.
1299
01:43:01,326 --> 01:43:03,419
Did Emil Hahn question you?
1300
01:43:05,129 --> 01:43:06,187
Yes.
1301
01:43:06,264 --> 01:43:08,164
What did he say to you?
1302
01:43:11,970 --> 01:43:16,339
He took me into a separate room,
where we were alone.
1303
01:43:18,209 --> 01:43:21,610
He told me that it was no use...
1304
01:43:22,113 --> 01:43:23,774
to repeat my story...
1305
01:43:24,782 --> 01:43:27,148
because no one would believe me.
1306
01:43:28,920 --> 01:43:31,354
There had been a race defilement...
1307
01:43:32,357 --> 01:43:34,348
and the only pardon for this was...
1308
01:43:35,226 --> 01:43:37,251
to kill the violator.
1309
01:43:40,365 --> 01:43:44,096
He told me that if I protected...
1310
01:43:45,436 --> 01:43:46,869
Mr. Feldenstein...
1311
01:43:47,205 --> 01:43:51,266
that I would be held under arrest for perjury.
1312
01:43:52,243 --> 01:43:53,972
What did you reply to him?
1313
01:43:55,413 --> 01:43:59,611
I told him what I had said again and again.
1314
01:43:59,684 --> 01:44:03,848
I told him that I could not say anything else.
1315
01:44:03,921 --> 01:44:08,381
I could not lie about someone
who had been so kind to me.
1316
01:44:09,160 --> 01:44:11,060
Were you held under arrest?
1317
01:44:12,497 --> 01:44:13,759
Yes.
1318
01:44:15,166 --> 01:44:16,793
Mrs. Wallner, tell us...
1319
01:44:18,403 --> 01:44:19,836
what was the...
1320
01:44:20,872 --> 01:44:25,275
the manner in which Emil Hahn
conducted the prosecution?
1321
01:44:29,747 --> 01:44:31,738
He made a mockery...
1322
01:44:32,283 --> 01:44:36,617
of everything Mr. Feldenstein tried to say
in his own defense.
1323
01:44:40,191 --> 01:44:43,422
He held him up to ridicule
whenever possible.
1324
01:44:44,128 --> 01:44:46,688
What was the reaction of the audience?
1325
01:44:47,732 --> 01:44:49,165
They laughed.
1326
01:44:49,834 --> 01:44:52,029
Again and again.
1327
01:44:53,504 --> 01:44:55,665
How long did the trial last?
1328
01:45:06,250 --> 01:45:07,342
Two days.
1329
01:45:07,418 --> 01:45:10,751
Was the verdict passed
at the end of the second day?
1330
01:45:11,422 --> 01:45:12,548
Yes.
1331
01:45:12,690 --> 01:45:14,521
What was the verdict?
1332
01:45:14,792 --> 01:45:15,986
Guilty.
1333
01:45:16,594 --> 01:45:18,061
And what was the sentence?
1334
01:45:20,631 --> 01:45:23,099
Mr. Feldenstein was sentenced...
1335
01:45:24,602 --> 01:45:26,092
to be executed.
1336
01:45:27,438 --> 01:45:31,465
I was sentenced to be imprisoned
for two years, for perjury.
1337
01:45:34,512 --> 01:45:38,039
Who was the presiding judge?
1338
01:45:39,584 --> 01:45:41,017
Ernst Janning.
1339
01:45:42,787 --> 01:45:45,153
Were the sentences carried out?
1340
01:45:51,262 --> 01:45:53,730
Thank you very much, Mrs. Wallner.
1341
01:45:53,798 --> 01:45:55,197
That's all.
1342
01:46:00,304 --> 01:46:01,703
Any questions?
1343
01:46:14,452 --> 01:46:17,944
Your Honor, I would like to request
that the witness...
1344
01:46:18,122 --> 01:46:19,817
be kept available.
1345
01:46:20,925 --> 01:46:24,292
We will present further evidence
on the Feldenstein matter...
1346
01:46:24,362 --> 01:46:27,820
when it comes time for the defense
to present its case.
1347
01:46:30,701 --> 01:46:33,966
The witness will please hold herself
so available.
1348
01:46:35,406 --> 01:46:37,738
You may go. You're excused now.
1349
01:46:59,997 --> 01:47:01,555
Col. Lawson?
1350
01:47:06,704 --> 01:47:08,194
Your Honors...
1351
01:47:08,573 --> 01:47:11,906
I offer in evidence a decree
signed by Adolf Hitler...
1352
01:47:12,376 --> 01:47:13,707
directing all persons accused...
1353
01:47:13,778 --> 01:47:17,976
or suspected of disloyalty
or resistance of any sort...
1354
01:47:18,749 --> 01:47:20,944
might be arrested secretly...
1355
01:47:21,018 --> 01:47:25,284
with no notice to friends or relatives,
without any trial whatsoever...
1356
01:47:25,356 --> 01:47:28,086
and put into concentration camps.
1357
01:47:28,192 --> 01:47:32,288
I also offer a group of orders
issued under that decree...
1358
01:47:33,264 --> 01:47:35,994
each one signed by one of the defendants...
1359
01:47:37,168 --> 01:47:41,969
by which hundreds of persons were arrested
and placed in concentration camps.
1360
01:47:42,139 --> 01:47:44,164
Signed by Friedrich Hoffstetter...
1361
01:47:45,910 --> 01:47:47,639
Werner Lammpe...
1362
01:47:49,013 --> 01:47:50,571
Emil Hahn...
1363
01:47:51,916 --> 01:47:53,611
Ernst Janning.
1364
01:47:56,053 --> 01:47:57,543
Your Honors...
1365
01:47:58,723 --> 01:48:01,624
the defendants on trial here today...
1366
01:48:01,692 --> 01:48:05,150
did not personally administer
the concentration camps.
1367
01:48:06,364 --> 01:48:08,855
They never had to beat victims...
1368
01:48:09,500 --> 01:48:12,958
or pull the lever that released gas
into the chambers.
1369
01:48:14,472 --> 01:48:18,670
But as the documents we've introduced
into this case have shown...
1370
01:48:19,310 --> 01:48:22,677
these defendants fashioned
and executed laws...
1371
01:48:23,514 --> 01:48:25,539
and rendered judgments...
1372
01:48:27,652 --> 01:48:30,143
which sent millions of victims to their...
1373
01:48:31,122 --> 01:48:32,555
destinations.
1374
01:48:32,957 --> 01:48:34,481
Maj. Radnitz?
1375
01:48:36,527 --> 01:48:41,226
Your Honors, I would like to request that
Col. Lawson be sworn in as a witness.
1376
01:48:41,299 --> 01:48:43,767
- Granted.
- Thank you.
1377
01:48:49,440 --> 01:48:51,101
Will you raise your right hand?
1378
01:48:51,175 --> 01:48:53,143
I swear by God,
the Almighty and Omniscient...
1379
01:48:53,210 --> 01:48:56,111
that I will speak the pure truth
and withhold and add nothing.
1380
01:48:56,180 --> 01:48:57,272
I do.
1381
01:49:00,284 --> 01:49:04,380
Were you active in the United States Army
in 1945 at the close of the war?
1382
01:49:04,889 --> 01:49:06,254
Yes, I was.
1383
01:49:06,591 --> 01:49:10,459
Were you in command of troops
liberating concentration camps?
1384
01:49:10,528 --> 01:49:11,688
I was.
1385
01:49:12,296 --> 01:49:14,526
Were you in Dachau and Belsen?
1386
01:49:14,865 --> 01:49:15,957
Yes.
1387
01:49:16,467 --> 01:49:19,595
Were you present when the films
we are about to see were taken?
1388
01:49:19,670 --> 01:49:21,069
Yes, I was.
1389
01:49:49,033 --> 01:49:50,227
Okay.
1390
01:49:58,809 --> 01:50:03,508
The map shows the number of
and location of concentration camps...
1391
01:50:05,016 --> 01:50:06,916
under the Third Reich.
1392
01:50:08,786 --> 01:50:11,880
The Buchenwald concentration camp
was founded...
1393
01:50:12,556 --> 01:50:14,046
in 1933.
1394
01:50:16,060 --> 01:50:18,927
Its inmates numbered about 80,000.
1395
01:50:21,365 --> 01:50:23,697
There was a motto at Buchenwald:
1396
01:50:24,235 --> 01:50:25,827
"Break the body...
1397
01:50:28,572 --> 01:50:30,369
"break the spirit...
1398
01:50:33,244 --> 01:50:34,711
"break the heart. "
1399
01:50:37,248 --> 01:50:39,716
The ovens at Buchenwald.
1400
01:50:41,052 --> 01:50:44,749
Evidence of last-minute efforts
to dispose of bodies.
1401
01:50:46,557 --> 01:50:50,323
The stoves were manufactured
by a well-known company...
1402
01:50:51,228 --> 01:50:55,028
which also specialized in baking ovens.
1403
01:50:56,100 --> 01:50:58,967
The name of the firm is clearly inscribed.
1404
01:50:59,603 --> 01:51:03,061
An exhibit of byproducts of Buchenwald...
1405
01:51:04,175 --> 01:51:07,736
displayed for the local townspeople
by an Allied officer.
1406
01:51:09,680 --> 01:51:11,910
Brushes of every description.
1407
01:51:12,349 --> 01:51:15,876
Shoes, adults and children.
1408
01:51:16,987 --> 01:51:18,579
Spectacles.
1409
01:51:19,490 --> 01:51:21,481
Gold from teeth melted down...
1410
01:51:21,559 --> 01:51:24,619
sent once a month
to the Medical Department of the...
1411
01:51:24,695 --> 01:51:26,356
Waffen-SS.
1412
01:51:27,064 --> 01:51:30,500
A lampshade made from human skin.
1413
01:51:32,570 --> 01:51:34,936
Skin being used for paintings...
1414
01:51:36,774 --> 01:51:39,038
many having an obscene nature.
1415
01:51:41,345 --> 01:51:44,178
The heads of two Polish laborers...
1416
01:51:45,182 --> 01:51:47,946
shrunken to one-fifth their normal size.
1417
01:51:49,420 --> 01:51:52,856
A human pelvis used as an ashtray.
1418
01:51:56,994 --> 01:52:01,897
Children who'd been tattooed to mark them
for eventual extermination.
1419
01:52:05,536 --> 01:52:08,767
Sometimes mercy was shown
to the children.
1420
01:52:09,940 --> 01:52:12,408
They were injected with morphia...
1421
01:52:12,610 --> 01:52:15,170
so they'd be unconscious when hanged.
1422
01:52:16,180 --> 01:52:20,913
One of the doctors described how they'd
then place ropes around their necks...
1423
01:52:20,985 --> 01:52:23,351
and in the doctor's own words:
1424
01:52:23,821 --> 01:52:25,550
"Like pictures...
1425
01:52:25,923 --> 01:52:29,586
"they were then hanged
by hooks on the walls. "
1426
01:52:33,931 --> 01:52:36,923
The bodies of those
who had come in boxcars...
1427
01:52:37,334 --> 01:52:39,529
without food and without air...
1428
01:52:40,137 --> 01:52:43,004
who hadn't survived the journey to Dachau.
1429
01:52:44,708 --> 01:52:48,075
Hundreds of inmates were used
as human guinea pigs...
1430
01:52:49,013 --> 01:52:51,277
for atrocious medical experiments.
1431
01:52:53,384 --> 01:52:58,083
A witness at one of the executions
at Dachau gave the following description:
1432
01:53:00,391 --> 01:53:03,827
"Inmates were made to leave
their clothing on a rack.
1433
01:53:04,228 --> 01:53:07,163
"They were told they were going
to take baths.
1434
01:53:07,898 --> 01:53:09,991
"Then the doors were locked.
1435
01:53:11,035 --> 01:53:13,060
"Tins of Zyklon B...
1436
01:53:13,304 --> 01:53:16,967
"were released through
the specially constructed apertures.
1437
01:53:19,076 --> 01:53:22,534
"You could hear the groaning
and the whimpering inside.
1438
01:53:23,848 --> 01:53:25,713
"After two or three minutes...
1439
01:53:26,784 --> 01:53:27,978
"all was quiet. "
1440
01:53:36,527 --> 01:53:41,294
Death transports that had arrived
included 90,000 from Slovakia...
1441
01:53:44,301 --> 01:53:46,565
65,000 from Greece...
1442
01:53:48,038 --> 01:53:50,006
11,000 from France...
1443
01:53:52,910 --> 01:53:54,878
90,000 from Holland...
1444
01:53:57,982 --> 01:54:00,143
400,000 from Hungary...
1445
01:54:03,120 --> 01:54:06,578
250,000 from Poland and Upper Silesia...
1446
01:54:08,859 --> 01:54:11,589
and 100,000 from Germany.
1447
01:54:15,232 --> 01:54:17,359
And this is what was filmed when...
1448
01:54:17,434 --> 01:54:20,892
British troops liberated
Belsen concentration camp.
1449
01:54:25,476 --> 01:54:27,273
For sanitary reasons...
1450
01:54:27,344 --> 01:54:31,940
a British bulldozer had to bury the bodies
as quickly as possible.
1451
01:54:39,123 --> 01:54:40,920
Who were the bodies?
1452
01:54:42,760 --> 01:54:45,957
Members of every occupied country
of Europe.
1453
01:54:47,965 --> 01:54:50,365
Two-thirds of the Jews of Europe...
1454
01:54:52,136 --> 01:54:53,626
exterminated.
1455
01:54:55,072 --> 01:54:57,063
More than six million...
1456
01:54:58,409 --> 01:55:02,038
according to reports
from the Nazis' own figures.
1457
01:55:06,750 --> 01:55:08,650
But the real figure...
1458
01:55:13,691 --> 01:55:15,181
no one knows.
1459
01:55:22,533 --> 01:55:25,798
How dare they show us those films?
How dare they?
1460
01:55:27,271 --> 01:55:30,001
We are not executioners. We are judges.
1461
01:55:31,041 --> 01:55:33,839
You do not think it was like that, do you?
1462
01:55:36,146 --> 01:55:38,114
There were executions, yes.
1463
01:55:38,615 --> 01:55:41,209
But nothing like that. Nothing at all.
1464
01:55:47,958 --> 01:55:49,084
Pohl!
1465
01:55:53,897 --> 01:55:58,163
You ran those concentration camps.
You and Eichmann.
1466
01:55:59,303 --> 01:56:01,965
They say we killed millions of people.
1467
01:56:02,906 --> 01:56:04,737
Millions of people.
1468
01:56:04,975 --> 01:56:07,000
How could it be possible?
1469
01:56:07,978 --> 01:56:11,709
Tell them. How could it be possible?
1470
01:56:14,818 --> 01:56:16,308
It's possible.
1471
01:56:17,855 --> 01:56:18,947
How?
1472
01:56:19,890 --> 01:56:21,380
You mean, technically?
1473
01:56:23,827 --> 01:56:26,295
It all depends on your facilities.
1474
01:56:26,764 --> 01:56:30,700
Say you have two chambers
that accommodate 2,000 people apiece.
1475
01:56:31,101 --> 01:56:32,762
Figure it out.
1476
01:56:33,537 --> 01:56:36,768
It's possible to get rid of 10,000
in a half-hour.
1477
01:56:38,175 --> 01:56:40,735
You don't even need guards to do it.
1478
01:56:41,145 --> 01:56:43,978
You can tell them
they are going to take a shower...
1479
01:56:44,048 --> 01:56:47,245
and then instead of the water,
you turn on the gas.
1480
01:56:49,119 --> 01:56:53,522
It's not the killing that is the problem.
It's disposing of the bodies.
1481
01:56:54,591 --> 01:56:56,388
That's the problem.
1482
01:57:47,144 --> 01:57:49,237
- I'm sorry I'm late.
- That's all right.
1483
01:57:49,313 --> 01:57:52,646
I was doing some work
for the rebuilding committee.
1484
01:57:54,618 --> 01:57:59,146
And I brought you some folders,
so we can decide what you should see next.
1485
01:57:59,256 --> 01:58:02,316
There's the Albrecht D�rer house,
and the museum.
1486
01:58:02,993 --> 01:58:04,927
When do you think you could make it?
1487
01:58:04,995 --> 01:58:06,462
Anytime.
1488
01:58:06,663 --> 01:58:08,528
Would you like to order now?
1489
01:58:08,599 --> 01:58:11,295
What would you like?
Can I help you with the menu?
1490
01:58:11,368 --> 01:58:13,996
No. I don't think I'll have anything.
Thank you.
1491
01:58:14,071 --> 01:58:16,403
A glass of Moselle for me, please.
1492
01:58:16,473 --> 01:58:17,735
The same.
1493
01:58:21,044 --> 01:58:22,705
What's the matter?
1494
01:58:23,313 --> 01:58:26,339
Nothing. I'm just not hungry, that's all.
1495
01:58:37,227 --> 01:58:40,355
The last few days
have meant a great deal to me.
1496
01:58:40,697 --> 01:58:41,755
How?
1497
01:58:42,799 --> 01:58:46,860
I don't think you realize
what a provincial man I really am.
1498
01:58:48,505 --> 01:58:52,271
I've been abroad
just exactly once before this...
1499
01:58:52,910 --> 01:58:55,708
and that was when I was a doughboy
in WWI.
1500
01:58:55,779 --> 01:58:59,510
I used to pass places like this
and wonder what they were like.
1501
01:58:59,583 --> 01:59:02,916
- They've meant a great deal to me, too.
- How?
1502
01:59:03,120 --> 01:59:06,419
They gave me back the feeling
I had of the Americans.
1503
01:59:06,557 --> 01:59:10,015
The feeling I used to have
when I was in your country.
1504
01:59:13,997 --> 01:59:17,228
- Too bad this isn't a magazine story.
- Why?
1505
01:59:17,301 --> 01:59:22,204
If it were a magazine story,
two people like us, the rapidly aging jurist...
1506
01:59:23,807 --> 01:59:27,004
The rapidly aging jurist
and the beautiful widow...
1507
01:59:27,077 --> 01:59:31,411
would transcend their difficulties
and travel places...
1508
01:59:31,481 --> 01:59:33,779
either by land or by sea.
1509
01:59:48,632 --> 01:59:50,623
I saw Mr. Perkins today.
1510
01:59:50,867 --> 01:59:54,633
He told me they'd showed those pictures
in the courtroom.
1511
01:59:54,738 --> 01:59:57,229
Col. Lawson's favorite pictures.
1512
01:59:58,375 --> 02:00:01,242
He drags them out at any pretext,
doesn't he?
1513
02:00:01,311 --> 02:00:04,246
Col. Lawson's private chamber of horrors.
1514
02:00:07,684 --> 02:00:09,914
Is that what you think we are?
1515
02:00:10,587 --> 02:00:13,055
Do you think we knew of those things?
1516
02:00:13,123 --> 02:00:16,456
Do you think
we wanted to murder women and children?
1517
02:00:18,395 --> 02:00:20,192
Do you believe that?
1518
02:00:21,064 --> 02:00:22,292
Do you?
1519
02:00:23,667 --> 02:00:26,898
Mrs. Bertholt, I don't know what to believe.
1520
02:00:27,471 --> 02:00:30,133
Good God. We're sitting here drinking.
1521
02:00:31,275 --> 02:00:35,405
How could you think that we knew?
We did not know.
1522
02:00:36,613 --> 02:00:38,240
We did not know.
1523
02:00:40,951 --> 02:00:44,352
As far as I can make out,
no one in this country knew.
1524
02:00:49,259 --> 02:00:51,784
Your husband was one of the heads
of the army.
1525
02:00:51,862 --> 02:00:54,490
And he did not know.
I tell you, he did not know.
1526
02:00:54,564 --> 02:00:56,361
It was Himmler. It was Goebbels.
1527
02:00:56,433 --> 02:00:59,493
The SS knew what happened.
We did not know.
1528
02:01:00,304 --> 02:01:01,828
Listen to me.
1529
02:01:01,972 --> 02:01:04,964
There are things that happened
on both sides.
1530
02:01:05,042 --> 02:01:07,875
My husband was a military man all his life.
1531
02:01:09,046 --> 02:01:12,413
He was entitled to a soldier's death.
He asked for that.
1532
02:01:12,482 --> 02:01:16,782
I tried to get that for him, just that,
that he would die with some honor.
1533
02:01:16,853 --> 02:01:20,448
I went from official to official.
I begged for that.
1534
02:01:21,792 --> 02:01:25,319
That he be permitted the dignity
of a firing squad.
1535
02:01:26,830 --> 02:01:28,764
You know what happened?
1536
02:01:30,233 --> 02:01:32,064
He was hanged with the others...
1537
02:01:32,135 --> 02:01:35,832
and after that, I knew what it was to hate.
1538
02:01:36,673 --> 02:01:40,006
I never left the house, I never left the room.
I drank.
1539
02:01:40,410 --> 02:01:45,006
I hated with every fiber of my being.
I hated every American I had ever known.
1540
02:01:47,184 --> 02:01:50,847
But one can't live with hate, I know that.
1541
02:01:56,827 --> 02:02:00,923
We have to forget, if we are to go on living.
1542
02:02:49,746 --> 02:02:51,111
Herr Rolfe?
1543
02:03:12,269 --> 02:03:14,362
May it please the tribunal?
1544
02:03:20,010 --> 02:03:22,911
Yesterday the tribunal
witnessed some films.
1545
02:03:25,115 --> 02:03:26,548
They were...
1546
02:03:28,051 --> 02:03:29,609
shocking films...
1547
02:03:30,921 --> 02:03:32,513
devastating films.
1548
02:03:34,658 --> 02:03:36,182
As a German...
1549
02:03:38,995 --> 02:03:43,261
I feel ashamed that such things
could have taken place in my country.
1550
02:03:46,336 --> 02:03:49,237
There can never be a justification for them.
1551
02:03:51,241 --> 02:03:53,038
Not in generations...
1552
02:03:54,911 --> 02:03:56,708
not in centuries.
1553
02:04:04,154 --> 02:04:07,715
But I do think it was wrong...
1554
02:04:09,559 --> 02:04:10,958
indecent...
1555
02:04:12,562 --> 02:04:16,362
and terribly unfair of the prosecution...
1556
02:04:17,334 --> 02:04:20,701
to show such films in this case...
1557
02:04:21,071 --> 02:04:22,595
in this court...
1558
02:04:22,973 --> 02:04:24,463
at this time...
1559
02:04:24,574 --> 02:04:26,599
against these defendants!
1560
02:04:27,377 --> 02:04:29,937
And I cannot protest too strongly...
1561
02:04:31,114 --> 02:04:32,979
against such tactics.
1562
02:04:40,290 --> 02:04:43,020
What is the prosecution trying to prove?
1563
02:04:44,427 --> 02:04:47,191
Is it trying to prove
that the German people as a whole...
1564
02:04:47,264 --> 02:04:49,732
were responsible for these events?
1565
02:04:49,933 --> 02:04:52,629
Or that they were even aware of them?
1566
02:04:52,869 --> 02:04:54,666
Because if he is...
1567
02:04:56,806 --> 02:04:58,831
he's not stating facts...
1568
02:05:00,544 --> 02:05:02,876
and he knows he's not.
1569
02:05:05,849 --> 02:05:10,286
The secrecy of the operations,
the geographical location of the camps...
1570
02:05:11,154 --> 02:05:14,749
the breakdown of communications
in the last days of the war...
1571
02:05:14,824 --> 02:05:17,759
when the exterminations
rose into the millions...
1572
02:05:17,827 --> 02:05:21,627
show only too clearly
that he is not telling the truth!
1573
02:05:22,432 --> 02:05:24,024
The truth is...
1574
02:05:24,634 --> 02:05:28,001
that these brutalities were brought about
by the few extremists.
1575
02:05:29,372 --> 02:05:30,896
The criminals.
1576
02:05:33,209 --> 02:05:36,372
Very few Germans knew what was going on.
1577
02:05:36,613 --> 02:05:37,910
Very few.
1578
02:05:39,649 --> 02:05:42,846
None of us knew what was happening...
1579
02:05:43,954 --> 02:05:46,445
in the places shown in these films.
1580
02:05:46,856 --> 02:05:48,255
None of us.
1581
02:05:54,598 --> 02:05:58,398
But the most ironic part of it is...
1582
02:06:00,003 --> 02:06:04,030
that the prosecution showed these films
against these defendants...
1583
02:06:04,507 --> 02:06:09,001
men who stayed in power
for one reason only...
1584
02:06:09,579 --> 02:06:12,275
to prevent worse things from happening.
1585
02:06:14,150 --> 02:06:15,742
Who is the braver man?
1586
02:06:16,886 --> 02:06:20,879
The man who escapes,
or resigns in times of peril...
1587
02:06:21,992 --> 02:06:24,688
or the man who stays on his post...
1588
02:06:24,761 --> 02:06:27,286
at the risk of his own personal safety?
1589
02:06:28,732 --> 02:06:32,862
The defense will present witnesses
and letters and documents...
1590
02:06:33,169 --> 02:06:36,002
from religious and political refugees
all over the world...
1591
02:06:36,072 --> 02:06:39,166
telling how Ernst Janning saved them
from execution.
1592
02:06:39,242 --> 02:06:41,710
The defense will show that many times...
1593
02:06:41,778 --> 02:06:44,941
Ernst Janning was able
to effect mitigation of sentences...
1594
02:06:45,081 --> 02:06:49,347
when, without his influence,
the results would have been much worse.
1595
02:06:50,120 --> 02:06:52,520
The defense will show...
1596
02:06:52,589 --> 02:06:57,049
that Ernst Janning's personal physician
was a non-Aryan...
1597
02:06:58,128 --> 02:06:59,959
a Jewish man...
1598
02:07:01,231 --> 02:07:04,064
who he kept in attendance,
much to his own peril.
1599
02:07:07,671 --> 02:07:09,969
The defense presents affidavits...
1600
02:07:11,107 --> 02:07:14,338
from legal authorities
and famed jurists the world over...
1601
02:07:14,911 --> 02:07:19,075
pleading that special considerations
must be made in this case...
1602
02:07:19,549 --> 02:07:22,017
saying that the entire work
of Ernst Janning...
1603
02:07:22,085 --> 02:07:25,612
was inspired by one motive,
and one motive only:
1604
02:07:25,689 --> 02:07:29,750
The endeavor to preserve justice
and the concept of justice.
1605
02:07:34,998 --> 02:07:35,987
Now...
1606
02:07:37,500 --> 02:07:40,435
what has the prosecution to offer...
1607
02:07:42,205 --> 02:07:43,570
against this?
1608
02:07:44,307 --> 02:07:46,298
The prosecution, in fact...
1609
02:07:47,544 --> 02:07:52,277
has presented in the case of Ernst Janning
only one tangible piece of evidence.
1610
02:07:52,615 --> 02:07:55,880
The Feldenstein case.
A notorious case, as the defense has said.
1611
02:07:55,952 --> 02:07:58,546
A case which never
should have been reopened.
1612
02:07:58,621 --> 02:08:01,556
A case which the defense is obliged...
1613
02:08:02,692 --> 02:08:04,159
to review now.
1614
02:08:05,729 --> 02:08:08,254
The defense calls Mrs. Elsa Lindnow.
1615
02:08:26,583 --> 02:08:28,574
Will you raise your right hand?
1616
02:08:29,018 --> 02:08:31,009
I swear by God,
the Almighty and Omniscient...
1617
02:08:31,087 --> 02:08:34,579
that I will speak the pure truth
and will withhold and add nothing.
1618
02:08:34,657 --> 02:08:35,783
I do.
1619
02:08:39,763 --> 02:08:41,060
Mrs. Lindnow...
1620
02:08:44,567 --> 02:08:46,262
what is your occupation?
1621
02:08:46,803 --> 02:08:48,668
I am a cleaning woman.
1622
02:08:49,539 --> 02:08:51,166
Where are you employed?
1623
02:08:52,542 --> 02:08:57,036
400... 345, Grosse Platz.
1624
02:08:57,680 --> 02:09:00,945
- Did you know Lehman Feldenstein?
- Yes. I knew him.
1625
02:09:01,017 --> 02:09:02,382
In what capacity?
1626
02:09:02,986 --> 02:09:06,422
He was my employer in 1935.
1627
02:09:07,056 --> 02:09:09,616
Do you know the witness,
Mrs. Irene Hoffman Wallner?
1628
02:09:09,692 --> 02:09:12,183
- Yes.
- In what capacity?
1629
02:09:13,396 --> 02:09:15,626
She was a tenant in the building.
1630
02:09:15,865 --> 02:09:19,130
Did you ever see Miss Hoffman
and Mr. Feldenstein together?
1631
02:09:20,236 --> 02:09:21,294
Yes.
1632
02:09:21,938 --> 02:09:23,462
How did this happen?
1633
02:09:23,840 --> 02:09:28,709
Mr. Feldenstein came to see Miss Hoffman
at her apartment.
1634
02:09:29,612 --> 02:09:30,636
Often?
1635
02:09:31,648 --> 02:09:32,808
Quite often.
1636
02:09:33,116 --> 02:09:36,574
Were there any occasions
in which you noticed anything unusual?
1637
02:09:37,020 --> 02:09:38,078
Yes.
1638
02:09:39,189 --> 02:09:41,214
I saw Miss Hoffman...
1639
02:09:41,291 --> 02:09:45,284
kissing Mr. Feldenstein
at the door of her apartment.
1640
02:09:45,862 --> 02:09:47,762
Was there any other occasion?
1641
02:09:48,064 --> 02:09:50,259
Yes, there was one.
1642
02:09:50,767 --> 02:09:52,098
What was it?
1643
02:09:52,402 --> 02:09:54,996
I came to Miss Hoffman's apartment.
1644
02:09:55,071 --> 02:09:57,039
I wanted to clean up.
1645
02:09:57,974 --> 02:09:59,703
I thought it was empty.
1646
02:10:01,311 --> 02:10:03,245
I saw Miss Hoffman...
1647
02:10:03,313 --> 02:10:07,079
sitting on Mr. Feldenstein's lap.
1648
02:10:07,617 --> 02:10:09,778
Thank you, Mrs. Lindnow. That's all.
1649
02:10:12,822 --> 02:10:14,380
Col. Lawson?
1650
02:10:20,430 --> 02:10:22,091
Earphones, please.
1651
02:10:27,804 --> 02:10:30,068
What are your political affiliations?
1652
02:10:32,141 --> 02:10:33,233
Political?
1653
02:10:33,610 --> 02:10:35,510
Objection, Your Honor.
1654
02:10:37,680 --> 02:10:41,639
This witness' political affiliations
have nothing to do with the testimony.
1655
02:10:41,718 --> 02:10:45,677
Col. Lawson is once more trying
to appeal to the emotion of the court.
1656
02:10:46,856 --> 02:10:48,619
Objection overruled.
1657
02:10:48,992 --> 02:10:51,426
Would you answer the question, please?
1658
02:10:51,494 --> 02:10:54,691
Were you a member
of the National Socialist Party?
1659
02:10:55,632 --> 02:10:58,066
Yes, I was.
1660
02:10:59,936 --> 02:11:01,733
We were forced to be.
1661
02:11:02,205 --> 02:11:03,968
"We were forced to be. "
1662
02:11:05,375 --> 02:11:08,674
When did you become a member
of the Nazi Party?
1663
02:11:10,513 --> 02:11:13,641
1933.
1664
02:11:13,983 --> 02:11:17,578
Were all German nationals forced
to become members of the Nazi Party...
1665
02:11:17,654 --> 02:11:19,246
in 1933?
1666
02:11:21,991 --> 02:11:24,016
Please answer me, Mrs. Lindnow.
1667
02:11:24,527 --> 02:11:27,826
Were you forced to become a member
of the Nazi Party?
1668
02:11:32,235 --> 02:11:33,429
That's all.
1669
02:11:35,371 --> 02:11:36,838
Witness is excused.
1670
02:11:53,423 --> 02:11:55,220
Defense may continue.
1671
02:12:03,199 --> 02:12:07,260
The defense calls Irene Hoffman Wallner
to the stand.
1672
02:12:23,586 --> 02:12:25,053
Mrs. Wallner...
1673
02:12:28,257 --> 02:12:30,088
you are still under oath.
1674
02:12:33,563 --> 02:12:35,690
Did you come here voluntarily?
1675
02:12:35,765 --> 02:12:38,563
Did you report voluntarily
to speak as a witness?
1676
02:12:39,102 --> 02:12:40,126
Yes.
1677
02:12:42,271 --> 02:12:45,968
Is it not true that the prosecution
asked you to come here?
1678
02:12:46,442 --> 02:12:49,275
That it was very disagreeable for you
to come here?
1679
02:12:50,179 --> 02:12:54,240
It is always very disagreeable
to live over those times.
1680
02:12:55,952 --> 02:12:57,681
That would be in agreement...
1681
02:12:57,754 --> 02:13:00,484
with the information I have
that you did not want to come.
1682
02:13:00,556 --> 02:13:02,251
Thank you, Mrs. Wallner.
1683
02:13:07,530 --> 02:13:11,933
The Nuremberg Laws
were stated September 15, 1935.
1684
02:13:12,602 --> 02:13:14,263
Where were you at that time?
1685
02:13:14,337 --> 02:13:15,463
In Nuremberg.
1686
02:13:15,538 --> 02:13:17,062
Did you know these laws?
1687
02:13:17,140 --> 02:13:20,439
Were you aware
that a physical relationship with Jews...
1688
02:13:20,510 --> 02:13:22,705
was against the law?
1689
02:13:23,146 --> 02:13:24,170
Yes.
1690
02:13:24,247 --> 02:13:28,343
Were you aware that in Nuremberg,
and in Nuremberg in particular...
1691
02:13:29,152 --> 02:13:32,485
not only a physical relationship
with Jews was viewed with disdain...
1692
02:13:32,555 --> 02:13:34,079
but every social contact?
1693
02:13:34,157 --> 02:13:35,181
Yes.
1694
02:13:35,925 --> 02:13:39,588
Were you aware it might have some danger
for you personally?
1695
02:13:40,029 --> 02:13:41,792
Yes, I was aware of it.
1696
02:13:42,331 --> 02:13:46,427
But how can you discard a friendship
from day to day because of some...
1697
02:13:46,502 --> 02:13:49,437
That is another question, Mrs. Wallner.
1698
02:13:50,640 --> 02:13:52,505
I did not ask you that question.
1699
02:13:52,575 --> 02:13:54,372
Were you aware of it?
1700
02:13:54,777 --> 02:13:56,404
Yes, I was aware.
1701
02:13:56,579 --> 02:13:58,809
Yet you still continued to see each other?
1702
02:13:58,881 --> 02:13:59,870
Yes.
1703
02:14:02,118 --> 02:14:05,986
Remember, it was disclosed at the tribunal
that Mr. Feldenstein bought you things.
1704
02:14:06,055 --> 02:14:07,682
Candy and cigarettes?
1705
02:14:07,757 --> 02:14:08,781
Yes.
1706
02:14:08,858 --> 02:14:11,486
Remember that sometimes
he bought you flowers?
1707
02:14:12,128 --> 02:14:14,358
Yes, he bought me many things.
1708
02:14:15,264 --> 02:14:17,323
That was because he was kind.
1709
02:14:18,334 --> 02:14:21,428
He was the kindest man I ever knew.
1710
02:14:24,307 --> 02:14:26,935
Do you know the witness,
Mrs. Elsa Lindnow?
1711
02:14:27,276 --> 02:14:28,766
Yes, I know her.
1712
02:14:28,845 --> 02:14:31,541
Was she a cleaning woman
at the apartment you lived in?
1713
02:14:32,181 --> 02:14:35,344
Did Mr. Feldenstein
come to see you at your apartment?
1714
02:14:35,418 --> 02:14:37,147
- Yes.
- How many times?
1715
02:14:39,622 --> 02:14:42,455
I don't remember.
1716
02:14:42,692 --> 02:14:44,023
Several times?
1717
02:14:44,260 --> 02:14:45,352
Yes.
1718
02:14:45,428 --> 02:14:46,918
Many times?
1719
02:14:46,996 --> 02:14:48,054
Many times.
1720
02:14:48,131 --> 02:14:49,393
Did you kiss him?
1721
02:14:49,465 --> 02:14:50,989
Yes, I kissed him.
1722
02:14:51,067 --> 02:14:53,160
Was there more than one kiss?
1723
02:14:54,170 --> 02:14:55,194
Yes.
1724
02:14:56,806 --> 02:15:00,037
But it was not in the way
you are trying to make it sound.
1725
02:15:01,811 --> 02:15:04,575
He was like a father to me.
1726
02:15:05,515 --> 02:15:08,484
- He was more than a father.
- More than a father?
1727
02:15:08,951 --> 02:15:11,112
- Did you sit on his lap?
- Objection!
1728
02:15:11,521 --> 02:15:15,457
Counsel is persecuting the witness
in the pretext of gaining testimony.
1729
02:15:16,726 --> 02:15:18,057
Objection overruled.
1730
02:15:18,127 --> 02:15:20,391
The defense is being permitted to reenact...
1731
02:15:20,463 --> 02:15:23,296
what was a travesty of justice
in the first place.
1732
02:15:25,434 --> 02:15:28,835
The tribunal makes the rulings in this case,
not the prosecution.
1733
02:15:28,905 --> 02:15:30,167
You may proceed.
1734
02:15:30,239 --> 02:15:32,036
Did you sit on his lap?
1735
02:15:32,508 --> 02:15:33,497
Yes.
1736
02:15:34,143 --> 02:15:38,705
But there was nothing wrong
or ugly about it.
1737
02:15:38,781 --> 02:15:41,773
Did you sit on his lap?
1738
02:15:41,851 --> 02:15:43,182
Yes, but...
1739
02:15:43,252 --> 02:15:46,016
You sat on his lap. What else did you do?
1740
02:15:47,790 --> 02:15:50,384
There was nothing
that you are trying to say.
1741
02:15:50,459 --> 02:15:51,949
There was nothing like that.
1742
02:15:52,028 --> 02:15:54,155
What else did you do, Mrs. Wallner?
1743
02:15:55,631 --> 02:15:58,293
What are you trying to do?
1744
02:15:59,402 --> 02:16:01,336
Are you trying to...
1745
02:16:03,839 --> 02:16:08,242
Why do you not let me speak the truth?
1746
02:16:08,311 --> 02:16:11,712
That's what we want, Mrs. Wallner.
The truth.
1747
02:16:12,381 --> 02:16:14,747
You admitted that you continued to see him.
1748
02:16:14,817 --> 02:16:17,081
You admitted that he came
to your apartment.
1749
02:16:17,153 --> 02:16:20,748
You admitted you kissed him.
You admitted you sat on his lap.
1750
02:16:20,823 --> 02:16:23,314
What else do you admit to? What else?
1751
02:16:23,392 --> 02:16:24,689
Nothing.
1752
02:16:26,128 --> 02:16:28,596
There was nothing
like you're trying to make it sound.
1753
02:16:28,664 --> 02:16:32,725
- What else?
- There was nothing.
1754
02:16:33,769 --> 02:16:34,929
Stop it.
1755
02:16:37,139 --> 02:16:39,300
What else do you admit to?
1756
02:16:39,375 --> 02:16:40,637
Herr Rolfe!
1757
02:16:45,748 --> 02:16:47,978
Are we going to do this again?
1758
02:16:53,356 --> 02:16:54,755
Your Honor...
1759
02:16:56,058 --> 02:16:59,550
the stress the defendant has been under
is so great that he is not aware...
1760
02:16:59,629 --> 02:17:01,028
I am aware.
1761
02:17:03,566 --> 02:17:05,966
Your Honor, the defendant
wishes to make a statement.
1762
02:17:06,035 --> 02:17:08,094
I believe the defense has a right to request...
1763
02:17:08,170 --> 02:17:10,297
Order.
1764
02:17:15,044 --> 02:17:17,569
Does the defendant
wish to make a statement?
1765
02:17:18,147 --> 02:17:21,605
I wish to make a statement, yes.
1766
02:17:22,652 --> 02:17:25,712
I believe the defense has the right
to request a recess...
1767
02:17:25,788 --> 02:17:28,256
The defendant has the right
to make his statement now.
1768
02:17:28,324 --> 02:17:32,420
- I have to speak with my client.
- He has the right to make it now!
1769
02:17:43,572 --> 02:17:46,598
Tribunal is adjourned
until 10:30 tomorrow morning.
1770
02:17:51,447 --> 02:17:53,108
What are you doing?
1771
02:17:54,216 --> 02:17:56,514
What do you think you're trying to do?
1772
02:17:57,553 --> 02:18:00,454
They've had Goering. Frank. Streicher.
1773
02:18:01,223 --> 02:18:02,554
That's over.
1774
02:18:03,292 --> 02:18:06,887
Do you think I have enjoyed
being defense counsel during this trial?
1775
02:18:08,030 --> 02:18:11,693
There were things I had to do
in that courtroom that made me cringe.
1776
02:18:12,201 --> 02:18:13,725
Why did I do them?
1777
02:18:14,270 --> 02:18:17,296
Because I want
to leave the German people something.
1778
02:18:17,373 --> 02:18:19,773
I want to leave them a shred of dignity.
1779
02:18:19,842 --> 02:18:22,675
I want to call a halt to these proceedings.
1780
02:18:22,745 --> 02:18:25,942
If we allow them
to discredit every German like you...
1781
02:18:26,015 --> 02:18:28,813
we lose the right to rule ourselves forever.
1782
02:18:30,319 --> 02:18:33,482
We have to look at the future.
We can't look back now.
1783
02:18:34,123 --> 02:18:37,149
Do you want the Americans
to stay here forever? Do you want that?
1784
02:18:37,226 --> 02:18:40,195
I could show you a picture
of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
1785
02:18:40,996 --> 02:18:43,590
Thousands and thousands
of burned bodies.
1786
02:18:43,666 --> 02:18:45,429
Women and children.
1787
02:18:46,769 --> 02:18:49,033
Is that their superior morality?
1788
02:18:49,772 --> 02:18:52,332
Where do you think they take us?
Do you think they know?
1789
02:18:52,408 --> 02:18:55,275
Do you think they have any concept
of our problems?
1790
02:19:01,117 --> 02:19:02,744
What can I say to you?
1791
02:19:04,587 --> 02:19:07,556
What can I say to you to make you see?
1792
02:19:14,296 --> 02:19:17,322
There is nothing you can say.
1793
02:19:19,235 --> 02:19:20,224
Nothing.
1794
02:19:20,503 --> 02:19:23,063
Nothing has happened to alleviate the crisis.
1795
02:19:23,439 --> 02:19:25,430
The crisis reached a head this afternoon...
1796
02:19:25,508 --> 02:19:29,444
when all rail travel between
Western zones and Berlin was stopped.
1797
02:19:29,512 --> 02:19:32,106
The blockade by land is now complete.
1798
02:19:39,288 --> 02:19:41,256
What do you think
we're going to do, General?
1799
02:19:41,323 --> 02:19:43,086
Do you think we'll withdraw?
1800
02:19:43,159 --> 02:19:44,524
We can't withdraw.
1801
02:19:44,794 --> 02:19:48,457
If we withdraw under pressure,
our prestige all over the world is threatened.
1802
02:19:48,531 --> 02:19:50,897
The Communists will move in
on every front.
1803
02:19:50,966 --> 02:19:54,561
What about these trials, General?
How do you feel about them now?
1804
02:19:56,439 --> 02:19:58,805
We're committed to the trials.
1805
02:19:58,874 --> 02:20:02,833
But I think it would be realistic
to accelerate them as much as possible.
1806
02:20:03,245 --> 02:20:06,146
What would happen
if they fired on one of our planes?
1807
02:20:06,215 --> 02:20:08,479
I'm afraid we'll have to face that
when it happens.
1808
02:20:08,551 --> 02:20:11,611
There is no other answer
to that question at this time.
1809
02:20:14,223 --> 02:20:17,215
You fellows should try
some of the strudel. It's excellent here.
1810
02:20:17,293 --> 02:20:18,658
No, thanks.
1811
02:20:19,695 --> 02:20:23,324
Dan, I've just come back from Berlin,
as you know.
1812
02:20:23,999 --> 02:20:28,095
I don't think this is going to be it.
A lot of people do, but I don't.
1813
02:20:28,504 --> 02:20:30,870
But it is going to be a fight for survival...
1814
02:20:30,940 --> 02:20:33,875
for the next 10 years, maybe the next 20.
1815
02:20:34,710 --> 02:20:36,644
Germany is the key to that survival.
1816
02:20:36,712 --> 02:20:39,840
Any high-school student in Geography
can tell you that.
1817
02:20:41,817 --> 02:20:44,285
Just what are you trying to say, Senator?
1818
02:20:44,653 --> 02:20:46,917
What I'm trying to say is this:
1819
02:20:46,989 --> 02:20:50,618
While nobody's trying
to influence your decision...
1820
02:20:50,693 --> 02:20:54,595
it's important that you realize this,
because it's a fact of life.
1821
02:20:55,064 --> 02:20:58,625
Let's face it, gentlemen.
The handwriting is on the wall.
1822
02:20:59,468 --> 02:21:02,028
We're going to need all the help we can get.
1823
02:21:02,104 --> 02:21:05,403
We're going to need the support
of the German people.
1824
02:21:06,942 --> 02:21:08,933
More strudel, gentlemen?
1825
02:21:12,748 --> 02:21:14,978
Herr Janning, you may proceed.
1826
02:21:20,923 --> 02:21:24,984
I wish to testify
about the Feldenstein case...
1827
02:21:26,028 --> 02:21:29,327
because it was the most significant trial
of the period.
1828
02:21:31,300 --> 02:21:35,293
It is important not only for the tribunal
to understand it...
1829
02:21:36,772 --> 02:21:38,865
but for the whole German people.
1830
02:21:40,175 --> 02:21:42,905
But in order to understand it...
1831
02:21:42,978 --> 02:21:46,311
one must understand the period
in which it happened.
1832
02:21:48,684 --> 02:21:51,517
There was a fever over the land.
1833
02:21:51,587 --> 02:21:55,990
A fever of disgrace, of indignity, of hunger.
1834
02:21:57,293 --> 02:21:59,261
We had a democracy, yes.
1835
02:22:00,095 --> 02:22:02,529
But it was torn by elements within.
1836
02:22:03,566 --> 02:22:06,592
Above all, there was fear:
1837
02:22:07,436 --> 02:22:10,405
Fear of today, fear of tomorrow...
1838
02:22:11,307 --> 02:22:13,275
fear of our neighbors...
1839
02:22:13,342 --> 02:22:16,209
and fear of ourselves.
1840
02:22:17,713 --> 02:22:20,079
Only when you understand that...
1841
02:22:20,149 --> 02:22:23,346
can you understand what Hitler meant to us.
1842
02:22:23,786 --> 02:22:25,720
Because he said to us:
1843
02:22:27,189 --> 02:22:28,918
"Lift your heads.
1844
02:22:28,991 --> 02:22:30,891
"Be proud to be German.
1845
02:22:31,560 --> 02:22:33,255
"There are devils among us:
1846
02:22:33,329 --> 02:22:36,662
"Communists, liberals, Jews, Gypsies.
1847
02:22:36,732 --> 02:22:40,828
"Once these devils will be destroyed,
your misery will be destroyed. "
1848
02:22:43,105 --> 02:22:48,099
It was the old story of the sacrificial lamb.
1849
02:22:52,214 --> 02:22:54,910
What about those of us who knew better?
1850
02:22:55,084 --> 02:22:58,417
We who knew the words were lies,
and worse than lies?
1851
02:22:59,154 --> 02:23:02,646
Why did we sit silent?
Why did we take part?
1852
02:23:04,860 --> 02:23:07,055
Because we loved our country.
1853
02:23:08,430 --> 02:23:10,022
What difference does it make...
1854
02:23:10,099 --> 02:23:13,262
if a few political extremists
lose their rights?
1855
02:23:13,736 --> 02:23:17,797
What difference does it make
if a few racial minorities lose their rights?
1856
02:23:18,440 --> 02:23:20,670
It is only a passing phase.
1857
02:23:20,743 --> 02:23:23,211
It is only a stage we are going through.
1858
02:23:23,278 --> 02:23:25,678
It will be discarded sooner or later.
1859
02:23:25,748 --> 02:23:29,514
Hitler himself
will be discarded sooner or later.
1860
02:23:30,019 --> 02:23:31,714
The country is in danger.
1861
02:23:31,787 --> 02:23:34,779
We will march out of the shadows.
We will go forward.
1862
02:23:34,857 --> 02:23:37,087
Forward is the great password.
1863
02:23:41,063 --> 02:23:45,693
And history tells
how well we succeeded, Your Honor.
1864
02:23:47,136 --> 02:23:49,832
We succeeded beyond our wildest dreams.
1865
02:23:50,673 --> 02:23:54,074
The very elements of hate and power
about Hitler...
1866
02:23:54,143 --> 02:23:57,544
that mesmerized Germany
mesmerized the world.
1867
02:23:58,580 --> 02:24:01,640
We found ourselves
with sudden, powerful allies.
1868
02:24:02,151 --> 02:24:05,416
Things that had been denied to us
as a democracy...
1869
02:24:05,487 --> 02:24:07,284
were open to us now.
1870
02:24:07,790 --> 02:24:10,418
The world said, "Go ahead, take it.
1871
02:24:11,026 --> 02:24:12,288
"Take it.
1872
02:24:12,561 --> 02:24:16,429
"Take Sudetenland, take the Rhineland,
remilitarize it.
1873
02:24:16,498 --> 02:24:18,693
"Take all of Austria. Take it. "
1874
02:24:22,204 --> 02:24:26,004
And then, one day, we looked around...
1875
02:24:26,075 --> 02:24:29,533
and found that we were
in an even more terrible danger.
1876
02:24:29,778 --> 02:24:32,246
The ritual began in this courtroom...
1877
02:24:32,314 --> 02:24:35,579
swept over the land like a raging,
roaring disease.
1878
02:24:37,152 --> 02:24:40,315
What was going to be a passing phase...
1879
02:24:42,391 --> 02:24:44,518
had become the way of life.
1880
02:24:49,998 --> 02:24:51,329
Your Honor...
1881
02:24:53,602 --> 02:24:58,164
I was content to sit silent during this trial.
1882
02:24:59,942 --> 02:25:03,571
I was content to tend my roses.
1883
02:25:05,414 --> 02:25:07,109
I was even content...
1884
02:25:08,417 --> 02:25:10,942
to let counsel try to save my name.
1885
02:25:12,788 --> 02:25:14,551
Until I realized...
1886
02:25:15,758 --> 02:25:20,593
that in order to save it,
he would have to raise the specter again.
1887
02:25:24,099 --> 02:25:28,559
You have seen him do it.
He has done it here in this courtroom.
1888
02:25:29,404 --> 02:25:33,738
He has suggested that the Third Reich
worked for the benefit of people.
1889
02:25:34,309 --> 02:25:39,246
He has suggested that we sterilized men
for the welfare of the country.
1890
02:25:39,948 --> 02:25:41,506
He has suggested that perhaps...
1891
02:25:41,583 --> 02:25:45,451
the old Jew did sleep
with the 16-year-old girl, after all.
1892
02:25:47,089 --> 02:25:50,525
Once more, it is being done...
1893
02:25:51,927 --> 02:25:54,122
for love of country.
1894
02:25:56,765 --> 02:26:00,633
It is not easy to tell the truth.
1895
02:26:02,538 --> 02:26:05,405
But if there is to be any salvation
for Germany...
1896
02:26:06,775 --> 02:26:10,404
we who know our guilt must admit it...
1897
02:26:10,712 --> 02:26:12,509
whatever the pain...
1898
02:26:14,449 --> 02:26:16,076
and humiliation.
1899
02:26:21,390 --> 02:26:23,517
I had reached my verdict...
1900
02:26:24,526 --> 02:26:26,255
on the Feldenstein case...
1901
02:26:27,095 --> 02:26:29,859
before I ever came into the courtroom.
1902
02:26:29,932 --> 02:26:32,457
I would have found him guilty,
whatever the evidence.
1903
02:26:32,534 --> 02:26:36,368
It was not a trial at all.
It was a sacrificial ritual...
1904
02:26:36,438 --> 02:26:39,566
in which Feldenstein, the Jew,
was the helpless victim.
1905
02:26:39,641 --> 02:26:41,871
Your Honor, I must interrupt.
1906
02:26:42,110 --> 02:26:44,340
The defendant is not aware
of what he is saying.
1907
02:26:44,413 --> 02:26:46,347
He is not aware of the implications...
1908
02:26:46,415 --> 02:26:49,077
I am aware.
1909
02:26:50,953 --> 02:26:53,513
My counsel would have you believe...
1910
02:26:53,589 --> 02:26:56,353
we were not aware
of the concentration camps.
1911
02:26:57,693 --> 02:26:59,058
Not aware.
1912
02:27:00,596 --> 02:27:01,893
Where were we?
1913
02:27:02,464 --> 02:27:06,093
Where were we when Hitler began shrieking
his hate in the Reichstag?
1914
02:27:06,168 --> 02:27:08,830
Where were we when our neighbors
were being dragged out...
1915
02:27:08,904 --> 02:27:10,872
in the middle of the night to Dachau?
1916
02:27:10,939 --> 02:27:14,306
Where were we when every village
in Germany has a railroad terminal...
1917
02:27:14,376 --> 02:27:17,072
where cattle cars were filled with children...
1918
02:27:17,145 --> 02:27:19,978
being carried off to their extermination?
1919
02:27:20,048 --> 02:27:22,983
Where were we
when they cried out in the night to us?
1920
02:27:23,051 --> 02:27:26,578
Were we deaf? Dumb? Blind?
1921
02:27:26,788 --> 02:27:28,756
Your Honor, I must protest.
1922
02:27:28,891 --> 02:27:33,453
My counsel says we were not aware
of the extermination of the millions.
1923
02:27:34,396 --> 02:27:36,864
He would give you the excuse...
1924
02:27:36,932 --> 02:27:41,130
we were only aware
of the extermination of the hundreds.
1925
02:27:42,537 --> 02:27:45,506
Does that make us any the less guilty?
1926
02:27:47,142 --> 02:27:49,235
Maybe we didn't know the details.
1927
02:27:49,878 --> 02:27:54,542
But if we didn't know,
it was because we didn't want to know.
1928
02:27:54,616 --> 02:27:56,550
Traitor!
1929
02:27:56,618 --> 02:27:57,676
Order!
1930
02:28:01,323 --> 02:28:04,520
Put that man back in his seat
and keep him there.
1931
02:28:08,797 --> 02:28:10,992
I am going to tell them the truth.
1932
02:28:12,401 --> 02:28:16,997
I am going to tell them the truth,
if the whole world conspires against it.
1933
02:28:18,073 --> 02:28:22,976
I am going to tell them the truth
about their Ministry of Justice.
1934
02:28:25,380 --> 02:28:29,214
Werner Lammpe,
an old man who cries into his Bible now.
1935
02:28:31,086 --> 02:28:33,987
An old man who profited
by the property expropriation...
1936
02:28:34,056 --> 02:28:36,854
of every man
he sent to a concentration camp.
1937
02:28:37,926 --> 02:28:39,951
Friedrich Hoffstetter...
1938
02:28:40,228 --> 02:28:43,061
the good German
who knew how to take orders...
1939
02:28:43,565 --> 02:28:47,729
who sent men before him
to be sterilized like so many digits.
1940
02:28:50,739 --> 02:28:52,036
Emil Hahn...
1941
02:28:53,542 --> 02:28:56,067
the decayed, corrupt bigot...
1942
02:28:56,645 --> 02:28:59,170
obsessed by the evil within himself.
1943
02:29:04,886 --> 02:29:06,581
And Ernst Janning...
1944
02:29:08,890 --> 02:29:10,653
worse than any of them...
1945
02:29:12,194 --> 02:29:14,287
because he knew what they were...
1946
02:29:15,297 --> 02:29:17,424
and he went along with them.
1947
02:29:20,602 --> 02:29:21,967
Ernst Janning...
1948
02:29:23,572 --> 02:29:25,199
who made his life...
1949
02:29:27,275 --> 02:29:28,606
excrement...
1950
02:29:31,113 --> 02:29:33,104
because he walked with them.
1951
02:30:59,968 --> 02:31:01,128
Your Honor...
1952
02:31:03,205 --> 02:31:04,832
it is my duty...
1953
02:31:06,608 --> 02:31:08,599
to defend Ernst Janning.
1954
02:31:09,244 --> 02:31:12,213
And yet, Ernst Janning has said he is guilty.
1955
02:31:13,415 --> 02:31:17,545
There is no doubt he feels his guilt.
1956
02:31:19,454 --> 02:31:23,185
He made a great error
in going along with the Nazi movement...
1957
02:31:24,693 --> 02:31:27,093
hoping it would be good for his country.
1958
02:31:29,865 --> 02:31:32,299
But if he is to be found guilty...
1959
02:31:33,135 --> 02:31:37,128
there are others who also went along...
1960
02:31:38,240 --> 02:31:40,674
who also must be found guilty.
1961
02:31:42,744 --> 02:31:44,974
Ernst Janning said:
1962
02:31:45,046 --> 02:31:48,072
"We succeeded beyond our wildest dreams. "
1963
02:31:50,085 --> 02:31:53,714
Why did we succeed, Your Honor?
1964
02:31:55,357 --> 02:31:57,518
What about the rest of the world?
1965
02:31:59,761 --> 02:32:02,628
Did it not know the intentions
of the Third Reich?
1966
02:32:04,032 --> 02:32:07,695
Did it not hear the words
of Hitler's broadcasts all over the world?
1967
02:32:08,904 --> 02:32:11,372
Did it not read his intentions
in Mein Kampf...
1968
02:32:11,439 --> 02:32:13,805
published in every corner of the world?
1969
02:32:15,410 --> 02:32:18,777
Where is the responsibility
of the Soviet Union...
1970
02:32:18,847 --> 02:32:22,874
who signed in 1939 the pact with Hitler...
1971
02:32:22,951 --> 02:32:24,919
enabled him to make war?
1972
02:32:26,221 --> 02:32:28,451
Are we now to find Russia guilty?
1973
02:32:30,192 --> 02:32:33,628
Where is the responsibility of the Vatican...
1974
02:32:33,695 --> 02:32:37,222
who signed in 1933 the concordat
with Hitler...
1975
02:32:37,299 --> 02:32:40,132
giving him his first tremendous prestige?
1976
02:32:41,670 --> 02:32:44,332
Are we now to find the Vatican guilty?
1977
02:32:46,241 --> 02:32:49,540
Where is the responsibility
of the world leader Winston Churchill...
1978
02:32:49,611 --> 02:32:53,445
who said in an open letter
to the London Times in 1938:
1979
02:32:58,420 --> 02:33:01,685
"Were England to suffer a national disaster,
I should pray to God...
1980
02:33:01,756 --> 02:33:05,556
"to send a man of the strength of mind
and will of an Adolf Hitler. "
1981
02:33:06,228 --> 02:33:09,026
Are we now
to find Winston Churchill guilty?
1982
02:33:09,731 --> 02:33:13,189
Where is the responsibility
of those American industrialists...
1983
02:33:13,268 --> 02:33:18,001
who helped Hitler to rebuild his armaments,
and profited by that rebuilding?
1984
02:33:19,608 --> 02:33:22,270
Are we now to find
the American industrialists guilty?
1985
02:33:22,344 --> 02:33:24,812
No, Your Honor.
1986
02:33:26,414 --> 02:33:28,348
Germany alone is not guilty.
1987
02:33:28,416 --> 02:33:32,045
The whole world is as responsible for Hitler
as Germany.
1988
02:33:32,120 --> 02:33:34,918
It is an easy thing
to condemn one man in the dock.
1989
02:33:34,990 --> 02:33:36,890
It's easy to condemn the German people...
1990
02:33:36,958 --> 02:33:39,449
to speak of the basic flaw
in the German character...
1991
02:33:39,527 --> 02:33:42,155
that allowed Hitler to rise to power,
but also...
1992
02:33:42,230 --> 02:33:44,858
comfortably ignore
the basic flaw of character...
1993
02:33:44,933 --> 02:33:48,528
that made the Russians sign pacts with him,
Winston Churchill praise him...
1994
02:33:48,603 --> 02:33:51,333
American industrialists profit by him.
1995
02:33:55,043 --> 02:33:58,604
Ernst Janning said he is guilty.
1996
02:34:00,482 --> 02:34:01,915
If he is...
1997
02:34:02,684 --> 02:34:06,518
Ernst Janning's guilt is the world's guilt.
1998
02:34:08,490 --> 02:34:11,550
No more, no less.
1999
02:34:25,206 --> 02:34:29,870
Major, we have to give the military governor
every help that we can give him.
2000
02:34:30,612 --> 02:34:33,945
We have to get 700 tons in the air a day.
2001
02:34:41,656 --> 02:34:43,647
This is some operation.
2002
02:34:45,994 --> 02:34:50,158
Did you ever think we'd be flying coal
and tomatoes in these crates?
2003
02:34:54,169 --> 02:34:57,195
Tad, you and I have been friends
a long time.
2004
02:34:57,706 --> 02:34:59,936
That's why I called you here.
2005
02:35:03,244 --> 02:35:06,077
What are you going to do
in court tomorrow?
2006
02:35:09,284 --> 02:35:11,980
You know damn well what I'm going to do.
2007
02:35:12,320 --> 02:35:13,810
I know what you want to do:
2008
02:35:13,888 --> 02:35:17,688
Recommend they put them behind bars
and throw away the key.
2009
02:35:17,759 --> 02:35:20,193
You know what's going on here now?
2010
02:35:21,830 --> 02:35:22,956
Yeah.
2011
02:35:24,199 --> 02:35:25,928
I know what's going on.
2012
02:35:26,000 --> 02:35:27,467
Tad, you're an army man.
2013
02:35:27,535 --> 02:35:30,470
You know what we're up against.
The others may not, but you do.
2014
02:35:30,538 --> 02:35:32,233
I'll tell you the truth.
2015
02:35:32,474 --> 02:35:36,911
I don't know what's going to happen
if they fire on one of those planes.
2016
02:35:37,278 --> 02:35:39,542
I don't know what's going to happen.
2017
02:35:39,981 --> 02:35:43,974
But if I do know this:
If Berlin goes, Germany goes.
2018
02:35:44,719 --> 02:35:47,654
If Germany goes, Europe goes.
2019
02:35:48,823 --> 02:35:50,882
That's the way things stand.
2020
02:35:52,494 --> 02:35:53,518
That's the way they stand.
2021
02:35:53,595 --> 02:35:56,860
Look, Matt, I'm going to go the limit.
2022
02:35:57,132 --> 02:36:00,659
And not you, not the Pentagon,
not God on His throne is going to make me...
2023
02:36:00,735 --> 02:36:02,896
Who do you think you're talking to?
2024
02:36:05,106 --> 02:36:07,574
Who the hell do you think you're talking to?
2025
02:36:07,642 --> 02:36:11,043
When you were marching into Dachau
with those troops, I was there, too.
2026
02:36:11,112 --> 02:36:13,046
You think I'll ever forget it?
2027
02:36:14,783 --> 02:36:16,648
Look, I'm not your commanding officer.
2028
02:36:16,718 --> 02:36:19,152
I can't influence your decision,
and I don't want to.
2029
02:36:19,220 --> 02:36:23,020
But I want to give this to you,
and I want to give it to you straight.
2030
02:36:23,758 --> 02:36:26,352
We need the help of the German people.
2031
02:36:28,763 --> 02:36:30,958
And you don't get the help
of the German people...
2032
02:36:31,032 --> 02:36:34,524
by sentencing their leaders
to stiff prison sentences.
2033
02:36:48,249 --> 02:36:50,911
The thing to do is survive, isn't it?
2034
02:36:51,586 --> 02:36:55,454
Survive as best we can, but survive.
2035
02:37:05,467 --> 02:37:07,367
Just for laughs, Matt...
2036
02:37:08,736 --> 02:37:10,863
what was the war all about?
2037
02:37:12,874 --> 02:37:14,364
What was it about?
2038
02:37:21,082 --> 02:37:25,348
And that concludes
presentation of documentary evidence...
2039
02:37:25,420 --> 02:37:27,479
against these defendants.
2040
02:37:36,598 --> 02:37:37,860
Your Honors...
2041
02:37:39,734 --> 02:37:44,068
during the three years that have passed
since the end of the war in Europe...
2042
02:37:44,806 --> 02:37:48,003
mankind has not crossed over into Jordan.
2043
02:37:49,978 --> 02:37:53,072
In our own country,
fear of war has been revived.
2044
02:37:53,781 --> 02:37:57,512
And we must look once more
to our defenses.
2045
02:37:58,353 --> 02:38:02,346
There's talk of Cold War,
while men and women die in real wars.
2046
02:38:04,292 --> 02:38:06,783
And the echoes of persecution...
2047
02:38:07,729 --> 02:38:09,219
and atrocities...
2048
02:38:10,698 --> 02:38:12,427
will not be stilled.
2049
02:38:14,969 --> 02:38:18,769
These events cannot help
but color what happens in this courtroom.
2050
02:38:21,509 --> 02:38:24,672
But somewhere
in the midst of these events...
2051
02:38:26,147 --> 02:38:30,709
the responsibility for the crimes
that we brought forward during this trial...
2052
02:38:32,954 --> 02:38:36,481
must be placed in true perspective.
2053
02:38:37,725 --> 02:38:41,491
And this is the decision
that faces Your Honors.
2054
02:38:43,865 --> 02:38:46,060
It is the dilemma of our times.
2055
02:38:49,003 --> 02:38:50,698
It is a dilemma...
2056
02:38:53,741 --> 02:38:55,470
that rests with you.
2057
02:39:01,549 --> 02:39:03,414
The prosecution rests.
2058
02:39:25,139 --> 02:39:28,302
The defendants
may now make their final statements.
2059
02:39:33,615 --> 02:39:36,584
Defendant Emil Hahn
may address the tribunal.
2060
02:39:42,657 --> 02:39:43,817
Your Honors...
2061
02:39:44,692 --> 02:39:47,923
I do not evade the responsibility
for my actions.
2062
02:39:48,830 --> 02:39:50,457
On the contrary...
2063
02:39:50,531 --> 02:39:53,125
I stand by them before the entire world.
2064
02:39:54,502 --> 02:39:57,699
But I will not follow the policy of others.
2065
02:39:59,040 --> 02:40:01,531
I will not say of our policy today
that it was wrong...
2066
02:40:01,609 --> 02:40:03,839
when yesterday I say it was right.
2067
02:40:05,246 --> 02:40:07,407
Germany was fighting for its life.
2068
02:40:08,082 --> 02:40:11,074
Certain measures were needed
to protect it from its enemies.
2069
02:40:11,152 --> 02:40:14,883
I cannot say that I am sorry
we applied those measures.
2070
02:40:14,956 --> 02:40:17,117
We were a bulwark against Bolshevism.
2071
02:40:18,092 --> 02:40:20,287
We were a pillar of Western culture.
2072
02:40:22,163 --> 02:40:25,394
A bulwark and a pillar
the West may yet wish to retain.
2073
02:40:30,972 --> 02:40:34,772
The defendant Friedrich Hoffstetter
may address the tribunal.
2074
02:40:42,850 --> 02:40:45,580
I have served my country
throughout my life...
2075
02:40:46,821 --> 02:40:49,415
and in whatever position
I was assigned to...
2076
02:40:49,490 --> 02:40:53,017
in faithfulness,
with a pure heart, and without malice.
2077
02:40:55,163 --> 02:40:59,657
I followed the concept that I believed
to be the highest in my profession.
2078
02:41:00,601 --> 02:41:02,466
The concept that says:
2079
02:41:02,870 --> 02:41:05,703
"To sacrifice one's own sense of justice...
2080
02:41:05,773 --> 02:41:08,139
"to the authoritative legal order.
2081
02:41:09,277 --> 02:41:11,507
"To ask only what the law is...
2082
02:41:12,880 --> 02:41:15,781
"and not to ask
whether or not it is also justice. "
2083
02:41:16,818 --> 02:41:19,787
As a judge, I could do no other.
2084
02:41:20,788 --> 02:41:23,586
I believe Your Honors will find me...
2085
02:41:23,658 --> 02:41:25,148
and millions of Germans like me...
2086
02:41:25,226 --> 02:41:28,127
who believed they were doing their duty
to their country...
2087
02:41:28,930 --> 02:41:31,660
to be not guilty.
2088
02:41:36,804 --> 02:41:40,171
The defendant Werner Lammpe
may address the tribunal.
2089
02:41:48,082 --> 02:41:49,515
Your Honors...
2090
02:42:21,883 --> 02:42:25,080
The defendant Ernst Janning
may address the tribunal.
2091
02:42:35,463 --> 02:42:38,626
I have nothing to add to what I have said.
2092
02:42:49,677 --> 02:42:51,645
The testimony has been received
in the case.
2093
02:42:51,712 --> 02:42:53,270
Final arguments have been heard.
2094
02:42:53,347 --> 02:42:57,909
There remains nothing now but the task
of the tribunal to render its decision.
2095
02:42:59,253 --> 02:43:02,154
The tribunal will recess
until further notification.
2096
02:43:24,378 --> 02:43:27,142
I've collected
several precedents and arguments here...
2097
02:43:27,215 --> 02:43:31,845
that have a bearing on the basis of the case,
which is, of course, the conflict between...
2098
02:43:31,919 --> 02:43:35,650
allegiance to international law
and to the laws of one's own country.
2099
02:43:38,359 --> 02:43:41,294
We have a mountain of material
to go over here.
2100
02:43:41,362 --> 02:43:43,296
What are you looking at, Dan?
2101
02:43:44,465 --> 02:43:49,300
I was looking at some of these pictures
attached to the warrants for arrest.
2102
02:43:49,370 --> 02:43:50,667
What pictures?
2103
02:43:52,573 --> 02:43:55,838
There's Petersen,
before they operated on him.
2104
02:43:56,477 --> 02:44:01,210
And here's Irene Hoffman.
She really was 16 once, wasn't she?
2105
02:44:03,017 --> 02:44:04,644
Feldenstein.
2106
02:44:07,021 --> 02:44:11,515
And here's the situation of a boy,
certainly couldn't have been more than 14.
2107
02:44:12,293 --> 02:44:15,456
Executed for saying things
against the Third Reich.
2108
02:44:15,529 --> 02:44:18,498
"By order of Justice Friedrich Hoffstetter. "
2109
02:44:19,433 --> 02:44:23,494
If I may say so, more pertinent
to the legal basis of the case...
2110
02:44:23,871 --> 02:44:26,339
I have the opening address
of the French prosecutor...
2111
02:44:26,407 --> 02:44:29,137
before the International Military Tribunal.
2112
02:44:29,210 --> 02:44:32,737
"It is obvious that in the state organized
along modern lines...
2113
02:44:32,813 --> 02:44:37,375
"responsibility is confined
to those who act directly for the state.
2114
02:44:37,451 --> 02:44:41,410
"Since they alone are in a position to judge
the legitimacy of the given orders...
2115
02:44:41,489 --> 02:44:43,753
"they alone can be prosecuted. "
2116
02:44:43,824 --> 02:44:48,124
I have another
from Prof. Jahrreiss' legal aspects...
2117
02:44:48,195 --> 02:44:50,356
Trial of the Major War Criminals.
2118
02:44:50,431 --> 02:44:54,834
On the basis of these, I don't see
where the prosecution has put forth...
2119
02:44:54,902 --> 02:44:59,498
a really clear-cut case against the defense
pertaining to the charges in the indictment.
2120
02:44:59,573 --> 02:45:01,200
Regardless of the acts committed...
2121
02:45:01,275 --> 02:45:04,767
we cannot make the interpretation
that these defendants...
2122
02:45:04,845 --> 02:45:08,178
are really responsible
for crimes against humanity.
2123
02:45:11,152 --> 02:45:12,517
What do you think, Dan?
2124
02:45:12,586 --> 02:45:16,522
We've been going over these points all day.
If it isn't clear now...
2125
02:45:18,526 --> 02:45:21,222
Aren't you going to look
at these precedents?
2126
02:45:21,595 --> 02:45:23,756
Aren't you interested at all?
2127
02:45:26,133 --> 02:45:28,465
Yes, I'm interested, Curtiss.
2128
02:45:29,236 --> 02:45:31,568
You were speaking of crimes
against humanity...
2129
02:45:31,639 --> 02:45:34,836
saying that the defendants
were not responsible for their acts.
2130
02:45:34,909 --> 02:45:37,070
I'd like you to explain that to me.
2131
02:45:37,945 --> 02:45:41,108
- I've just been explaining it.
- Maybe.
2132
02:45:41,182 --> 02:45:45,619
But all I've heard is a lot
of legalistic double-talk and rationalization.
2133
02:45:46,654 --> 02:45:50,283
You know, Curtiss,
when I first became a judge...
2134
02:45:50,358 --> 02:45:54,089
I knew there were certain people in town
I wasn't supposed to touch.
2135
02:45:54,161 --> 02:45:57,494
I knew that if I was to remain a judge,
this was so.
2136
02:45:59,300 --> 02:46:02,633
But how in God's name
do you expect me to look the other way...
2137
02:46:02,703 --> 02:46:04,227
at the murder of six million people?
2138
02:46:04,305 --> 02:46:05,772
I'm sure he didn't mean that.
2139
02:46:05,840 --> 02:46:08,035
I'm not asking you
to look the other way at them.
2140
02:46:08,109 --> 02:46:12,170
I'm asking you, what good is it going to do
to pursue this policy?
2141
02:46:14,949 --> 02:46:19,079
Curtiss, you were saying that the men
are not responsible for their acts.
2142
02:46:19,653 --> 02:46:21,848
You're going to have to explain that to me.
2143
02:46:21,922 --> 02:46:24,755
You're going to have to explain it
very carefully.
2144
02:46:32,633 --> 02:46:34,624
The tribunal is now in session.
2145
02:46:34,702 --> 02:46:38,365
God bless the United States of America
and this honorable tribunal.
2146
02:46:59,727 --> 02:47:02,992
The trial conducted before this tribunal
began over eight months ago.
2147
02:47:03,064 --> 02:47:06,898
The record of evidence
is more than 10,000 pages long...
2148
02:47:07,535 --> 02:47:10,834
and final arguments of counsel
have been concluded.
2149
02:47:13,741 --> 02:47:17,973
Simple murders and atrocities
do not constitute...
2150
02:47:18,045 --> 02:47:20,775
the gravamen of the charges
in this indictment.
2151
02:47:21,816 --> 02:47:25,308
Rather, the charge
is that of conscious participation...
2152
02:47:27,221 --> 02:47:30,952
in a nationwide,
government-organized system...
2153
02:47:31,025 --> 02:47:33,084
of cruelty and injustice...
2154
02:47:33,828 --> 02:47:37,127
in violation
of every moral and legal principle...
2155
02:47:37,198 --> 02:47:39,496
known to all civilized nations.
2156
02:47:41,469 --> 02:47:45,906
The tribunal
has carefully studied the record...
2157
02:47:45,973 --> 02:47:47,838
and found therein...
2158
02:47:47,908 --> 02:47:51,309
abundant evidence to support...
2159
02:47:51,879 --> 02:47:54,541
beyond a reasonable doubt...
2160
02:47:54,615 --> 02:47:57,049
the charges against these defendants.
2161
02:48:08,596 --> 02:48:10,029
Herr Rolfe...
2162
02:48:10,898 --> 02:48:13,458
in his very skillful defense...
2163
02:48:14,135 --> 02:48:17,901
has asserted that there are others...
2164
02:48:19,039 --> 02:48:22,270
who must share the ultimate responsibility...
2165
02:48:22,343 --> 02:48:24,573
for what happened here in Germany.
2166
02:48:24,645 --> 02:48:26,545
There is truth in this.
2167
02:48:28,015 --> 02:48:32,042
The real complaining party at the bar
in this courtroom...
2168
02:48:32,119 --> 02:48:33,950
is civilization.
2169
02:48:35,823 --> 02:48:38,587
But the tribunal does say...
2170
02:48:38,659 --> 02:48:42,925
that the men in the dock
are responsible for their actions.
2171
02:48:45,900 --> 02:48:48,767
Men who sat in black robes...
2172
02:48:50,938 --> 02:48:53,736
in judgment on other men.
2173
02:48:56,143 --> 02:48:57,940
Men who took part...
2174
02:48:59,346 --> 02:49:02,975
in the enactment of laws and decrees...
2175
02:49:05,653 --> 02:49:09,384
the purpose of which
was the extermination of human beings.
2176
02:49:09,790 --> 02:49:12,623
Men who, in executive positions...
2177
02:49:13,227 --> 02:49:17,789
actively participated
in the enforcement of these laws...
2178
02:49:18,399 --> 02:49:21,698
illegal even under German law.
2179
02:49:28,075 --> 02:49:30,305
The principle...
2180
02:49:30,377 --> 02:49:34,905
of criminal law in every civilized society...
2181
02:49:34,982 --> 02:49:36,813
has this in common:
2182
02:49:38,953 --> 02:49:43,686
Any person who sways another
to commit murder...
2183
02:49:45,593 --> 02:49:47,857
any person who furnishes...
2184
02:49:48,796 --> 02:49:52,163
the lethal weapon
for the purpose of the crime...
2185
02:49:53,400 --> 02:49:56,961
any person
who is an accessory to the crime...
2186
02:49:58,839 --> 02:50:00,170
is guilty.
2187
02:50:04,912 --> 02:50:06,345
Herr Rolfe...
2188
02:50:08,215 --> 02:50:11,378
further asserts that the defendant Janning...
2189
02:50:13,287 --> 02:50:15,551
was an extraordinary jurist...
2190
02:50:15,623 --> 02:50:18,956
and acted in what he thought
was the best interest of his country.
2191
02:50:19,026 --> 02:50:21,187
There is truth in this also.
2192
02:50:23,330 --> 02:50:25,230
Janning, to be sure...
2193
02:50:26,567 --> 02:50:28,262
is a tragic figure.
2194
02:50:28,469 --> 02:50:31,199
We believe he loathed the evil he did.
2195
02:50:32,306 --> 02:50:35,742
But compassion
for the present torture of his soul...
2196
02:50:35,809 --> 02:50:38,004
must not beget forgetfulness...
2197
02:50:38,078 --> 02:50:42,538
of the torture and the death of millions
by the government of which he was a part.
2198
02:50:44,852 --> 02:50:46,752
Janning's record and his fate...
2199
02:50:46,820 --> 02:50:50,722
illuminate the most shattering truth
that has emerged from this trial.
2200
02:50:51,258 --> 02:50:56,161
If he and all of the other defendants
had been degraded perverts...
2201
02:50:56,730 --> 02:50:58,960
if all of the leaders of the Third Reich...
2202
02:50:59,033 --> 02:51:02,400
had been sadistic monsters and maniacs...
2203
02:51:03,103 --> 02:51:07,335
then these events
would have no more moral significance...
2204
02:51:07,408 --> 02:51:10,900
than an earthquake,
or any other natural catastrophe.
2205
02:51:10,978 --> 02:51:13,105
But this trial has shown...
2206
02:51:14,114 --> 02:51:16,446
that under a national crisis...
2207
02:51:17,451 --> 02:51:20,716
ordinary, even able and extraordinary men...
2208
02:51:22,323 --> 02:51:25,690
can delude themselves
into the commission of crimes...
2209
02:51:26,427 --> 02:51:29,726
so vast and heinous
that they beggar the imagination.
2210
02:51:29,797 --> 02:51:33,289
No one who has sat through the trial
can ever forget them.
2211
02:51:34,401 --> 02:51:37,234
Men sterilized because of political belief.
2212
02:51:38,138 --> 02:51:40,971
A mockery made of friendship and faith.
2213
02:51:41,608 --> 02:51:43,473
The murder of children.
2214
02:51:44,912 --> 02:51:46,903
How easily it can happen.
2215
02:51:48,882 --> 02:51:51,112
There are those in our own country, too...
2216
02:51:51,185 --> 02:51:53,949
who today speak
of the protection of country...
2217
02:51:54,021 --> 02:51:55,750
of survival.
2218
02:51:55,823 --> 02:51:59,350
A decision must be made
in the life of every nation...
2219
02:51:59,426 --> 02:52:03,362
at the very moment
when the grasp of the enemy is at its throat.
2220
02:52:03,430 --> 02:52:07,594
Then it seems that the only way to survive
is to use the means of the enemy...
2221
02:52:07,668 --> 02:52:11,570
to rest survival upon what is expedient,
to look the other way.
2222
02:52:14,842 --> 02:52:18,539
The answer to that is: Survival as what?
2223
02:52:19,947 --> 02:52:24,384
A country isn't a rock.
It's not an extension of one's self.
2224
02:52:25,152 --> 02:52:27,279
It's what it stands for.
2225
02:52:27,354 --> 02:52:31,814
It's what it stands for when standing
for something is the most difficult.
2226
02:52:35,763 --> 02:52:38,231
Before the people of the world...
2227
02:52:38,899 --> 02:52:40,799
let it now be noted...
2228
02:52:42,236 --> 02:52:45,637
that here in our decision,
this is what we stand for:
2229
02:52:46,874 --> 02:52:48,171
Justice...
2230
02:52:48,909 --> 02:52:50,069
truth...
2231
02:52:52,479 --> 02:52:55,107
and the value of a single human being.
2232
02:53:06,260 --> 02:53:09,991
The marshal will produce
before the tribunal the defendant Hahn.
2233
02:53:13,033 --> 02:53:14,261
Emil Hahn...
2234
02:53:14,902 --> 02:53:19,362
the tribunal finds you guilty
and sentences you to life imprisonment.
2235
02:53:19,807 --> 02:53:23,470
Today you sentence me.
Tomorrow the Bolsheviks sentence you.
2236
02:53:30,184 --> 02:53:34,280
The marshal will produce the defendant
Hoffstetter before the tribunal.
2237
02:53:38,058 --> 02:53:39,719
Friedrich Hoffstetter...
2238
02:53:40,194 --> 02:53:44,426
the tribunal finds you guilty
and sentences you to life imprisonment.
2239
02:53:49,136 --> 02:53:53,630
The marshal will produce
the defendant Lammpe before the tribunal.
2240
02:53:59,446 --> 02:54:00,970
Werner Lammpe...
2241
02:54:02,850 --> 02:54:05,478
the tribunal finds you guilty...
2242
02:54:05,552 --> 02:54:08,282
and sentences you to life imprisonment.
2243
02:54:18,265 --> 02:54:22,861
The marshal will produce the defendant
Ernst Janning before the tribunal.
2244
02:54:38,352 --> 02:54:40,149
Ernst Janning...
2245
02:54:41,688 --> 02:54:44,657
the tribunal finds you guilty...
2246
02:54:44,725 --> 02:54:47,421
and sentences you to life imprisonment.
2247
02:54:52,966 --> 02:54:54,934
He doesn't understand.
2248
02:54:56,236 --> 02:54:58,602
He just doesn't understand.
2249
02:54:59,172 --> 02:55:00,901
He understands.
2250
02:55:14,888 --> 02:55:16,856
Justice Ives dissenting.
2251
02:55:19,626 --> 02:55:22,151
I wish to point out strongly...
2252
02:55:22,229 --> 02:55:25,460
my dissenting vote
from the decision of this tribunal...
2253
02:55:25,532 --> 02:55:29,696
as stated by Justice Haywood,
and in which Justice Norris concurred.
2254
02:55:31,538 --> 02:55:34,405
The issue of the actions of the defendants...
2255
02:55:34,474 --> 02:55:38,410
who believed they were acting
in the best interests of their country...
2256
02:55:38,912 --> 02:55:42,473
is an issue that cannot be decided
in a courtroom alone.
2257
02:55:44,484 --> 02:55:47,510
It can only be decided objectively...
2258
02:55:47,588 --> 02:55:51,786
in years to come,
in the true perspective of history.
2259
02:55:59,633 --> 02:56:01,794
Where shall I put these books, Your Honor?
2260
02:56:01,868 --> 02:56:03,733
Put them in the trunk.
2261
02:56:07,307 --> 02:56:11,437
Your Honor, here's something for you
to have on the plane.
2262
02:56:11,511 --> 02:56:14,537
No. If you give me any more food,
Mrs. Halbestadt...
2263
02:56:14,615 --> 02:56:16,640
I won't have any room for anything else.
2264
02:56:16,717 --> 02:56:18,912
But it's strudel, the way you like it.
2265
02:56:18,986 --> 02:56:21,079
Thank you for everything.
2266
02:56:22,889 --> 02:56:24,823
- I'll put it in the car for you.
- Thanks.
2267
02:56:24,891 --> 02:56:26,950
Tickets, passport, immunization.
All in order.
2268
02:56:27,027 --> 02:56:30,258
I'll have your baggage checks
and boarding pass at the airport.
2269
02:56:30,330 --> 02:56:32,798
- See you there no later than 3:00.
- Right.
2270
02:56:32,866 --> 02:56:35,733
And give my regards
to Miss what-was-her-name?
2271
02:56:35,802 --> 02:56:37,667
Scheffler. Elsa.
2272
02:56:38,238 --> 02:56:40,798
- That's one you owe me.
- What do you mean?
2273
02:56:40,874 --> 02:56:44,037
Americans aren't very popular
in Nuremberg this morning.
2274
02:57:45,505 --> 02:57:48,065
- Good afternoon, Your Honor.
- Good afternoon.
2275
02:57:49,810 --> 02:57:54,213
I came here at the request
of my client, Ernst Janning.
2276
02:57:56,249 --> 02:57:58,080
He wishes to see you.
2277
02:57:59,019 --> 02:58:01,214
I'm just leaving for the airport.
2278
02:58:02,889 --> 02:58:06,620
He says it would mean a great deal to him.
2279
02:58:12,899 --> 02:58:16,300
Have you heard about the verdict
in the I.G. Farben case?
2280
02:58:17,003 --> 02:58:20,734
Most of them were acquitted.
The others received light sentences.
2281
02:58:21,608 --> 02:58:23,041
The verdict came in today.
2282
02:58:23,110 --> 02:58:24,873
No, I hadn't heard.
2283
02:58:26,046 --> 02:58:27,809
I will make you a wager.
2284
02:58:28,682 --> 02:58:30,274
I don't make wagers.
2285
02:58:31,351 --> 02:58:33,114
A gentleman's wager.
2286
02:58:34,454 --> 02:58:36,445
In five years...
2287
02:58:36,523 --> 02:58:40,323
the men you sentenced
to life imprisonment will be free.
2288
02:58:43,196 --> 02:58:47,428
Herr Rolfe, I have admired your work
in the courtroom for many months.
2289
02:58:48,101 --> 02:58:51,400
You are particularly brilliant
in your use of logic.
2290
02:58:53,640 --> 02:58:56,404
So what you suggest may very well happen.
2291
02:58:57,177 --> 02:59:00,704
It is logical,
in view of the times in which we live.
2292
02:59:02,482 --> 02:59:04,916
But to be logical is not to be right.
2293
02:59:05,886 --> 02:59:08,980
And nothing on God's earth
could ever make it right.
2294
02:59:20,133 --> 02:59:21,760
Someone to see you.
2295
02:59:34,314 --> 02:59:35,713
Herr Janning.
2296
02:59:37,851 --> 02:59:39,113
Judge Haywood.
2297
02:59:41,588 --> 02:59:44,113
Please, sit down.
2298
02:59:44,524 --> 02:59:47,357
Thank you. You wanted to see me?
2299
02:59:48,094 --> 02:59:51,427
Yes. There is something I want to give you.
2300
02:59:52,566 --> 02:59:53,863
A record.
2301
02:59:56,069 --> 02:59:57,900
A record of my cases.
2302
02:59:58,705 --> 03:00:00,263
The ones I remember.
2303
03:00:01,474 --> 03:00:04,637
I want to give them to someone I can trust...
2304
03:00:05,412 --> 03:00:08,609
someone I felt I got to know during the trial.
2305
03:00:15,222 --> 03:00:16,450
Thank you.
2306
03:00:19,426 --> 03:00:21,417
I'll take good care of them.
2307
03:00:21,995 --> 03:00:25,522
I know the pressures
that have been brought upon you.
2308
03:00:26,900 --> 03:00:28,891
You will be criticized greatly.
2309
03:00:29,402 --> 03:00:31,870
Your decision will not be a popular one.
2310
03:00:34,708 --> 03:00:37,040
But if it means anything to you...
2311
03:00:38,111 --> 03:00:42,514
you have the respect
of at least one of the men you convicted.
2312
03:00:43,750 --> 03:00:46,480
By all that is right in this world...
2313
03:00:46,553 --> 03:00:49,522
your verdict was a just one.
2314
03:00:51,191 --> 03:00:52,419
Thank you.
2315
03:00:54,728 --> 03:00:58,186
What you said in the courtroom,
it needed to be said.
2316
03:00:59,165 --> 03:01:00,462
Judge Haywood...
2317
03:01:04,337 --> 03:01:06,567
the reason I asked you to come...
2318
03:01:14,281 --> 03:01:15,771
Those people...
2319
03:01:17,350 --> 03:01:19,079
those millions of people...
2320
03:01:20,954 --> 03:01:23,354
I never knew it would come to that.
2321
03:01:24,491 --> 03:01:26,015
You must believe it.
2322
03:01:31,731 --> 03:01:33,130
Herr Janning...
2323
03:01:35,101 --> 03:01:38,559
it came to that the first time
you sentenced a man to death...
2324
03:01:38,638 --> 03:01:40,469
you knew to be innocent.